Bear shape / Unarmored Strike / More questions

[Bern_the_irelander]

Howdy der yet again, laddies n lassies

I'm planning to make a druid lvl 30, and i'm gonna focus my RP around the bear shape of my character, but there's one question that i have before i start - when my character is using bear shape, feats like weapon focus unarmedstrike, improved unarmedstrike and improved critical unarmedstrike, do still work while shapeshifted?

What would be a fair decent starting abilities score with a character that is going to make his fights almost/always in the bear shape, given the fact that STR,DEX and CON are going to suffer changes in their values while one is shapeshifted.

Is Oaken resilience worth it?

When one shapeshifts into the bear shape, does one retains the armor, shield, deflection and dodge bonuses from items? If so, how does this work (what is the math)?

What are good feats for a fighting druid using the bear shape all along?


Lotsa questions, i know. If thou can answer any one of these i would be much appreciated, in advance i thank you for reading so far here.

[Considerate_]

Hello Bern,

and welcome to our server! I'll try to answer at least some of your questions as best I can

when my character is using bear shape, feats like weapon focus unarmedstrike, improved unarmedstrike and improved critical unarmedstrike, do still work while shapeshifted?

I'm actually not certain about this one I'm afraid, I know for a fact it works for bearwarriors.

What would be a fair decent starting abilities score with a character that is going to make his fights almost/always in the bear shape, given the fact that STR,DEX and CON are going to suffer changes in their values while one is shapeshifted.

From a mechanical point of view, you don't need to worry about Strength, Dex or Con if you plan to be shapeshifted all the same as it will have no relevance. So you could focus on Int, Wisdom and Charisma if you want

Is Oaken resilience worth it?

Normally I would say no, because most dedicated shapeshifters would turn into an elemental or eventually a dragon, who have virtually all those immunities already. As a bear though... hmm, it might be, though you'd have to turn out of bear shape to recast it every ten minutes.

When one shapeshifts into the bear shape, does one retains the armor, shield, deflection and dodge bonuses from items? If so, how does this work (what is the math)?

-Armor bonuses will transfer in the following method and is automatically available for all druid shapes:
-The enhance bonus on your chest armor or the armor bonus on your bracers transfers as an armor enhance bonus.
- Half of the enhance bonus on your shield will transfer as a shield enhance bonus.
- The deflection AC bonus on your helm, cloak, or ring will transfer as a deflection AC bonus.
- The natural AC bonus on your necklace will transfer as a natural AC bonus.
- Flame Weapon works on all forms, and will be applied to all creature attacks. So for example a dire bear gets it on all 3 attacks.
- Bonuses from wearable items transfer, but not weapons.
Source: http://bgtscc.net/viewtopic.php?p=6#p6

What are good feats for a fighting druid using the bear shape all along?

If the answer to your first question is yes, then those feats! might be worth going 12 levels of fighter for specialized unnarmed damage feats etc, seeing as you don't plan on going dragon shape
Knock down and imp. knockdown can also be used while in animal shape as far as I'm aware, so those might be worth considering as well.


Other worthwhile Druid facts
Have a 2 minute cool down before they can re-summon their animal companion.
CANNOT cross-class with MONK.
Can cross class the perform skill.
Major revamp to wild shape.
* Magic Fang, Greater Magic Fang, and Jagged Tooth now work on all forms and companions (along with all other weapon buff spells)
* A fifth wild shape option was added called Big Cat.
* Dragon shape has been revamed and issue's fixed. You Dragon shape grow in power as you level up.
* Bronze Dragon shape added to Dragon Shape.
Your druid level determines the dragon shape strength.
The scaling is level 30 gets a 30HD dragon, level 29 & 28 uses a 28HD Dragon, and below level 28 uses a 25HD dragon.



I hope that proved helpful in answering at least some of your questions, good luck with your build!

[Styxwash]

That only goes for the Bearwarrior PRC, there's a special script enabling knockdown. Regular Wildshape and Polymorph will not let you use any abilities aside from Druid's Natural Casting in Wildshape ofc.

Taking some warrior levels might still be worthwhile though, if your never going to take advantage of Dragonshape on a pure druid build.

Knock down and imp. knockdown can also be used while in animal shape as far as I'm aware, so those might be worth considering as well.

Oaken Resilience may be worthwhile still in Dragonshape, since it doesn't have the most powerful immunity Oaken grants, which is Critical Immune.

Certainly worthwhile if you choose to never even use Elemental Shapes.

[Considerate_]

Just read up on it and you're correct about Knockdown and the like not working. My bad

Hidden: show

Elemental Wild Shape in the fully patched version of NWN, granted the druid the use of the elemental's extraordinary, supernatural, and spell-like abilities. NWN2 does not permit this but does include the elemental form immunities and resistances. The problem seems to stem from NWN2 turning off the quick-bar slots entirely. Thus, a Druid in NWN could use the special "Pulse" attacks of the elemental forms and a Monk/Druid could use Stunning Fist and Knockdown. This is not possible in NWN2.

Source: http://nwn2.wikia.com/wiki/Elemental_Wild_Shape


If you're immune to critical strikes, you're also immune to sneak attacks. Anyone know if this works in reverse as well? (due to faulty NWN2 programming) Because Dragons are immune to sneak attack. Even if they aren't though they can buff their AC so high that it'll be very difficult to land a blow, and impossible to confirm a critical hit for most monsters. Hence the 'virtual' comment I made

Just remember with Oak resilience, you'd have to shift out of your bear form every ten minutes, cast it, and change back into bear form to keep it active. I don't know if they've fixed it on this server, but didn't that normally mean you'd lose the Fang/Greater Fang buffs?

[Passiflora]

As far as I'm aware, I remember doing sneak attacks on the white dragon.

If you're immune to critical strikes, you're also immune to sneak attacks. Anyone know if this works in reverse as well? (due to faulty NWN2 programming) Because Dragons are immune to sneak attack.

[Considerate_]

Unless the Staff has changed something on the server, this is how dragon shape is supposed to work (I've marked the sneak immunity with bold):

Dragon Shape

Type of feat: Druid, Epic
Prerequisite: Character 21, Wisdom 29, Wild Shape 8x/day (requires 26 levels of druid)
Required for: Dragon Companion
Specifics: The character may use wild shape to change into a dragon. The transformation has a duration of 1 hour per class level.
Use: Selected (must choose which type of dragon)

Notes
The Red Dragon shape is the strongest of the three. The following stats are obtained from dragonform, -
STR 33 DEX 10 CON 23
2d8+1 damage
28 AC
150 temporary bonus hitpoints
+1 attack bonus
Immunity: Mind effects, Paralysis, Sneak attack
Spell Resistance 22
True Seeing
Racial type Dragon

Source: http://nwn2.wikia.com/wiki/Dragon_Shape

It is likely that the White Dragon isn't built off this template, as it's an NPC and not a druid

[Passiflora]

Probably!

[Styxwash]

A creature can be immune to sneak attacks, but not criticals. Critical immunity always confer sneak attack immunity though. (At any rate, you can still sneak attack a creature like that with Epic Precision ofc. for half damage) To clarify, Dragons are immune to sneak attack, but not criticals.

You will only lose Flame Weapon and Creature Keen when you change shape, not the Magic Fang. Oaken Resilience can be an annoyance to reapply every ten minutes indeed, but critical immunity is quite nice, even at the skyhigh AC's a druid can achieve.

[Bern_the_irelander]

Two questions still

I'm gonna use an example for the first one, here it goes:
Let us say Bernie is a druid lvl 5 with bear shape, and he's using a studded leather armor(a regular one with no enhancement bonuses) when in his original form(since he is no fan of metal stuff). When he turns into a bear, does the 3 AC belonging to the armor manifests into the final AC when he turns into a bear?

-A more straight approach, if my heavy shield and a studded leather armor are unenhanced, does the AC they grant shows in bear shape?


The second question is pretty much the first i asked, can someone confirm if weapon focus unarmed strike, improved critical unarmed strike and improved unarmed strike grant the respective advantages when fighting in bear shape?

PS: is it possible to flame weapon the bear's claws? or magic weapon it?

[Broham2]

First question - no. Only the enchantments carry over.

Not sure enough on the rest to tell you one way or another.

[Considerate_]

PS: is it possible to flame weapon the bear's claws? or magic weapon it?

You can Flame Weapon it and druids have something called Greater Magic Fang, which also works.

A cleric/favoured soul or wizard/sorcerer however, cannot use their Greater Magic Weapon on you.

[Styxwash]

The second question is pretty much the first i asked, can someone confirm if weapon focus unarmed strike, improved critical unarmed strike and improved unarmed strike grant the respective advantages when fighting in bear shape?

I'm almost 100% sure that Unarmed Strike feats were activated for Druids/Bearwarriors, when Bear Warrior was created. So you should be able to take those feats and get the bonuses while in all Druid shapes.

Here is the source -

http://bgtscc.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2 ... ed#p264218

Unarmed Strike should now carry for Druids wildshape (Rasael).

Also described in the Bearwarrior PRC -

http://bgtscc.net/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7826&start=15

- Weapon Focus Unarmed, Weapon Specialization Unarmed, as well as their Greater and Epic variants will work while in bear form on all your attacks. So if you have those feats, they transfer to bear form.

[Ichabod]

I can't speak to bear warrior or druid, but as a polymorphed magic user in troll form, weapon focus:unarmed didn't work, weapon spec:unarmed didn't work, improved critical: unarmed DID work, and weapon mastery:unarmed DID work.

Not sure if this helps your situation all that much, but maybe someone else will learn something useful from it.

You could try to put your build together in JEGS and see. It's a module which will let you build characters using most of the custom content from this server. You can, step by step, build your character to level 30 in about 10 minutes. I can't think of too many instances where JEGS misled me.

http://www.bgtscc.net/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=24402