BGTSCC Discord BGTSCC IRC

Server Address: game.bgtscc.net
61/96
Last counter update:
2018-11-15 23:44:04



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 5:34 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:05 pm
Posts: 2835
Changes already implemented. Changes suggested.

Abjuration
  • Abjuration focus increases the maximum cap on dispel spells by +1
  • Greater Abjuration focus increases the maximum cap on dispel spells by +2
  • Epic Abjuration focus increases the maximum cap of dispel spells by +4


Conjuration
  • Conjuration focus grants +1 HD.
  • Greater Conjuration focus grants a total of +2 HD.
  • Epic Conjuration focus grants a total of +4 HD.
  • Red Wizard Spec: Conjuration grants +1 HD.


Divination
  • Divination focus increases Power Word HP caps by +10
  • Greater Divination focus increases Power Word HP caps by +20
  • Epic Divination focus increases Power Word HP caps by +40


Enchantment
  • Enchantment focus grants +1 bonus to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Taunt skills
  • Greater Enchantment focus grants +2 bonus to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Taunt skills
  • Epic Enchantment focus grants +4 bonus to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Taunt skills


Evocation
  • Evocation Focus increases Evocation spell damage dice total by +1
  • Greater Evocation increases Evocation spell damage dice total by +2
  • Epic Evocation focus increases Evocation spell damage dice total by +4


Illusion
  • Glass Doppelganger: Creatures with more hit dice than 15 + 2 * 'number of spell focus feats' are deleveled to that nuber of hit dice.


Necromancy
  • Spellfocus Necromancy: +1 HD
  • Greater Spellfocus Necromancy: +1 HD
  • Red Wizard Specialist (Necromancy only): +1 HD
  • Epic Spellfocus Necromancy: +2 HD


Transmutation
  • Transmutation focus grants +1 AC to polymorph and shapechange forms.
  • Greater Transmutation focus grants a total of +2 AC to polymorph and shapechange forms.
  • Epic Transmutation focus grants a total of +4 AC to polymorph and shapechange forms.
  • Red Wizard Spec: Transmutation grants +1 AC to polymorph and shapechange forms.
  • Augment Form feat that changes low BAB progression to medium BAB progression when underneath a polymorph or a shapchange form.



Any thoughts, any comments?

_________________
" I am no longer here, the elves of the Sword Coast are just far too horrible... "

- Elminster, probably.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 5:48 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2011 2:25 pm
Posts: 4027
How would the evokation suggestions interact with low-cap spells, spells with multiple types of rolls and hit die?

_________________
"The desire to build a house is the tired wish of a man content with a single anchorage. The desire to build a boat is the desire of youth, unwilling yet to accept the idea of a final resting place."
"The wind and the waves are always on the side of the ablest navigator."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 6:27 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:05 pm
Posts: 2835
Hoihe wrote:
How would the evokation suggestions interact with low-cap spells, spells with multiple types of rolls and hit die?

That is a good point. But I think those spells tend to be from other schools than evocation. Evocation spells tend to end up with static total damage dices.

But let us take a look at the exceptoions, like magic missile for example. I suppose it would just gain additional projectiles. Therefore an evocation specialist would get up to 13 projectiles. With missile storms, I think the cap per target will remain the same, but number of projectiles would increase.

But in case of something like the Moonblade, I guess it would end doing something like... '6d8 + 30' per hit instead of '2d8 + 30' per hit.

_________________
" I am no longer here, the elves of the Sword Coast are just far too horrible... "

- Elminster, probably.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 9:08 am 
Online
Quality Control

Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:55 pm
Posts: 8337
My personal opinions which in no way should be taken as representing the position of Staff or Management of BGtSCC. 0:)

Sun Wukong wrote:
Abjuration
Abjuration focus increases the maximum cap on dispel spells by +1
Greater Abjuration focus increases the maximum cap on dispel spells by +2
Epic Abjuration focus increases the maximum cap of dispel spells by +4


I'm not a big fan of this as it would only impact PvP. There are already breaches and Mords so making Dispels better would be quite empowering. Not to mention that in order to increase the max CL you have to increase the bonus, which would make it easier to dispel (i.e. d20 + 24 vs. 11+ CL means a CL30 caster will be dispelled by Abjurer 20% on a Greater Dispel, Mords will basically strip them bare regardless, but a level 6 spell vs. level 9 spell...

Sun Wukong wrote:
Divination
Divination focus increases Power Word HP caps by +10
Greater Divination focus increases Power Word HP caps by +20
Epic Divination focus increases Power Word HP caps by +40


I would be ok with this, but would need to look at how it interacts with the custom spell that increases the HP thresholds. Again, due to the astronomical HP PvE enemies have this would essentially be a PvP change so would prefer finding some other way to improve upon Divination.

Sun Wukong wrote:
Enchantment
Enchantment focus grants +1 bonus to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Taunt skills
Greater Enchantment focus grants +2 bonus to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Taunt skills
Epic Enchantment focus grants +4 bonus to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Taunt skills


How does focusing in a spell casting school improve your ability to make friends and influence people? Enchantment is already a decent focus for dominate Monster, though the limitations are unfortunate. Would be cool if there was a way to make Dominate Monster kill off the PvE enemy and re-create it as a 'bonus slot' summon or cohort or whatever so that it could follow through transitions.

Sun Wukong wrote:
Evocation
Evocation Focus increases Evocation spell damage dice total by +1
Greater Evocation increases Evocation spell damage dice total by +2
Epic Evocation focus increases Evocation spell damage dice total by +4


I like it. Mobs HP are too high and even PC's always have max HPs so giving some bonus damage will help, though still not fully bridge the gap. I would argue it shouldn't apply to all spells though as Evocation is still top notch in PvP thanks to Bigby/IGMS "tactic" used by most casters. Though smart players are able to counter this completely making the damage dice bonus irrelevant. Either way it is a relatively small bump.

TL;DR - I like the thoughts, but not necessarily the approach. Improving Spell Schools needs to be done with a consideration for avoiding things that won't help in PvE and are just PvP bumps. Caster Wizards are already top dogs in PvP.

_________________
Chord Silverstrings - Bard and OSR Squire / Tarent Nefzen - Arcane Wand Merchant and Master Alchemist / Irrace Arkentlar - Drow Adventurer / Finneaus Du'Veil - Gem Merchant and Executive Officer of SCCE

Tarent's Wands and Elixirs

A Wand Crafter's guide to using wands


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 9:48 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:05 pm
Posts: 2835
The abjuration is PvP related I guess, but for arcanists that is two pre-epic feats and one epic feat wasted - when you could just increase your caster level and gain better PRC perks. In my mind it would largely just boost dispels for the Clerics/Druids/Bards who lack Mords and Breaches.

As for the Arcanist, they already have uncapped Mords. But I suppose someone who goes for the Master of Abjuration could find some RP flavour out of it.

Oh... I just realised that perhaps I did not state it clearly that the boost would only adjust Lesser Dispel, Dispel, and Greater Dispells. Mords are already uncapped and there are many PRCs that increase caster level and so on.



As for the Divination Power Words:
Inhundyl's Primer - has the effect of -50 HP when it comes to HP check and Power Words.
Anthilar's bane - halves the target's HP when it comes to HP check and Power Words.

Therefore, the combination of suggested perks would mean that... Power Word Kill could instantly kill anyone with less than 140 HP. I do not know which applies first, Inhundyl's or Anthilar's, or if they even work together...

If those two spells do not work together:
- Power Word Kill would slay anything with only 190 (Inhundyl's) or 280 (Anthilar's) HP.

If Inhundyl's is applied before Anthilar's, I gues it would be like this:
- Power Word Kill would slay anything with only 330 HP.

If Anthilar's is applied before Inhundyl's, I gues it would be like this:
- Power Word Kill would slay anything with only 380 HP.

_________________
" I am no longer here, the elves of the Sword Coast are just far too horrible... "

- Elminster, probably.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:42 pm
Posts: 700
Location: Azkaban
I think illusion needs more. How about letting a caster cast color spray additional times per a day with each feat? Spell focus x1. Greater spell focus x2. Epic x3.

_________________
Jessie Neige - Cleric of Auril

Lockonnow wrote:
greatest fear like the movie Hellraiser they show you what you most fear and take a Image of IT


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:31 pm 
Offline
Lead Programmer
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2011 5:07 pm
Posts: 8371
Location: France, GMT +2
I like the evocation changes except I would likely have to go through loads of scripts, enchantment changes seem rather anecdotal and the abjuration one is too PvP focused to be of much use. Divination looks fine to me.

_________________
Mealir Ostirel - Incorrigible swashbuckler


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:56 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:24 pm
Posts: 1925
Location: California
For illusion, you could increase the durations of all spells by +1, +2, or +4 caster levels.

So glass doppelganger would essentially last an extra two rounds for greater spell focus.

_________________
Akurion Stormedge - "The Storm"
Druegar Grizzleclaw - The Mountain Ruin Tsar
Akroma Thuul - The Creepy Enchanter
Liliana Duskblade - The B*tch of Bane


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 2:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2011 2:25 pm
Posts: 4027
Would there be any opposition to simply "on paper" bonuses? For example, giving Epic Divination focus the ability to pierce lead or other kinds of anti-divination mechanisms. This would purely be for DM events.

_________________
"The desire to build a house is the tired wish of a man content with a single anchorage. The desire to build a boat is the desire of youth, unwilling yet to accept the idea of a final resting place."
"The wind and the waves are always on the side of the ablest navigator."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 3:28 pm 
Online
Quality Control

Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:55 pm
Posts: 8337
Empowering illusion has to be a joke, right??? One of the best DC schools along with having the best defensive buffs for a caster, oh and having a PRC that gives it special bonuses and it's own teleport spell... Having played two illusion focused casters (one to 30 as a HiPS mage and the other ~24 as a sort of gish type) I would argue Illusion is not far behind Necromancy in usefulness.

- Bladeweave is a VASTLY underrated spell that any gish should have up almost all the time when expecting heavy combat.
- Mass Blindness/Deafness is a level 8 spell, fortitude save, not blocked by immunity to mind affecting!
- Solipsism, level 7 spell, will save, but immunity to mind affecting blocks. However, since it only allows one save it is superior to the Hold line of spells which allow save every round.
- Displacement, Mirror Images, Ethereal Visage, Shadowshield, Shades....Ummmm, yeah.
- Glass Doppleganger, Shadow Simulacrum....ROFLMAO.

Illusion is one of my favorite schools because it is very close and in some ways better than necromancy, but most only consider it as a school you don't want to give up, but also that isn't good to focus in...the reverse is true, it's a fantastic school to focus in for a DC mage. Necromancy is all fortitude and all blocked by Deathward, which everyone has. Now, I'm not arguing Illusion IS better, just that it's better in some ways... Necromancy still has amazing no save spells like Energy Drain, best summons you can get, etc....but then Illusion is not consenting to PvP when they cast some of their best spells...

_________________
Chord Silverstrings - Bard and OSR Squire / Tarent Nefzen - Arcane Wand Merchant and Master Alchemist / Irrace Arkentlar - Drow Adventurer / Finneaus Du'Veil - Gem Merchant and Executive Officer of SCCE

Tarent's Wands and Elixirs

A Wand Crafter's guide to using wands


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 4:54 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:42 pm
Posts: 700
Location: Azkaban
Yeah but if you can cast color spray more you can have more fun.

_________________
Jessie Neige - Cleric of Auril

Lockonnow wrote:
greatest fear like the movie Hellraiser they show you what you most fear and take a Image of IT


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 5:56 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 2175
Location: GMT-4
Illusion duration would be better than raising it's DC,it's pretty OP.

_________________
Vithsiris Helvi'viir Heretic Drow
Short Stories
- - -
AoS Player Tools
Logon Issue/Resources


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 6:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:24 pm
Posts: 1925
Location: California
Aspect of Sorrow wrote:
Illusion duration would be better than raising it's DC,it's pretty OP.

That's what I was thinking. DC on that Weird spell wouldn't be so nasty, but it would buff things like invisibility, doppelganger, and shadow simulacrum.

_________________
Akurion Stormedge - "The Storm"
Druegar Grizzleclaw - The Mountain Ruin Tsar
Akroma Thuul - The Creepy Enchanter
Liliana Duskblade - The B*tch of Bane


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:42 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:05 pm
Posts: 2835
Valefort wrote:
I like the evocation changes except I would likely have to go through loads of scripts, enchantment changes seem rather anecdotal and the abjuration one is too PvP focused to be of much use. Divination looks fine to me.

Enchantment: There is only a limited number of enchantment spells and enchantment school is usually about affecting the minds of others, influencing or controlling their behavior... Thus you also get better at affecting the minds of others, influencing or controlling their behavior without your spells? Namely, you get skill bonus to 'social skills' - - -

But as for a more mechanical suggestion: How about if the Enchantment Focus would actually reduce how often targets of the 'Hold' line of spells get to make their will saves?

Focus: Every second round,
Greater Focus: Every third round,
Epic Focus: Every fourth round?


As for Abjuration:
Focus: Globe of Invulnerability and Lesser Globe of Invulnerability will provide immunity to additional level of spells.
Greater Focus: Globe of Invulnerability and Lesser Globe of Invulnerability will provide immunity to two additional levels of spells.
Epic Focus: Globe of Invulnerability and Lesser Globe of Invulnerability will provide immunity to four additional levels of spells.

Therefore, a character with Epic Spell Focus in Abjuration would gain immunity up to 8th level spells through Globe of Invulnerability?

_________________
" I am no longer here, the elves of the Sword Coast are just far too horrible... "

- Elminster, probably.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Spell Focus Buffs.
Unread postPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:35 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2015 1:48 pm
Posts: 1198
Location: Concord, N.H., USSA
Quote:
Therefore, a character with Epic Spell Focus in Abjuration would gain immunity up to 8th level spells through Globe of Invulnerability?


Sounds good to me, ill take it. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

_________________
"To understand magic one must first understand magic."








Agathion Benedictus: Holy Priest. Retired for now.
Tiax Rules-All: Gnomish madman. Retired permanently.
Exordius Vrass: Cleric/Mage. Currently active.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group