Named Beings and PC Skills needed

[Steve]

On Named Planar Beings summoning: is Lore: The Planes used for anything other than unlocking a tome that has this skill as the DC check? As per the Wiki on the subject, there is a Diplomacy DC involved in the cost/convincing for the Planar Being to be bound. Essentially, I'd like to know and then state explicitly on the Wiki, that Diplomacy is more important that Lore: The Planes (for those building such a Character, and with possibly limited Skill points to apply). There is still an implication in the Wiki text that Lore: The Planes may divulge information on the Planar Being, which...does or doesn't help the actual summons success, or also influences the cost part as well?

Also: a build needs Epic Gate feat-spell in order to "call" the most powerful Named Planar Beings? Or, is Planar Ally/Gate spells enough? Would Epic Dragon Knight feat qualify or equal Epic Gate, in this regard?

[Endelyon]

On Named Planar Beings summoning: is Lore: The Planes used for anything other than unlocking a tome that has this skill as the DC check? As per the Wiki on the subject, there is a Diplomacy DC involved in the cost/convincing for the Planar Being to be bound. Essentially, I'd like to know and then state explicitly on the Wiki, that Diplomacy is more important that Lore: The Planes (for those building such a Character, and with possibly limited Skill points to apply). There is still an implication in the Wiki text that Lore: The Planes may divulge information on the Planar Being, which...does or doesn't help the actual summons success, or also influences the cost part as well?

Also: a build needs Epic Gate feat-spell in order to "call" the most powerful Named Planar Beings? Or, is Planar Ally/Gate spells enough? Would Epic Dragon Knight feat qualify or equal Epic Gate, in this regard?

You need to succeed in a Lore: The Planes check to first identify the being in the book at all, THEN you need a Diplomacy check to convince it to work for you, so both skills are explicitly necessary. iirc the first check can only be attempted once per character, though another character could pass the check and reveal the name to you. The diplomacy check can be attempted multiple times at the cost of the correct diamond.

As far as which one is "more important," that seems pretty subjective. I guess it's fair to say that the diplomacy check is more important since the summon can't be bound at all without it. Personally, however, I'd make sure my Lore: The Planes was high enough that I didn't have to rely on someone else learning the name of my rare summon for me.

Some powerful beings explicitly need Gate to be summoned, others of lower level can be summoned with Planar Binding. A few very rare ones require Epic Gate. Epic Dragon Knight would not qualify for those.

[Steve]

Thanks Endy-o!

How about Epic Spell: Dragon Knight being applicable to summoning Epic Named Planar Dragons?!?!

https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Planar_dragon

Gotta get that special Dusty Tome, however...GOALS!!!

[artemitavik]

I was under the impression the lore needed to decipher the book changes. One I've done was Planar, then another was arcane, yet another was a third lore. Did that change?

[Steve]

I was under the impression the lore needed to decipher the book changes. One I've done was Planar, then another was arcane, yet another was a third lore. Did that change?

It is my experience that all Dusty Tomes have a Lore: X DC check—between 12–18 from my 3 Tomes I’ve found over the years since implementation—but that Lore: The Planes is specifically and always used as for the DC check when the Dusty Tome actually contains a Named Being (99% of Dusty Tomes seem to NOT hold a Name…which is probably how it should be, in reality terms).

[artemitavik]

huh. Pretty sure the one that I got a name out of was Lore:religion. The others I mentioned I didn't get a name out of, and I agree with that not all tomes should have names. but still pretty sure it was lore: religion that got my name.

[Steve]

huh. Pretty sure the one that I got a name out of was Lore:religion. The others I mentioned I didn't get a name out of, and I agree with that not all tomes should have names. but still pretty sure it was lore: religion that got my name.

That’s something to be sure of, because the wiki is not at all clear on the matter (and I personally would like to update the page with more concrete information). Cheers.

[artemitavik]

huh. Pretty sure the one that I got a name out of was Lore:religion. The others I mentioned I didn't get a name out of, and I agree with that not all tomes should have names. but still pretty sure it was lore: religion that got my name.

That’s something to be sure of, because the wiki is not at all clear on the matter (and I personally would like to update the page with more concrete information). Cheers.

*shrug* It was years ago, I haven't bothered since.

[Theodore01]

You need to succeed in a Lore: The Planes check to first identify the being in the book at all, THEN you need a Diplomacy check to convince it to work for you, so both skills are explicitly necessary.

I have hired named beings with a failed diplomacy and a failed plane roll !
You just have to pay more then and in case of a failed lore roll, don't get any further information about the being.

[Steve]

You need to succeed in a Lore: The Planes check to first identify the being in the book at all, THEN you need a Diplomacy check to convince it to work for you, so both skills are explicitly necessary.

I have hired named beings with a failed diplomacy and a failed plane roll !
You just have to pay more then and in case of a failed lore roll, don't get any further information about the being.

Is it also true that one has to pay this fee every time the Named Being is bound? And, that if you do not summon the Named Being with some regularity, you MUST rebind it?

[Anrilor]

You need to succeed in a Lore: The Planes check to first identify the being in the book at all, THEN you need a Diplomacy check to convince it to work for you, so both skills are explicitly necessary.

I have hired named beings with a failed diplomacy and a failed plane roll !
You just have to pay more then and in case of a failed lore roll, don't get any further information about the being.

Is it also true that one has to pay this fee every time the Named Being is bound? And, that if you do not summon the Named Being with some regularity, you MUST rebind it?

Yes, RCRing is a pain, and expensive, I've had to do it a few times on Aly. There is a 10 day timer for summoning, after 10 days someone else can bind it. However if no one binds it, you don't have to. I recommend picking one day to call out the bound summon (mine is sunday) to not loose the summon.

[Theodore01]

Yes, if someone else is using it, you cannot summon it for now.
But you don't need to rebind it.
One just has to wait until that other player misses to summon it for every 10 days (Or gets bored of the summon, as most names are really just awful anyway and become useless for PvE more sooner than later.),then you can re-summon it again, you don't have to pay it again.

[Steve]

Thank you for all these details. They will be helpful for me, to update the Wiki for others use in the future.

If something else comes to mind, make a note of it here.

[Hawke]

Yeah, 3 checks are truly needed started from the dusty tome.

My first book (I think needs epic gate) took knowledge religion I believe.

My second book that I got last week (normal gate) required a knowledge nature check.

Then the planes and diplomacy. Checks.

Honestly, the first check if you are a wizard and cast greater heroism its pretty hard to fail the dusty tome check.


Speaking on diplomacy, it isn't too bad of a gold cost. I think my second named needed 57k gold. With passed diplomacy check. Too bad he was flat broke lol.