Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

Oh, here is an idea...

A high strength bard with Many Shot and Brutal Throw.

1d6 (Mundane Throwing Axe)
+ 6 (Inspire Courage)
+ 10 (Strength)
+ 1d4 (Sonic Weapon, spell)
= 22~ (44~ with manyshot)

3 level barb dip on that for the situational another +4 STR?

Storm Munin wrote:3 level barb dip on that for the situational another +4 STR?

And there is that +3 Natural Armor amulet with Extra and Extend Rage feats. (I would go for Standard for that extra +1 damage, etc.)

And movement speed increase.

So I was thinking of making a str bard, kinda a skald concept... trying to figure out what split I want before I start trying to build one. I am pretty sure I want at least 27 bard/3 rogue, at a minimum... is stormsinger worth pursuing or would that come at the cost of too many bard abilities? Dissonant chord doesn't sound appealing or fit the RP. Also considering a 3-4 fighter dip for proficiencies and feats (I was hoping to use a battleaxe). I see a lot of different great ideas in this thread but I'm not sure their pros/cons since I've never played a bard before. Should I keep it simple with bard/rogue, splash in some fighter (or will that lose too many bard levels, I could make do with a longsword if I had to) or go for stormsinger (same question re: bard levels)?

WatWatsen wrote:So I was thinking of making a str bard, kinda a skald concept... trying to figure out what split I want before I start trying to build one. I am pretty sure I want at least 27 bard/3 rogue, at a minimum... is stormsinger worth pursuing or would that come at the cost of too many bard abilities? Dissonant chord doesn't sound appealing or fit the RP. Also considering a 3-4 fighter dip for proficiencies and feats (I was hoping to use a battleaxe). I see a lot of different great ideas in this thread but I'm not sure their pros/cons since I've never played a bard before. Should I keep it simple with bard/rogue, splash in some fighter (or will that lose too many bard levels, I could make do with a longsword if I had to) or go for stormsinger (same question re: bard levels)?

Despite not being a build expert, I used to play a stormsinger. It's really fun! But the damage output of its abilities was a bit low on a STR bard. If you plan on going that route, I suggest a CHA bard instead.

Bard 27/rogue 3 is a solid pick. I mean it. Song-wise, you get to choose between +5 AB/DMG bonus, +5 regeneration, +6 AC or +8 on your skills (say hello to usefulness on DM events). Also, you get 2 extra epic feats - and speaking about them, say hello to Song/Hymn of Requiem and Expose Weakness.

Or i would suggest one of the old Mr.M3ntalist's bard builds. It's a Bard23/PM4/Cler3.
So you get +4AC from PM and you get medium armor proficiency and evasion from cleric. So you got cha13+3 cha item Dex12 and some in int/con rest in STR!
I think the build tops at 52-54AC with two handed weapon +shield wand + Imp mage armor wand.
You get expose weakness and really nice dmg together with hymn of requiem which comes at late lvl 29
I believe the CL was 29 too so it's not too bad. Don't forget practised spellcaster

The Last Question wrote:Despite not being a build expert, I used to play a stormsinger. It's really fun! But the damage output of its abilities was a bit low on a STR bard. If you plan on going that route, I suggest a CHA bard instead.

Bard 27/rogue 3 is a solid pick. I mean it. Song-wise, you get to choose between +5 AB/DMG bonus, +5 regeneration, +6 AC or +8 on your skills (say hello to usefulness on DM events). Also, you get 2 extra epic feats - and speaking about them, say hello to Song/Hymn of Requiem and Expose Weakness.

Okay, let's look at building a b27/r3... Human for race. Stats, I want... 16/14/12/14/8/14? (so would need +2 cha item for spells and is expected to get +4 dex from buffs?) Going for mithril chainmail ultimately, right? What kinda feats are must-haves? I'm assuming able learner, and since this is a light armor build I don't feel cheesy about using expose weaknesses. What are the must-have bard feats... curse song, lingering song, practiced spellcaster... extend spell? Epic prowess/song of requiem/hymn of requiem in the epics... Anything I'm missing or forgetting? Sorry, having trouble putting all this together in my head. I'm expecting to use a longsword/light shield, am I gonna want power attack or combat expertise or maybe Northlander? I've never played a sneaky type or a mage type before.

And skills... I'm thinking concentration, disable device, heal (? redundant?), lore: arcana, open lock, tumble, UMD (is there a point going beyond adjusted 26? In case of high level spell DC I want it maxed?), search, perform... maybe spellcraft with extra points? Not sure if I need/want to go for hide/move silently and spot/listen...

WatWatsen wrote:Okay, let's look at building a b27/r3... Human for race. Stats, I want... 16/14/12/14/8/14? (so would need +2 cha item for spells and is expected to get +4 dex from buffs?)

Or the +4 dex bracers from Doron Amar.

WatWatsen wrote:Going for mithril chainmail ultimately, right? What kinda feats are must-haves? I'm assuming able learner

No. No point unless you really want class skills that rogue has but bard weirdly doesn't. Bard has a huge amount of class skills and able learner doesn't give you anything on an almost pure bard.

WatWatsen wrote:and since this is a light armor build I don't feel cheesy about using expose weaknesses. What are the must-have bard feats... curse song, lingering song, practiced spellcaster... extend spell? Epic prowess/song of requiem/hymn of requiem in the epics... Anything I'm missing or forgetting? Sorry, having trouble putting all this together in my head. I'm expecting to use a longsword/light shield, am I gonna want power attack or combat expertise or maybe Northlander? I've never played a sneaky type or a mage type before.

http://nwn2db.com/build/?276863
I already linked this earlier in the thread, so here you go. This almost your exact split (bard26/rogue4 in this case). PA/IPA can of course be changed for something else you prefer.

And you're using longsword and heavy shield. Doesn't have to be light shield.

WatWatsen wrote:And skills... I'm thinking concentration, disable device, heal (? redundant?), lore: arcana, open lock, tumble, UMD (is there a point going beyond adjusted 26? In case of high level spell DC I want it maxed?), search, perform... maybe spellcraft with extra points? Not sure if I need/want to go for hide/move silently and spot/listen...

I personally would fill out concentration. Some people don't care, as they don't expect to ever really cast while in combat. But having panic spells like greater invisibility or displacement failing when you suddenly find you need them is no fun.

UMD is useful up to adjusted 33. Casting spells from scrolls has DC 25+spell level, so a level 9 scroll has 34 DC. That's 33+lowest roll.

Tumble up to 30 ranks for that 3 AC.

Perform maxed out. The better your perform is, the better your requiem is.

Spellcraft to at least 30 ranks gives you +6 saves vs spells. It's also just generally nice to have as a pureish arcane spellcaster - even a bard.

Listen is something I would go for as a bard. Spot is nice too, but if I have to choose - Listen. On a bard, that is.

Rest is fluff, basically. See what skill points you have to use. Hide/MS is really cool, but are you going to use it often?

Is the arcane spell failure from shields much of a problem? I've always played divine casters or fighters. I could hope for a mithral heavy shield but that sounds expensive

Agreed about concentration- I'd rather not be wishing I had it when I need it.

Main reason I was interested in able learner was for search/disable device/open locks as class skills. I had wanted to max them (open locks probably doesn't need to be maxed since you can take 20 but won't I want search and disable device to be maxed for nasty epic traps?), unless I should just suck it up and eat the 2 skill points per rank on bard levels? I had been thinking of cramming in the rogue levels early to get the 2d6 sneak for early leveling, but I could spread them out for skill dumps... though the final one would have to be 20 at the latest, as in your build...

Thanks for the advice!

WatWatsen wrote: Okay, let's look at building a b27/r3... Human for race. Stats, I want... 16/14/12/14/8/14? (so would need +2 cha item for spells and is expected to get +4 dex from buffs?) Going for mithril chainmail ultimately, right? What kinda feats are must-haves? I'm assuming able learner, and since this is a light armor build I don't feel cheesy about using expose weaknesses. What are the must-have bard feats... curse song, lingering song, practiced spellcaster... extend spell? Epic prowess/song of requiem/hymn of requiem in the epics... Anything I'm missing or forgetting? Sorry, having trouble putting all this together in my head. I'm expecting to use a longsword/light shield, am I gonna want power attack or combat expertise or maybe Northlander? I've never played a sneaky type or a mage type before.

And skills... I'm thinking concentration, disable device, heal (? redundant?), lore: arcana, open lock, tumble, UMD (is there a point going beyond adjusted 26? In case of high level spell DC I want it maxed?), search, perform... maybe spellcraft with extra points? Not sure if I need/want to go for hide/move silently and spot/listen...

Seconding what Deathgrowl said. That's your must-haves for a bard like that.

Still regarding skills, that really depends on what type of character you'll play (RP-wise) - but it's nice to have in mind that you get +1 on all lore skills for every 5 levels of bard (unless rules have changed). A bit of Diplomacy might be interesting as well, considering the quests available.

As for Open Lock and Disable Device, I'm not really sure if you can maximize both.

WatWatsen wrote:Is the arcane spell failure from shields much of a problem? I've always played divine casters or fighters. I could hope for a mithral heavy shield but that sounds expensive

Just unequip it...?

Am curious; are there even mithral heavy shields?

Yes. I have one!

But no enhancement bonus on it, though. Just a plain mithral heavy shield.

there are, but they (usually) don't come with 0% spell failure.

I got two 0% Arcane Spell failure light shields, one of them has +1 Reflex Saves!