Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

First, you are welcomed, one must start somewhere !

Second, been around for some short time few years back, got back some 2 months ago. On some days, work makes it impossible to login...

Third, with Escape artist, I forgot to mention, one of Any skills that is up to 10 ranks is Escape artist. Also, there wasn't mentioned anywhere what is goal bluff skill, just to have feint, I assumed normal full skill would be backed up by some bluff focused gear. Never used feint, so have no idea what would be sweet spot there . That is also why there were "replaceable" feats mentioned, that can customize a thing or two, replacing Able Learner, Blind Fight and possible Blinding Speed with Silver Palm, Skill focus in bluff and Negotiator nets 42 bluff (probably 43 with Tale Teller, but that one doesn't seem to change Bluff value on nwndb for me for some reason) ... admittedly this also has 5 less points in Hide and MS, that was also not mentioned what the goal would be... As well, not sure if you noticed what I wrote more about INT on nwndb, dropping STR and CON down to 11 and putting two more points in INT gives total of 330 skill points. Still over 10, but 14 STR just feels so... well... drop WIS to 8 and put in STR ?

Still, I would say it checked all given boxes, so how about giving some hidden ones, like what would be goal for MS, Hide and Bluff? Also, what EasternCheesE said, you don't have access to that belt by chance?

Other thing, about HITS experience... for that one question I am useless . I know that this part on the wiki: "Only works if near an object. Unwalkable terrain such as cliffs, walls, rocks, etc. and some other environmental placeables such as doors will work. Certain placeables such as trees will not." makes me look at it with some doubts...

Anno Nymus wrote: ↑Sun Feb 28, 2021 5:24 pm First, you are welcomed, one must start somewhere !

Second, been around for some short time few years back, got back some 2 months ago. On some days, work makes it impossible to login...

Third, with Escape artist, I forgot to mention, one of Any skills that is up to 10 ranks is Escape artist. Also, there wasn't mentioned anywhere what is goal bluff skill, just to have feint, I assumed normal full skill would be backed up by some bluff focused gear. Never used feint, so have no idea what would be sweet spot there . That is also why there were "replaceable" feats mentioned, that can customize a thing or two, replacing Able Learner, Blind Fight and possible Blinding Speed with Silver Palm, Skill focus in bluff and Negotiator nets 42 bluff (probably 43 with Tale Teller, but that one doesn't seem to change Bluff value on nwndb for me for some reason) ... admittedly this also has 5 less points in Hide and MS, that was also not mentioned what the goal would be... As well, not sure if you noticed what I wrote more about INT on nwndb, dropping STR and CON down to 11 and putting two more points in INT gives total of 330 skill points. Still over 10, but 14 STR just feels so... well... drop WIS to 8 and put in STR ?

Still, I would say it checked all given boxes, so how about giving some hidden ones, like what would be goal for MS, Hide and Bluff? Also, what EasternCheesE said, you don't have access to that belt by chance?

Other thing, about HITS experience... for that one question I am useless . I know that this part on the wiki: "Only works if near an object. Unwalkable terrain such as cliffs, walls, rocks, etc. and some other environmental placeables such as doors will work. Certain placeables such as trees will not." makes me look at it with some doubts...

Alright, welcome back, then.

The "failed prerequisite" was my fault, I totally forgot that it is a custom BGT skill which is not present at nwn2db. My bad, sorry!

About bluff - sorry as well, I just assumed it "common knowledge" that a "base" bluff of around 40 and quite the focus on bluff items is necessary for successful feinting at BGT.

And you're absoutely right that I only stated the minimum requirements:
My usual problem is that I want a Jane-does-it-all character whenever I build. In an ideal sneaker build I'd like to reach 100/100 hide/MS but at the same time, 100 spot and listen and bluff and diplomacy and disable device and 30 in all saves and 60 AC and 50 AB and . . . .

Not at all realistic, I am aware of that.

So yes, your build does check all the boxes, I was just falling for the "nice but perhaps I can get it better?" trap.

I don't have access to that belt, no. I am neither izzul nor m3ntalist nor Karond nor Kel etc.
And even if I had that belt, I couldn't use it anyway - since belt slot is reserved for the Belt of growth.

All is fine , I looked a bit at others that posted and took that as something to aim close to. Never played sneaker or feinter, and am lacking a bit on "common knowledge", but am learning.

Also, "perfect toon for the job" is what everyone looks for, so I hear you!

Will probably give this a bit more thought, for the fun of it , I have quite fun building on nwndb... wish they had this servers classes (to prevent some mistakes), but is close enough. But I do wonder few things... how hard are you set on having PTWF and Epic Dodge ? Epic Precision is probably a must, right?

NWN2db is indeed close and still, after all these years, a great tool to get an idea about your build.
Sometime in the future we will perhaps not need it anymore, I remember the staff hinting about a "live module" where you can build and test your chars directly in the servers' environment. (crossing fingers for that to actually happen!)

About sneakers and feinters: there are indeed a couple things that aren't obvious from the beginning but at the same time mantadory.

(1) If you want to use stealth/feint reliably you need to focus on it.
You either get your hide/move silently (and bluff, respectively) to 65++ or you should not go for it at all since you'll be rather disappointed in the high level areas.
Even with numbers above 80 (which I never managed to reach here, by the way - but I keep reading of chars with hide/ms/bluff in the 90s even ) there will be areas where your ability (stealth/feint) is close to useless.

If you're interested in the actual formulas for determining success/fail of these systems, I'll happily send you a PM - I do not want to derail this thread into another discussion about htese, systems, though.

(2) Focusing your build on stealth/feint doesn't suffice - you need highend equipment, too.
Before the inclusion of the hell shop (whose items are nowaday distributed to various merchants, Kalehir at the Wide + the travelling merchant at Beregost among them) it was almost impossible to become a successful stealther or feinter without the help of established players and/or muling and/or a lot of luck.

With those items implemented you now have a terribly expensive but at least freely available source of equipment that can put you into the 60s or even 70s for those three skills, provided your build sports base skills of 45+ (hide/MS) and 40+ (bluff)

You will probably suffer in other areas (AC, AB, and saves come to mind, but also elemental resistances), though.

(3) Playing a stealther or feinter is kind of different from playing other classes like fighter. If you just recklessly charge into enemy groups you'll probably die a lot. tactics are key with this kind of chars.


Which brings me to your question about Epic Precision, PTWF and Epic Dodge.

Epic Precision is a must if you don't want to run from any skeleton you encounter. The Fields of the Dead are quite frightening to any DEX-based char, but without EP (or other means to deal damage to crit-immune monsters) you are not going to succeed there.

PTWF - the question just is: do I want to deal damage as quickly as possible as to avoid beign hit (low AC and saves, remember) or do I take the risk? I will, whenever possible, want the chance to deal damage from double the amount of attacks.

Epic Dodge - is basically a non-deniable +5 AC in 1vs 1 fights.

So yes, I want all three of them. And everything else, too.

VillageGreenWitch wrote: ↑Fri Feb 26, 2021 3:43 pm Greetings,

I am pondering over a new character and would really like to build me a thief acrobat.
That class intrigues me from a mechanical point of view just as much as from the RP that comes with it.

I know that it is much better suited for rangers and fighters and bards, but I would like to build a rogue with that class.

Requirements

race
human (or if not possible with a human, then tiefling)

attributes
all at 10 or higher

classes
Rogue-based
full levels of Thief Acrobat
no AK/WoD

feats
feint (and ~10d6 sneak or more)
at least HitS (HiPS preferred)
darkvision from race or class, not from item
PTWF
Epic Dodge
martial weapons and shield proficiency

skills
at least ~320 points, 350+ preferred

That's close to impossible to achieve, I know - which is why I labelled it as a challenge.

Hoping for some ideas I haven't had, yet. *crossing fingers*

As human, stats could start at str 11, dex 18, con 11, int 14, Wis 10, char 10.

In order to open epic feats as much as possible, you have to start with maxed dex for ptwf.

The issue you have is that all your heroic level feats are already called for: weapon finesse, 3 twf feats, 2 feats for TA, and CE - feint. That's 8 feats. Not much wiggle room. I.e. no blind fight.

That said, more than 13 rogue levels is not needed since you pick up improved evasion from TA.

How about 13 Rogue, 5 TA, 4 guild thief, 8 wilderness stalker?

You want camouflage, tracking is great, and lean into more AC from TA, CE, and WS perks. (313 skill points)

Pick up EP at 23, PTWF at 25, and ED at 27. Blind fight comes at level 29..

Or 3 Hunter Ranger for the free feats and speed bonus, 7 WS, 5 TA, and 15 rogue. You get what you want ASAP in heroic levels. (319 skill points)

Then, of course, you can ignore Wilderness Stalker idea completely, pick up bodyguard, keep 3 Hunter Ranger, and go 19 rogue for more SA and skill points. You will be very fast.

Or assassin instead of bodyguard for HIPS and less rogue.
Or more bluff with guild thief....lots of options.

Of all the options above, my personal favorite is hunter ranger stalker build. Your speed will be enough to allow you to hide in shadows without really needing HIPS. You get all your feats organically throughout the life of the build. Have 26 BAB. And tracking and camouflage is amazing as a rogue. Your bluff stealth skills are a bit less than what you would get as a guild thief, but as a slow paced stealther, you really want the quality of life perks Hunter Ranger + Wilderness Stalker gives you.

But, from what I see based on your request, 3 Hunter Ranger 4 guild thief, 5 TA, and 16 Rogue fits what you want the best. (The rest of the class levels are per your discretion). You can also pick up expose weakness with this load out. You can end up with 13d6 SA here.


Keep in mind, having to slot bluff and sneak gear along with whatever else you need will be a chore.