'Door phobia' ??

[Aelcar]

Eh...guys, these are mostly Tips&Tricks material.

What is absolutely INCORRECT is to say the Pale Master summons, or any other summon actually, don't follow through transition: that's simply not true.

The Dominated and Controlled "extra" allies indeed do not follow through transitions. But that does not harm summoners in any way.

If you are lvl 12 and you farm minotaurs, you aren't doing it right, btw. Not to say you cannot do it, but you certainly have a taste for complicating your life. Might as well complain the Xvart kill you when you're lvl 5, or something .

[Ivan38Rus]

Either way, this is a bug and was supposed to be fixed at one point.
As far as I remember, the most efficient way to fix it would have been a chat command that ported your summon close to you; with some exploit-proofing it could have solved this issue.

[Deathgrowl]

What is absolutely INCORRECT is to say the Pale Master summons, or any other summon actually, don't follow through transition: that's simply not true.

It's not incorrect, Aelcar: It's inaccurate. They follow through zone-to-zone transitions. They do not follow through in-zone transitions. And that is the issue I think the OP means. Minotaur Labyrinth is an excellent example, but there are loads of these places.

[Aelcar]

What is absolutely INCORRECT is to say the Pale Master summons, or any other summon actually, don't follow through transition: that's simply not true.

It's not incorrect, Aelcar: It's inaccurate. They follow through zone-to-zone transitions. They do not follow through in-zone transitions. And that is the issue I think the OP means. Minotaur Labyrinth is an excellent example, but there are loads of these places.

Ahh, you mean like in the Misty Forest's cave before the glade!! So not doors...

Understood.

Yes, that's annoying. And also rare. Very rare.

[Deathgrowl]

Yes, that's annoying. And also rare. Very rare.

Nashkel mines.
Minotaur maze.
Pirate cave.
Yuan'ti temple.
Durlag's tower.
Cloakwood mines (though to be fair the only real issue there is the rope to get to the lizards)
Low level troll cave next to Candlekeep.
Ogre cave in the western troll claws.
Giant fortress in the eastern troll claws.

Not sure I agree entirely with "very rare". That is a rather large portion of the dungeons on the server.

[Aelcar]

Yes, that's annoying. And also rare. Very rare.

Nashkel mines.
Minotaur maze.
Pirate cave.
Yuan'ti temple.
Durlag's tower.
Cloakwood mines (though to be fair the only real issue there is the rope to get to the lizards)
Low level troll cave next to Candlekeep.
Ogre cave in the western troll claws.
Giant fortress in the eastern troll claws.

Not sure I agree entirely with "very rare". That is a rather large portion of the dungeons on the server.

It's also at very different points in the crawl. The annoyance isn't the same everywhere, because of this.

But this is an issue that needs fixing, for sure. I thought we were discussing another thing, which has nothing to do with it.

[NeOmega]

If you are lvl 12 and you farm minotaurs, you aren't doing it right, btw.

Doing what right? having fun?
Oh no, trying to farm minotaurs is fun with big and rare scrolls. They have no dispel guardians, So you know you won't lose it.
Though it might be better if they did, for a high level dungeon, I suppose. Level 3 spells are about all you need for the minotaur dungeon. Level 4 stoneskin would help. You can pray for that yourself, get it sometimes. Nice boost. Sometimes, you get greater stoneskin. Those prayer bonuses last a long time, and sometimes, you can build upon them. You can always buy stoneskin potions, though a bit steep.
Throw in a gibberling heart, and you, yourself are a surprising monster. Yes, minotaur are prone to sneak attack.

But this is an issue that needs fixing, for sure. I thought we were discussing another thing, which has nothing to do with it.

Actually, I would like control undead to be transportable between areas, as well as other dominate spells.
Because it would be fun. Dominate and charm and confuse spells currently are pretty drab.
Hell, I think dominate spells should last for hours. Just to up the fun a bit. Give them a gold cost. Every man has his price. Surely, most areas out of civilization could be opened up, for transfer. Yeah, somebody playing a paladin might use a control undead scroll, and bring it to the grave yards (actually, graveyard would be sealed by NPC guards), but, I mean, most people are playing to have fun, and playing, generally, characters as they are supposed to.

[tribunal]

Actually, I would like control undead to be transportable between areas, as well as other dominate spells.
Because it would be fun. Dominate and charm and confuse spells currently are pretty drab.
Hell, I think dominate spells should last for hours. Just to up the fun a bit. Give them a gold cost. Every man has his price. Surely, most areas out of civilization could be opened up, for transfer. Yeah, somebody playing a paladin might use a control undead scroll, and bring it to the grave yards (actually, graveyard would be sealed by NPC guards), but, I mean, most people are playing to have fun, and playing, generally, characters as they are supposed to.

+1

[Ivan38Rus]

Except that opens up some pretty obvious possibilities for griefing like bringing the monster with you to a peaceful or non-pvp area and logging off/resting/dispelling effects. Deaths in PvP at least don't give XP penalty, while deaths from a dominated monster do.

[Aelcar]

Actually, I would like control undead to be transportable between areas, as well as other dominate spells.
Because it would be fun. Dominate and charm and confuse spells currently are pretty drab.
Hell, I think dominate spells should last for hours. Just to up the fun a bit. Give them a gold cost. Every man has his price. Surely, most areas out of civilization could be opened up, for transfer. Yeah, somebody playing a paladin might use a control undead scroll, and bring it to the grave yards (actually, graveyard would be sealed by NPC guards), but, I mean, most people are playing to have fun, and playing, generally, characters as they are supposed to.

+1

Or not. As said earlier:

Fact remains, people bringing controlled/dominated creatures to low lvl areas and letting them loose (inadvertantly or not) on low lvl characters was a big issue.

and:

Except that opens up some pretty obvious possibilities for griefing like bringing the monster with you to a peaceful or non-pvp area and logging off/resting/dispelling effects. Deaths in PvP at least don't give XP penalty, while deaths from a dominated monster do.

Also, Dominate spells DO last for an extremely long time.

[NeOmega]

Except that opens up some pretty obvious possibilities for griefing like bringing the monster with you to a peaceful or non-pvp area and logging off/resting/dispelling effects. Deaths in PvP at least don't give XP penalty, while deaths from a dominated monster do.

That's why they should still have "door-phobia" when trying to enter restricted areas, like beregost, the eastern farmlands, wyrms crossing, etc.

And if it is proven to be real griefing, give them the same treatment as somebody who lays a bunch of epic traps along the wyrms crossing bridge, (which BTW, I hear would happen all the time if epic traps were not nerfed, oh wait, people actually, by and large, do not do this).

Really, punishing the 99.9% for the crimes of the .1% is not a good way to bring fun to a server.

[Deathgrowl]

What if it isn't griefing? What if someone goes to the Frost Giant place, dominates a frost giant and teleports some lower level dungeon to use the Frost Giant just because it's so much better than all the mobs there? And then the domination runs out and the caster leaves a quite heavily buffed version of the epic frost giants in a lower level dungeon for some lower level characters to get smashed by.

I mean, I get why people would want it. Before I knew this wasn't possible, I tried to dominate a frost giant in order to kill epic lizards, because the frost giant buffed up would just faceroll the lizards. But it didn't work, and there are several reasons I can think of for it not working.

[NeOmega]

What if it isn't griefing? What if someone goes to the Frost Giant place, dominates a frost giant and teleports some lower level dungeon to use the Frost Giant just because it's so much better than all the mobs there? And then the domination runs out and the caster leaves a quite heavily buffed version of the epic frost giants in a lower level dungeon for some lower level characters to get smashed by.

What if, what if?

Make the dominated creature disappear when someone drops connection, just like summons and animal companions do.

What if someone leaves epic traps all over a lower level dungeon, then dies? He didn't mean to do it, but whoops, now everyone else dies.

And who is going to dominate a frost giant and then teleport with it to the graveyard, "by accident"?

I mean... ...caster can cast teleport, but argues teleporting to graveyard with frost giant and leaving is not griefing. Uh huh.

It's the same thing as traps, which were nerfed because of "what ifs". In fact, this whole server has a severe case of the "what-if's". It's a great way to avoid change, but not much else.

Did you know, in the late 1800's, early 1900's, many architects believe sheet glass and glass curtain wall's were simply stupid? You know why? They were convinced, people would not be able to resist smashing them with rocks. Lo and behold, we live in cities full of glass now. It is rare somebody smashes it for the hell of it.

I mean, I get why people would want it. Before I knew this wasn't possible, I tried to dominate a frost giant in order to kill epic lizards, because the frost giant buffed up would just faceroll the lizards. But it didn't work, and there are several reasons I can think of for it not working.

But it would be sooo much fun!

You'd be surprised how well it doesn't work for lower level characters to try and use an epic snag or scroll at high level dungeons, the low level still often gets killed quickly, as mobs bypass the summons. It's fun, but incredibly dangerous. I've had plenty of times I blew 5000 on potions and summon scrolls on a low level only to see them wrecked in about 15 minutes.

[tribunal]

What if it isn't griefing? What if someone goes to the Frost Giant place, dominates a frost giant and teleports some lower level dungeon to use the Frost Giant just because it's so much better than all the mobs there? And then the domination runs out and the caster leaves a quite heavily buffed version of the epic frost giants in a lower level dungeon for some lower level characters to get smashed by.

So... What if I teleport myself with Balor ( escaping from some deadly situation before) to Cloakwood ? And uppss ! He kill a few players there ? That would not be a my fault ???

Should we change every spell that can harm a low level players directly or indirectly ? After all why are you leveling than to become ready and able enough to confront many unexpected situations such as ambushes of outlaws, who can easily kill some unbuffed low level wizards in front of FAI and in front of the guards...

[Camera9]

There is more than one passage/transition in the Underdark where my animal companion gets stuck all the time: I'm not talking about a maze or anything weird, just tunnels in the grottoes with a simple transition!
At that point all you can do is dismiss the animal companion and wait for 2 minutes; this is definitely a problem that affects also druid and ranger, not just arcanists.