Updated Server Rules - Pregnancy requires DM approval?

[DM Nilbog]

Ok i am going to give a warning here if this debate turns into anymore fingerpointing or bashes on others it will be locked. The DM team debated this for a long long time before Novus posted the rule change it wasn't a one day and done thing. We had numerous examples to choose from they do not need to be posted here and that is what we based the decision on.

[Words]

It is a little bit strange that something we perceive as natural and good is suddenly something that we need to tiptoe around, or even entirely avoid because it might offend other players. For a while this seemed to be alright – and now it isn't (without supervision).

As others have mentioned, a character having children could and would greatly affect their lives and way of reasoning, which gives great opportunity for character development. The ones that are suggesting "mature servers" for this seem to have missed the point. Since when did children become "mature content?" And what is next on the list of bannable actions? We are no longer allowed to play brothers and sisters, because that also suggests that someone, at some point in time, shared a bed with someone else? And then, are we no longer allowed to role-play romantic relationships, because someone might be offended by that as well? And then what?

The player base claims to support role-playing, but from what I can gather here, the window for said role-playing is closing more and more by the minute. It will be a sad day when all children, brothers and wives are removed from fiction altogether – and quite a bit dull too.

But it seems that it's decided upon already and not up for discussion. It is what it is.

[Torgerias]

I don't think this has anything to do with people being offended by "R-Rated RP" and everything to do with the fact that this server is not policed to ensure that people who are of "consenting age" are the only ones playing on it. The last time this came up, in a thread about ERP, I had to make the same point: there is no age verification system in place on this server (and it would be impossible, and senseless, to put one in place), and the server could face serious consequences if underage individuals are playing on it and engaging in ERP. A control on RPing pregnancy is a logical step towards stopping this from happening. This has nothing to do with what people don't like and everything to do with placing sensible boundaries on what is and is not appropriate in a setting that by necessity has to be moderated.

[mireigi]

I've updated the vote options to allow for a wider selection of oppinions.

Will everyone who have voted already please vote again? I'm curious to see what the tally might end up being.

Ok i am going to give a warning here if this debate turns into anymore fingerpointing or bashes on others it will be locked. The DM team debated this for a long long time before Novus posted the rule change it wasn't a one day and done thing. We had numerous examples to choose from they do not need to be posted here and that is what we based the decision on.

Rather than lock a thread that, bar a few people, have been more civil than the usual run-of-the-mill-paladin thread, how about deleting the offending posts instead and letting the debate continue?

[JCVD1]

I don't think this has anything to do with people being offended by "R-Rated RP" and everything to do with the fact that this server is not policed to ensure that people who are of "consenting age" are the only ones playing on it. The last time this came up, in a thread about ERP, I had to make the same point: there is no age verification system in place on this server (and it would be impossible, and senseless, to put one in place), and the server could face serious consequences if underage individuals are playing on it and engaging in ERP. A control on RPing pregnancy is a logical step towards stopping this from happening. This has nothing to do with what people don't like and everything to do with placing sensible boundaries on what is and is not appropriate in a setting that by necessity has to be moderated.

My father raised me. He taught me wrong from right and certainly did not count on the internet,games and stranger to do so. It's not our responsability to raise children of others. IT's not the internet's,any forums or game's.

Also, that is utter speculation that the server will face consequances if a minor is courted by an old pervert. Even the old pervert won't be in trouble if the "minor" lies about his of her age.

ChatRoulette is a shining exemple of inapropriate things going on with minors and perverts. The people get arrested and the site still runs strong.

[mireigi]

I don't think this has anything to do with people being offended by "R-Rated RP" and everything to do with the fact that this server is not policed to ensure that people who are of "consenting age" are the only ones playing on it. The last time this came up, in a thread about ERP, I had to make the same point: there is no age verification system in place on this server (and it would be impossible, and senseless, to put one in place), and the server could face serious consequences if underage individuals are playing on it and engaging in ERP. A control on RPing pregnancy is a logical step towards stopping this from happening. This has nothing to do with what people don't like and everything to do with placing sensible boundaries on what is and is not appropriate in a setting that by necessity has to be moderated.

My father raised me. He taught me wrong from right and certainly did not count on the internet,games and stranger to do so. It's not our responsability to raise children of others. IT's not the internet's,any forums or game's.

Also, that is utter speculation that the server will face consequances if a minor is courted by an old pervert. Even the old pervert won't be in trouble if the "minor" lies about his of her age.

ChatRoulette is a shining exemple of inapropriate things going on with minors and perverts. The people get arrested and the site still runs strong.

JCVD1. You share some of my and, if the votes are any indication, others oppinions as well. For that you have my thanks. But the tone you apply to your posts is not helpful to the debate. I'd like to politely ask you to take a deep breath and think your words through before you post, so the wording is not offensive and gets the thread locked.

[Torgerias]

My father raised me. He taught me wrong from right

I wish we could count on everyone to behave that way but, sadly, we can't, which is why rules are in place. Everyone should also keep in mind that the server is hosted in the U.S. and it could simply be shut down by the host if they caught wind of something legally questionable going on - even if the players and DMs weren't legally liable, they could be.

[Flasmix]

I admit to being jaded, but that's after being here for a while and keep in mind, I was a DM as well. I used to catch people ERPing and I've seen some questionable things since coming back in January.

It's just a sad case of a select few immature PCs that abused things in the past and set a precedent for how things go on now. It's no one individual at fault, but it's rules we all must adhere to. There are horror stories from other servers when there are no rules in place.

[mireigi]

It's just a sad case of a select few immature PCs that abused things in the past and set a precedent for how things go on now. It's no one individual at fault, but it's rules we all must adhere to. There are horror stories from other servers when there are no rules in place.

I completely agree with that sentiment. The rules are there for a reason. However, that doesn't mean that the rules cannot be discussed openly among those that they affect - the players.

I've seen and heard some of the horrors from other servers as well. Those are not the things I wish for here on BG. But being able to RP pregnancy if you stay away from danger? I don't believe that to be a horrific thing.

That being said, there are a lot of different people from a multitude of cultures and religions on the server and it can be difficult not to offend anyone at all. What's passable in my culture as an IC joke in a D&D setting might not be in yours and vice versa. The best we can do is try to keep it within the confines of the rules and the setting, hoping that whomever is on the other end doesn't get offended or at least is man or woman enough to not go on a rampage because of it, but initiate dialog about it.

[AC81]

I don't think this has anything to do with people being offended by "R-Rated RP" and everything to do with the fact that this server is not policed to ensure that people who are of "consenting age" are the only ones playing on it. The last time this came up, in a thread about ERP, I had to make the same point: there is no age verification system in place on this server (and it would be impossible, and senseless, to put one in place), and the server could face serious consequences if underage individuals are playing on it and engaging in ERP. A control on RPing pregnancy is a logical step towards stopping this from happening. This has nothing to do with what people don't like and everything to do with placing sensible boundaries on what is and is not appropriate in a setting that by necessity has to be moderated.

My father raised me. He taught me wrong from right and certainly did not count on the internet,games and stranger to do so. It's not our responsability to raise children of others. IT's not the internet's,any forums or game's.

Also, that is utter speculation that the server will face consequances if a minor is courted by an old pervert. Even the old pervert won't be in trouble if the "minor" lies about his of her age.

ChatRoulette is a shining exemple of inapropriate things going on with minors and perverts. The people get arrested and the site still runs strong.

ChatRoulette is a shining example of everything we DON'T want our server to be. ERP doesn't need to be a part of this server IMO. I'm not saying there aren't RPers who could do it - there are. I just think 99% of those that tried would contribute to this server becoming a laughing stock.

[grymhild]

First off, not everyone on this server is a guy, I know that I'm not and I know other people who aren't ... and even if it were all guys, how dare anyone try to shame someone else for RPing another gender.

How is that any more "weird" than roleplaying an a wizard, or orc, or paladin, or drow?

This is my first, and pretty much only PW that I've ever played on, and I think the "PG-13" rules are immersion breaking (people love to throw that phrase around when something happens they don't like). I would much rather see the server rated M-Mature or R-rate.

Just put a disclaimer and an age questionnaire to consent on the server (others have done it) and if someone lies on that, it's on them.

It doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't have rules, but those policies should be majority rule with minority rights.

Now that said, I personally don't want to be involved in certain things - but as a player, I can opt out of that.

I don't want people godmodding and having orgies in the streets of BG or in front of FAI - but the move to not allow pregnancies(requiring DM approval is basically the same thing) because it means that the people must have had sex ... I don't even know how to respond to people who think that's a big deal. That's like ... 1950's television that couldn't show a husband and wife sleeping in the same bed.

In PG-13 shows - sex happens. It does. So does pregnancy... and guess what pregnancy is a NORMAL PART OF LIFE... without it, there would be NO LIFE

So, it's perfectly fine to go on and on about new ways to kill the most people in the shortest time, to execute people in really horrible ways, but we can't talk about how new life is created?

The whole "play what is on your character sheet" is not universally or fairly enforced. It's not, and the DMs know it, and the players know it. And play what is on your character sheet is not sufficient reason to not allow a character to be pregnant.

Half-dwarves, fey, cambions, dragons.... are over looked, while certain other people are made examples of ... *sigh*

I agree with the comment about sometimes feeling that I'm in the Westboro Baptist Church ... *sigh*

I'm not sure what the people in charge what this server to be?

Is this game just a grind machine where your munchkin can run in circles killing the same monsters over and over so that when you get into an event so you can have even more monsters thrown at you until you have nearly everyone dead, just to have the DM back off a little and "let" you win?

Is that really what people want?

[Snarfy]

All I know is I play on this server to engage in some good old fantasy RP and kill some orges and undead... ya know? No offence to anyone RP'ing someone pregnant or having a child IG but the moment you start trying to engage my character with anything related to pregnancy, your newborn, breastfeeding, or whatever, I am likely going to remove myself from the RP.

It's called Dungeons and Dragons, not Dungeons and Diapers.

[Aeb Ankor]

RPing in-game pregnancy should not be allowed. RP having children that exist in your character story but are out side of the scope of other player's character interactions, because they do not exist in game, is fine.

Reason pregnancy implies risk of baby harm or death... not acceptable in our stories. This death could be from a multitude of reasons, adventuring mother in harm's way, dragon's burning cities, miscarriage, natural causes, evil causes, diety causes, etc.

This is not ok in a situation where the other player may be another parent's 13 year old child.

You want to be pregnant, tell your pregnancy stories in private forum fictions while your character takes 9 months+ away from game, mention your child growing up away from the in game possibilities of another player's control.

There are no children player controlled characters, it is simple you don't get to have a 10 year old, a 5 year old, or a fetus standing with you in ANY in game stories.

[Eclypticon]

First, I want to point out that I am in favor of M17 status for the server, but I am not in favor of ERP. Since ERP is not alowed, I think pregnancy should require DM approval. I think it should require retirement for the duration except under special circumstances like magic. That should also be DM approved. I do not want to see any pregnant elves grinding in Cloakwood with their orc lover. That stuff is just too immersion breaking even for me.

[dak12attack]

lol this thread