Rogue/Assassin/Invisible Blade

[CrimsonMist]

I'm avoiding NWN2DB for now but can't work out on my spreadsheet how to fit PTWF, Epic Dodge, Epic Precision and Expose Weakness on a rogue alt with Asn8 and IB. I'm pretty sure Aaron worked this out once - but I might be misremembering!

Is it possible with a human/half elf PC?

[Valefort]

http://nwn2db.com/build/?272816

And drop blind fight if you pick half elf

[CrimsonMist]

Awesome, merci beaucoup, Vale!

[Deathgrowl]

Or this:
http://nwn2db.com/build/?175324

[Egg Shen]

Speaking of dropping blind fight, are there any known items that grant the blind fight feat? My UD main needs one if they exist.

[Marathados]

http://nwn2db.com/build/?272816

And drop blind fight if you pick half elf

Why drop blind fight on an half-elf?

[Valefort]

Because they have one feat less

[Marathados]

Ah, I see. Was just wondering as blind fight always has been a somewhat obligatory feat for me...

[Winterborne]

Sort of on topic, but can anyone find a way to do an Assassin or Dark lantern invisible blade build that also uses kukri and gets combat insight as an epic feat? I can't seem to fit all of that in one build but I am not the best builder.

[chad878262]

Only way is to give up something else. Epic Precision, Epic Prowess, Expose Weakness, Perfect TWF and Epic Dodge don't leave a lot of room to grab Combat Insight. Only way to do it would be to take another class that get's bonus feats, but then you lose epic dodge, which is inadvisable. You don't really need the INT to damage any way since your primary method of dealing damage is through sneak attacks.

Also, as an FYI Dark Lantern is not available on this server.

[Calodan]

As Chad said to get Combat Insight you have to drop other goodies almost always makes it so you can not take Epic Dodge and is not advisable unless you are using a class that grants something to help like AC in turn for it. Invisible Blade does just that. Getting up to 5 extra AC while wearing Clothing for armor. It basically makes up for the lack of a shield and then you get to also use a shield potion! So if looking at it that way you can get up to +10 AC from that alone. Since the only way to get more AC than MIthril Full Plate is a high DEX build you can really get tons more AC from this than you can a Fighter per say. Really you should be able to get up to 50AC with a sneak if you are using Invisible Blade with consumables. So I do not think Epic Dodge is a MUST take feat for EVERY sneak but it is powerful enough to make you consider it over say a IB Combat Insight PTWF build.

[Winterborne]

Yeah, currently I am running without Epic Dodge. It hasn't been an issue for me as I am usually in a group and I got a significant AB boost in return for giving it up (39 with mundane kukris while also having HIPS), but I sometimes wish I was able to be more self sufficient and not need as many consumables while solo, which is why I have been considering IB for the extra AC.

[Calodan]

Yeah, currently I am running without Epic Dodge. It hasn't been an issue for me as I am usually in a group and I got a significant AB boost in return for giving it up (39 with mundane kukris while also having HIPS), but I sometimes wish I was able to be more self sufficient and not need as many consumables while solo, which is why I have been considering IB for the extra AC.

Yeah one needs to get above 40 to really be effective and not get waxed from every hit a monster throws!

Really can get away with 45ish AC if you have ways to heal. I.E. Pots of regen and Pots in general. Rogues have a hard time carrying around enough consumables though along with needing to drag out a piece of armor now and again.

[Winterborne]

Yeah one needs to get above 40 to really be effective and not get waxed from every hit a monster throws!

Really can get away with 45ish AC if you have ways to heal. I.E. Pots of regen and Pots in general. Rogues have a hard time carrying around enough consumables though along with needing to drag out a piece of armor now and again.

I am sitting at 45AC with combat expertise up and the full load of consumables (Shield, Imp Mage Armor, Spiderskin, and unarmored, of course). Usually keeps me safe enough to get back into hiding while soloing, and I get a pretty regular number of Death Attack Paralyzes with the 4 attack flurry from stealth, so it works out okay, just trying to figure out if there's a better way. I'll probably stick to what I have now, I guess, as I do like the extra feats and stuff I get (I'm running 12 fighter/10 rogue/8 assassin). PTWF, Epic Precision, Expose Weakness, Combat Insight, Epic Weapon focus, and Slashing Weapon Specialization are where my damage and AB are mostly coming from, and combat insight really adds up when you get 10 attacks per round from PTWF (for me it's 6 dmg to every attack from my int mod, so 60 dmg/round) so I try and work it in wherever I can.

I was also considering maybe trying to work in WD or something else along those lines in the future for the same style of play/flavor with some more utility options but every time I try and rebuild from my current setup, I end up having to give up something I love. May as well stick to it I guess.

[chad878262]

You're really going to have to decide what you want if you try adding in Whirling Dervish or any other PRC... One thing to consider is that Fighter 12 is giving you a lot of feats and AB, but the damage is honestly negligible. +8 damage from Epic Weapon Specialization and Melee Mastery is roughly the same damage you might get from taking those 12 levels in Rogue or some other full sneak progression class. If you are hitting on all 10 attacks you get 80 damage from Fighter per round, while another 12 levels in rogue would give 6d6 more sneak dice or ~84 more damage in the first flurry (4 attacks). Personally if I was considering a Fighter/Thief hybrid with Invisible Blade I might go Rogue/Assassin/Blackguard/IB or switch BG out for Warrior of Darkness. If you want the feats you might consider Divine Champion, though the bonus feat list is not as strong, you get bonuses to saves and the level 5 ability gives you some extra damage on a cooldown. Finally, if you want to keep the Fighter concept you could consider dropping Fighter to 8 levels and getting 4 levels of Invisible Blade. This would still give you the Attack Bonus, but would lose Greater/Epic specialization and melee mastery.