'Wilderness / Open PVP area'

[K'yon Oblodra]

@Maecius the no limits you have spoke before, are pretty cool looking. For some reason people don't even see them. I mean, perming people is nearly impossible, so people do not fear, they even do not buff(well mostly) and just run around knowing that mobs cannot kill them, because they are not near any spawn, and they do not suspect that someone would attack them in the place they actually are.

You know people run around unbuffed, how dare they do that... As if an adventurer would always run around fully warded incase someone unexpected would come out of nowhere to kill him... Usually combat doesn't happen out of nowhere and when it does the first usually die without much further ado. But that is not exactly how anyone would like to see a "hero" die.

I would like to know, how you can push some territory conquering, removing opposition or conquering a guild if perming is nearly not possible. Facing people that do not fear any consequences...its like killing mobs, literally the same for me at least

Don't try to imagine how removing an opposition would be possible, imagine how it would feel to be in a guild that would flourish and have fun RPing to be ridded of the face of the earth unwillingly.

I really don't want to know how playing on this server would feel if there was the constant chance of dying permanently. (There actually is a topic going on where people complain about how slow leveling goes.)

[Glowfire]

@Maecius the no limits you have spoke before, are pretty cool looking. For some reason people don't even see them. I mean, perming people is nearly impossible, so people do not fear, they even do not buff(well mostly) and just run around knowing that mobs cannot kill them, because they are not near any spawn, and they do not suspect that someone would attack them in the place they actually are.

I would like to know, how you can push some territory conquering, removing opposition or conquering a guild if perming is nearly not possible. Facing people that do not fear any consequences...its like killing mobs, literally the same for me at least

Why do you want to perma-kill other people's characters...?

It's best that it remains a choice for the player of the character.


Removing opposition can happen on a political level, or trying to turn other characters against the ones your character don't like. A bit like the Harpers vs Zhentarim vs Thayans. Then throw in the goodly temples and holy orders. IMO the server should be about creating a cooperative story. If someone as a player isn't happy about the adversarial roleplay, then that should be addressed somehow.

It's actually a bit funny that "people don't buff" is remarked on, as the more common version is that people buff too much

[K'yon Oblodra]

Question as side note:

Does PvP lead directly to the fugue?

I think back in the day it only lead to being K.O.

Not entirely sure though.

[Valefort]

Just KO.

[RagingPeace]

Sometimes it sends you to the fugue, it happened yesterday at least.

[CleverUsername123]

I think it's only supposed to K.O. you, though when I summoned an earth elemental for intimidation once and a dwarf decided to fight it he ended up fugued.

[Heimdallr]

I don't believe that no reason perm would happen at all. There were numerous player groups just killing themselves on sight, without more than - its that bloody orc! get him!. And they were fine as this was between them, you know typical growing hatred. But no one of them wanted to perm someone else. Yet, there are some people that gain power and influence, but another group loses on their gain(lets use an example of a necromancer's that try to take over a region vs good pally guild that try to keep it for their god or something) it is natural that those two would fight, but at some point they would start thinking - why do we try to do anything if except for pvp it is pointless, we cannot eliminate others. This is an example of 2 guilds that would actually focus on themselves as both fight for the same idea(in this example it was a region) don't think that any guild like that, would like to perm ANY different guild, because what would be the reason? why they would try to strike mages guild/mercenaries/guards/anything that is not their enemy? none. If I would have power to allow such perms vs 'third party guilds' would I? no. But having a typical guild that is your enemy in what you do, should end in perms if applicable.

For a better example(as I am a really bad writer) You got lets say a 'resource' and you want it.
You take it or fight for it with another guild, you need to stay focused as you entered, or were attacked by that guild because they want to take your resource. But a different guild wants it also, and we got a conflict between 3 guilds. Imho this could be a great possibility to perm themselves or even KOS if conflict would be high as hell, but they should not have any right to perm a 3rd party player/guild

But as long as you know that someone can try to eliminate you because of what do you posess pushes it on a higher level than endlessly respawning, this would push this at least a bit further.

Also I have noticed that from the core of this thread, we actually went through general server/community problems and ideas and even way more, instead of just waiting to check what this location could bring:D

[Darkwind]

Sometimes it sends you to the fugue, it happened yesterday at least.

Twice... (at least in one case)

It is just like when mobs hit you. If they hit you with an overkill type attack that sends you well past -11 HP you are fugue'd obviously but it has also been rumored in the case of mobs this was part of the issue with the disappearing corpse situation as somehow there wasn't even time to register one as "dead" or something to that effect since it happens instantly.


p.s. Well played on the hidden blades waiting to strike, I should have been much smarter about anticipating that happening.

[Flasmix]

For a better example(as I am a really bad writer) You got lets say a 'resource' and you want it.
You take it or fight for it with another guild, you need to stay focused as you entered, or were attacked by that guild because they want to take your resource. But a different guild wants it also, and we got a conflict between 3 guilds. Imho this could be a great possibility to perm themselves or even KOS if conflict would be high as hell, but they should not have any right to perm a 3rd party player/guild

But as long as you know that someone can try to eliminate you because of what do you posess pushes it on a higher level than endlessly respawning, this would push this at least a bit further.

I'll elaborate a bit further on how this can be achieved.

I'm going with a specific made up example and to do it, we'll assume this resource is an iron mine.

Let's say this iron mine is owned by the Zhentarim and your guild wants it. Killing off the PCs of the Zhentarim, even if they agreed to be permed, will not magically get you this iron mine. They have a vast army of NPCs behind them.

What you and your guild would need to do is work with the DMs. Submit requests on how you would say, first disrupt mining operations or steal caravans of ore for yourself. If you eventually get the opportunity to attack the mine itself and manage to take it... You then have to both A) Supply it with workers and B) Hold the mine against a counter attack.

PCs are not a means to an end, they are a guiding force in what guilds and others can achieve.

Another example could be say.. You run an assassins guild and another assassins guild took a job you wanted. Reach out to them OOCly, see if you can come to an agreement about if one of them is killed they remove themselves from the job to allow your group to take it over. Of course, you'd have to make the same agreement yourself if you lose the fight.

It's this sort of mentality that we should be trying to foster. If you want to make an agreement to KOS and perm other guilds, that's what it has to be. An agreement between the players of this guild. It's never going to be something that the DMs or server will change to allow. It is entirely up to a player to initiate these things with other players.

[aaron22]

the player themselves and DM's should be the ones giving away perms. and i say that with the "assumption" that you will be a more strict judge of your own RP than a DM would be. the DM would likely only bring about your demise if you abuse your self monitoring privileges and/or act in such a manner that your survival is no longer present.

assassinations and such are joint endeavors. both the assassin and intended victim should come to some sort of agreement that essentially can amount to a duel to the death. winner lives. loser dies. i have seen such agreements and that is really the only way that idea can work. and we have that right now.

an area of lawlessness is not against RP anymore than a dungeon or illithid infested sewer tunnel is. it is something completely different. RP is RP and combat is combat. they can combine or stay separate because they are different ingredients to the soup that is BGTSCC. to say that we cannot have a lawless area because it counters RP is nonsense. its really just a bad excuse to back opinions of what someone wants or doesnt want.

[K'yon Oblodra]

Honestly I am not sure what the area is really needed for if we can pvp anywhere anyways, except for maybe city limits.

[Calodan]

Honestly I am not sure what the area is really needed for if we can pvp anywhere anyways, except for maybe city limits.

I think there needs to be some clarification. This is not true. I know King Mac said that but it is not true. Don't believe me? PvP in the FAI map, BG map to include outside farmlands, Darkhold and basically anywhere there are guards both visible and not visible but to be assumed there. See what happens to the DM ruling after the shit hits the fan and the green text starts rolling. So basically there are only a few maps that you can realistically go to engage that sort of RP. Most of the people whom you would want to PvP AKA player PCs that have been around since the dawn of time and seem invincible in this god forsaken coast that kills everyone else but them hang out in those areas and do not go out where they can be killed....This includes Kory aka myself. (although he is frequently out alone in places not with guards...) Which brings me to my next point.

Who has the cajones to come get him? No one even tries. Those that have, have won but they went all nicey nice and did not kill him.....I am one of those players that would honor that just FYI for you aspiring assassins, name makers and whatnot out there!

[aaron22]

Honestly I am not sure what the area is really needed for if we can pvp anywhere anyways, except for maybe city limits.

it would be an area that could provide an aspect of the game that is not readily available. PvP combat is far different than PvE. the players think and change tactics and adapt. so in turn you must do so as well. the speed would increase as well as intensity. lets say that it is scripted so all that enter become instantly hostile to everyone else there. this provides an opportunity for all play types to do what they do best. its kind of hard to sneak attack someone with their guard down (but who would have there guard down in such a place) when you must give an RP out and announce your presence by toggling them hostile. this is a place where prowness in combat will be awarded in the server through victories.

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this could all be done IG without the need for devs to develop an area, sure. intrepid players could develop something where this could be implemented without the need for any scripting or catering. DM supervision might be desired, but if the PLAYERS acted appropriately, then they would not be required at all.

one reason this topic is up is because nobody has taken it upon themselves to do this themselves IG. gladiatorial events are created by the rich to become richer. to make money through the brutal acts of survival. it attracts seekers of thrill wanting mortal combat as well as those with the affinity to wager. in other words entertainment. and entertainment is a cash cow. but then again. this is kind of where a game manager would be needed. the players only make up a small % of the population of the server. history shows that the GP enjoy such activities and they would make up the backbone of profits in this. not the .1% that is the player base. making money through the player base would be ineffective. making money through the GP of the sword coast would be though.

[Planehopper]

Who has the cajones to come get him? No one even tries. Those that have, have won but they went all nicey nice and did not kill him.....I am one of those players that would honor that just FYI for you aspiring assassins, name makers and whatnot out there!

Now, now. Let's not exaggerate. I have witnessed Kory killed and RP'd resurrecting him in fact. Don't you recall, north of Beregost? A mage who had been RPing a bandit for some time had killed you and Zahven came upon it, killed the mage, and resurrected you.

The mage did quit playing the mage when he was killed though, maybe you were thinking of that.

I say that to say that PvP is obviously a tricky thing, even for those of you pushing for it. We have rules in place that have been developed over the course of YEARS and hundreds of encounters. If you wish the rules changed, lobby that.

Don't make different rules for different areas.

[Calodan]

Who has the cajones to come get him? No one even tries. Those that have, have won but they went all nicey nice and did not kill him.....I am one of those players that would honor that just FYI for you aspiring assassins, name makers and whatnot out there!

Now, now. Let's not exaggerate. I have witnessed Kory killed and RP'd resurrecting him in fact. Don't you recall, north of Beregost? A mage who had been RPing a bandit for some time had killed you and Zahven came upon it, killed the mage, and resurrected you.

The mage did quit playing the mage when he was killed though, maybe you were thinking of that.

I say that to say that PvP is obviously a tricky thing, even for those of you pushing for it. We have rules in place that have been developed over the course of YEARS and hundreds of encounters. If you wish the rules changed, lobby that.

Don't make different rules for different areas.

OH right! Raseal and his Banite priest did kill his arse. I stand corrected sir! So Kory almost died. I sat online waiting to be res'd for like an hour or more. Just laying there. So yeah out of sheer luck one time he got resurrected. In fact that Rasael ripped his heart out of his chest and left a rose in it's place? Been a bit....

I would rather try the new style rules in certain areas first. More of a training exercise. See how it goes you know? Maybe not make a area cause we are trying to make the server stable but maybe certain areas should be made this way with a few signs and some IG announcements of the new rules in those areas? Of course there will be growing pains and maybe it will be a failed experiment and easily undone by removing signs from the areas and making more announcements?