Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

Playing an evil character even remotely like Joffrey Baratheon is futile. You'll get killed over and over and over. Because you'll never chance into that kind of power the same way. It's just not going to happen.

mf_hansen wrote:Somewhat like King Joffrey Baratheon from the Game of Thrones TV series. The character is so utterly despicable that everyone hates him, and project this onto the actor because they have never seen him in any other role.

One cannot help but applaud Jack Gleeson for his portrayal of such an outright evil character, and hope people realize this and stop harassing the actor behind him. "Leave Gleeson alone!"

I admit I sometimes project similar dislike toward a hostile character's player, merely because I've had no communication with the player. A simple friendly tell asking if such and such evil/hostile RP is ok with the victim beforehand often goes a long way.

It may remove some of the spontaneity from the RP encounter, but on the other hand the victim might also suggest even more awesome directions to take the RP or ideas for continuing it later on at a different time as well.

If victim exploits the above OOC information you are as far as I know always free to report this as metagaming (including screenshots/chatlogs as proof) to DMs if warranted.

I dont really understand why there is the need to explain OOC that i am just roleplaying my character and if he may come across a bit hating or similiar thats just part of his/her personality. After all this is a roleplaying game, meaning IC you arent dealing with the person playing, but the character he is roleplaying. That's a huge difference.

Most of the time i tell the person afterwards that i am just reflecting my characters personality and that i don't have anything against the person behind playing the chars she is dealing with, my character might have a problem with his specific character though.

I play almost exclusively evil characters.

You can play anything on this server if you are being smart about it, though playing openly evil is not easy. Not even for a Zhentarim or Thayan character. The good guys is always working against you, knows that everything you do is evil or has an evil goal. And it is impossible to convince them that you are just helping, because... they OOCly know your character is pure evil and never up to any good. Not saying every player with goodly characters do that, but a good chunk of them do. Many of them without realising it.

As I said on Skype to Nomster many months ago, Darkhold was a blessing and a curse to the Zhentarim. Finally, we had a place to call our own and where Evil makes the rules. But at the same time it isolated the Zhentarim completely. Many players do not wish their characters to be seen with a Zhentarim. Mercenary-types stay away from them as well because they do not wish to be labelled a Zhentarim-member. Hell, just working for them instantly labels you one as you can see with my own character Alistair the Red. Even though he doesn't really give a damn about them and their grand schemes, everyone thinks he's best buddies with them. He's just interested in coin and the Zhentarim pays well. (Never ever been approached by a goodly character to do simple non-evil mercenary work for them. Never.)

Xanfyrst wrote:I play almost exclusively evil characters.

You can play anything on this server if you are being smart about it, though playing openly evil is not easy. Not even for a Zhentarim or Thayan character. The good guys is always working against you, knows that everything you do is evil or has an evil goal. And it is impossible to convince them that you are just helping, because... they OOCly know your character is pure evil and never up to any good. Not saying every player with goodly characters do that, but a good chunk of them do. Many of them without realising it.

Its tricky as for paladin types, that's entirely appropriate if you are playing open evil. Non associating with evils and all that.

Xanfyrst wrote:As I said on Skype to Nomster many months ago, Darkhold was a blessing and a curse to the Zhentarim. Finally, we had a place to call our own and where Evil makes the rules. But at the same time it isolated the Zhentarim completely. Many players do not wish their characters to be seen with a Zhentarim. Mercenary-types stay away from them as well because they do not wish to be labelled a Zhentarim-member.

I don't disagree with this BUT.

Its true that certainly the more zealous Zhentarim opponents make arguments such that even the most gentle association with the Zhentarim becomes something of comment, it should be noted this is actually part of an active propaganda campaign by some PCs. A policy of containment as it were. Something to be fought against IC.

Its one reason my character often thought Telia was so dangerous, she softened the face of the Zhentarim and increased the extent people would work with them (that was my perception OOC too, that the net was cast wider in her time)

The current crop also seem to be gaining tracting with a mix of fear and cohesiveness, though, which is good to see.

NOT good to see. But good to see

Xanfyrst wrote:Hell, just working for them instantly labels you one as you can see with my own character Alistair the Red. Even though he doesn't really give a damn about them and their grand schemes, everyone thinks he's best buddies with them. He's just interested in coin and the Zhentarim pays well. (Never ever been approached by a goodly character to do simple non-evil mercenary work for them. Never.)

To be fair, he gives plenty of reason for goodly characters to not hire him himself!

OP - I agree with that other characters should not so quickly dismiss evil RP. I also think the same should work the other way around. I have tried to acknowledge characters with some IC-reputation. It has been frustrating at times because I have actually been ridiculed OOCly for playing my character that way. Comments such as "You're stupid if you think that character can actually do anything" or "They're a joke". Not only do I find such annoying but also frustrating to being told what my character's opinion should be (my character and I certainly do not share the same opinions on all things!).

The quoted source books texts are a good read. Evil characters are not looking to murder and steal everything even though that is probably the first thing people think of when they think of "evil" I especially like "what would motivate a person to become evil" and how what actions are evil are considered to be different in different regions.

I disagree with the mentions that evil has no goodness in their hearts and feelings of sympathy that are brought up time to time. It should take a lot for a character to become that kind of husk where only dark emotions are all that is left... and I think many evil are not that far gone. I rather find this more realistic, "it's possible to be evil and simultaneously have actual friends, family, lovers, and "associates"".

Evil groups do work a fair deal against each other though, on the server. It certainly adds challenge to playing evil.

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7threalm - Some alignment shifts have valid RP behind them, though I will agree with that there have been many players who have simply RCRed and changed the alignment that way. Getting a DM to change alignment is proving to be very difficult.

Zhentarim - I have always said that the "goodies" do get more attention because they number more. Not only do they have good aligned characters supporting them but also many neutral... and then all the evil people pretending to be good

Good needs evil - evil needs good. I do not see why people work against each other on an OOC level but I know that is happening as I have had to deal with such issues. I think the RP is much more rewarding of people work together to create an interesting story instead of focusing on the OOC bickering.

Xanfyrst - I cannot see why goodly characters would just accept a -known- evil character wanting to do some good random deeds. That is pretty much saying that good characters should be stupid. If they see the player though and just metagame without having any IC info on the character in question, that is a different thing.

Though I can echo that there was an OOC worry with being seen with Zhentarim. The "guilty by association" stamp can be hard to wash away for some. I did despite that, manage to get some non-Zhentarim to work for the Zhentarim and deal with some other groups. Most of it was secretive RP though.

Kleomenes - I think it is fine and expected that others RP out the "guilty by association" things. It just becomes wrong when it turns OOC. I have not heard much negative opinions lately but for some time, there seemed to be players who OOCly discouraged others to even play with Zhentarim characters.

Nomster wrote: Zhentarim - I have always said that the "goodies" do get more attention because they number more. Not only do they have good aligned characters supporting them but also many neutral... and then all the evil people pretending to be good

I'm sorry, Nomster, but this is just false. "Goodies" are getting just as little attention as the "badies". And they are definitely not more numerous. Walk upon any gathering you find in a public place on the server (FAI, Beregost, Nashkel, Elfsong Tavern) and the majority are evil characters or neutral characters that always associate with and aid evil characters (some of which should really be evil on the sheet). This is especially noticeable at the FAI. I know people scoff when you call the RP at the FAI for RP, but it is RP whether you like it or not (I don't, for the record. Too many insanely pvp happy people...).

And yes, there are many, many who play evil characters that sort hide under a mask of "good". But almost all of them currently are so blatantly obvious about their mask that they are easy to see through.

And as I said earlier, the NPC world isn't supporting anyone at all. It's just a wall of neutrality that you keep crashing into. This is also the case with neutral NPCs. They either don't support at all, or they are essentially on both sides.

It is pretty difficult for any side to get support for events, I have discovered. My own experiences have largely been with Zhentarim, who mostly were half a dozen people. If you look at all evil out there - yes, it is going to be numerous but evil do not really work together with other evil. I figure if a group of 6 and then a group of 20 people ask for something, the larger number are likely to get things moving as they affect more. *shrug* Or maybe it is something else. All I know is, that at the time I left Zhentarim, several groups were attacking the Zhentarim and they had DM support while every PM I sent was overlooked and not replied to. That got tiresome real quick. So from my personal experiences, I have seen what I speak of... but I also do not think it is any easier for many other groups out there. I do not quite like the "goodies" vs "baddies" either as the whole neutral spectrum just falls under the chairs when it is just as important.


I will not get into a discussion which consist of looking down on other people's RP.

I think its about even on the support at least now. There really is no reason evil cannot support evil.

The mindset that they have to be constantly in fighting is part of problem and the trend of evil organizations attacking only evil organizations is part of the problem.

I think part of the reason for this is evil is much easier to target by other evil characters, because the consequences are less or if your identity is uncovered.

It still part of the Good vs Evil dynamic but it shifted to Evil(good/neutral) vs evil.

And evil will never get its act together, or join into larger groups because of this.(I blame secrecy for the most part)

There is no reason that evil couldn't come together to fight a greater good. yes there would be self-interest but evil can share a common goal.

Most of the Good-Align guilds have died down because they were sick of infiltrators, that rp has been out-played in my opinion.

I just assume each guild has an infiltrator OOCLY at this point, so I'm not to worried about it.

Perhaps evil should try a new approach?


Also having a bunch fun rp'ing an openly evil orc , and most of those interactions have been with good align charaters, some with evil aligned

kleomenes wrote: Its one reason my character often thought Telia was so dangerous, she softened the face of the Zhentarim and increased the extent people would work with them (that was my perception OOC too, that the net was cast wider in her time)

And the Zhentarim's image would of been mainstreamed even more if the exclusive interview with Telia had been released.

Nomster wrote: I have tried to acknowledge characters with some IC-reputation. It has been frustrating at times because I have actually been ridiculed OOCly for playing my character that way. Comments such as "You're stupid if you think that character can actually do anything" or "They're a joke".

Oh, what a shock... *Smirks*

7threalm wrote:Most of the Good-Align guilds have died down because they were sick of infiltrators, that rp has been out-played in my opinion.

Truth!

Evil on the server gets you banned/KOS eventually. Ask around. Theres been tons of people and they're all gone or they keep the evil to a minimum, by comparison, relatively low participation - or only log on when they will be supported by DMs for quest/schedules.

The essence of a role-playing game is that it is a group, cooperative experience. There is no winning or losing, but rather the value is in the experience of imagining yourself as a character in whatever genre you’re involved in, whether it’s a fantasy game, the Wild West, secret agents or whatever else. You get to sort of vicariously experience those things.

Interview in 2006, as quoted in "Gary Gygax, Game Pioneer, Dies at 69" in The New York Times (5 March 2008)

Alezka Silverstone wrote:Evil on the server gets you banned/KOS eventually. Ask around. Theres been tons of people and they're all gone or they keep the evil to a minimum, by comparison, relatively low participation - or only log on when they will be supported by DMs for quest/schedules.

This sounds wrong. There are plenty of evil characters on the server. Playing evil doesn't get you banned or KoS (actually, not much at all gets you KoS unless you go to the "other side" surface/UD wise).

If you play evil at the expense of others, as in griefing, or metagaming/godmoding, that might get you banned. But that kind of applies for being good as well. If you are a good aligned character that goes about griefing evil characters, you'll get banned as well.

Alezka Silverstone wrote:Evil on the server gets you banned/KOS eventually. Ask around. Theres been tons of people and they're all gone or they keep the evil to a minimum, by comparison, relatively low participation - or only log on when they will be supported by DMs for quest/schedules.

This definitely used to be the case. However, they only did this once said evil guild became to influential.

I would like to believe the change over in DMs since then has fundamentally changed things so that history would not repeated.

Layla0340 wrote:

Alezka Silverstone wrote:Evil on the server gets you banned/KOS eventually. Ask around. Theres been tons of people and they're all gone or they keep the evil to a minimum, by comparison, relatively low participation - or only log on when they will be supported by DMs for quest/schedules.

This definitely used to be the case. However, they only did this once said evil guild became to influential.

Really? I'd love to hear that story. If you don't think it's appropriate to post publically, would you mind sending me a PM about this?