High DC Necromancer Build Thoughts?

[calvinus]

Hey All,

Thoughts on this high DC necromancer build in mechanical or RP terms?

Trying to get the highest DC necromancer possible here without it being problematic for RP!

http://nwn2db.com/build/?320188

[Rain]

Seems preety solid to me. . . I have my negative opinions of archmage however. . . But! Still a solid build.

[Steve]

Palemaster has 6/10 progression. So you're looking at 26 CL + 4 PsC for 30 CL. You'll need 2 of your Arch Mage feats for Spellpower I & II, for CL 32 ( and that 1 DC). So only 1 Archmage feat for SLA.

[Lockonnow]

and remember if you dont have many items with high spell slots you will lose for those high spell power from arch then it is a no go

[calvinus]

Palemaster has 6/10 progression. So you're looking at 26 CL + 4 PsC for 30 CL. You'll need 2 of your Arch Mage feats for Spellpower I & II, for CL 32 ( and that 1 DC). So only 1 Archmage feat for SLA.

Right! Whoops! Thanks!

[calvinus]

and remember if you dont have many items with high spell slots you will lose for those high spell power from arch then it is a no go

Good point! Definitely a trade off.

[calvinus]

What if instead of AM went a Blood Mage route? How would that probably look and work in terms of obvious DC of spells and progression?

[Lockonnow]

you could go red wizard Palemaster now that will be evil but remember when you play with undead the smell will be noticed

[The Raven's Quill]

Could go Sorc/ RDD/ archmage type thing. insanely high Charisma/DC

[Hawke]

I did a sorcerer once. Only once. Similar build you mentioned. I actually like it. Had everything down.

The only drawback was when I used polymorph or shapechange, every +spell slot from item I got were lost when I changed into a form and another spell lost when I changed back. It was irritating to say the least, but even without those extra spell slot items, the build was actually fun. Would have been better if not the bug, but I can say, it was solid fun.

[chad878262]

are you more looking for anything you may have missed or are you looking for comparisons?

Strictly speaking from a DC perspective Archmage + Blood Magus or (even moreso) Shadow Adept is going to vastly improve your DCs while Arcane Scholar is more about metamagic and PaleMaster about defensive capabilities. Of course BM is 8/10 spell casting progression. However, the lost progression is at level 4 and 8 while Blood Seeking Spell comes at 6. Thus a Wizard 7/ PM10 / BM7 / AM6 would have a base caster level of 29 + 2 (AM) + 3 (blood seeking spell and blood component) = 34. However, W5/PM10/BM7/AM8 can take SPIII which would get you to CL35 for an additional +1 DC.

Meanwhile, Shadow Adept will give you a simple +2 DCs for a 3 level dip as well as giving +3 Spell Power to Necromancy, Illusion and Enchantment (albeit with the downside of weaker Transmutation and Evocation spells). So something like a W5/SA10/AM8/BM7 could have a caster level for Necromancy of 39 (30 +3 +3 +3) which would be +3 to your DCs (on top of flat +2 from Shadow Weave User).

note I am not advocating for such a build, setting aside the RP required from Shadow Adept and Blood Mage it is also too focused on DCs. Making such a one trick pony is in my opinion not a great option since Necromancy (as well as Illusion and Enchantment) are relatively easy to defend against and many of the end game bosses will be immune to your save or die stuff.

If your ask was more just about thoughts on your build in relation to a desire to maximize your DCs specifically within the confines of the class split...

The main thing I would say is that you could simply drop 1 level of wizard and 1 level of Arcane Scholar to push Archmage to 8. W6 and AS8 don't really give you anything so being able to grab another Archmage ability is kind of a no brainer. SPIII won't do much for the build (a bit more protection from mords dispel I guess, a bit longer spell durations, but no higher DC), but you could go SP1 and 2 while still getting 2 spell like abilities for example. Otherwise you have all the required feats to maximize your DC's within the confines of the build, only thing I see in a quick look at your build is simply maximizing what you get out of your level split.

have fun!

Edit to add - of course Red Wizard also can significantly improve DC for a school (such as Necromancy), but has similar ramifications (both RP and limitation of spell schools) to Shadow Adept. Where Shadow Adept harms your DCs with two schools, Red Wizard removes your access to a second specialty school (unless or until server makes any kind of change to allow for RW to be taken at levels 18-20 in order to give RW the ability to circumvent the 2nd spell schools limitation.

[calvinus]

Thanks for the feedback all!

Was looking for anything I had missed and comparisons, Chad!

However, W5/PM10/BM7/AM8 can take SPIII which would get you to CL35 for an additional +1 DC.

What would this BM version look like in NWN2 builder roughly? I think this is what I am leaning toward for the concept.

[chad878262]

What would this BM version look like in NWN2 builder roughly? I think this is what I am leaning toward for the concept.

From a feats perspective, without Arcane Scholar you no longer need Skill Focus (Concentration) or Empower Spell. This is a good thing as I just noticed your build doesn't have two spell focus feats from different schools. Note that Archmage requires spell focus in two different schools (SF: Necromancy and GSF: Necromancy does not count.) So really you just replaced Empower Spell with Toughness (required for Blood Magus) and replace Skill Focus Concentration with Spell Focus (whatever you want).

Also note that the build is not inherently 'better' than the arcane scholar version. AS gets you free maximize and free quicken, plus the improved metamagic for all but quicken. Quicken spell especially cannot be overvalued, it can truly be the most important metamagic in your arsenal with proper planning and execution.

That said, if you stick with your current build you will need to reevaluate your feats, most likely you'll have to lose extend spell in order to take another spell focus. So Blood Magus does have the benefit of less strenuous feat requirements and I suppose blood Draught and Scars can somewhat make up for the loss of Quicken Spell, but obviously quicken is better in many situations.

[Lockonnow]

maybe you sould read what some blood feat do for you then you migth liveing it alone

[Malice]

note I am not advocating for such a build, setting aside the RP required from Shadow Adept and Blood Mage it is also too focused on DCs. Making such a one trick pony is in my opinion not a great option since Necromancy (as well as Illusion and Enchantment) are relatively easy to defend against and many of the end game bosses will be immune to your save or die stuff.

Wouldn't it still be a fairly versatile build? You have ench, illu and necro with fairly high DCs. Ok maybe the epics in PVE are going to be rough (you can still use summons or just go with parties), but in general and PVP would be fairly doable. No?