Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

As I've said before, I think some class types have a difficult time hunting on their own. And in some cases, that, plus a lack of time, means that quests are, on occasion, the best way to progress.

So, in that regard, quests, while not truly necessary, are very, very helpful.

I think you miss the point of a system where pooled XP is integrated. The pooled XP would give more XP than normal when certain XP awards are earned. AKA killing a monster and or camp fire RP. So basically even though you only get lets say 1 XP per kill on a monster if you have pooled XP for the weekly bonus you get of 8500 XP (this is the amount a Epic PC gets running quests the number is actually higher for PCs 12-19) that 1 XP becomes say 36 XP instead. So basically it could tick off 35 extra bonus XP until the entire pool of 8500 XP is depleted until 7 days from the time it hits 0. So the basically the argument that PC builds have a harder time killing things is not a good one since you could go kill something completely harmless to the build and still get a good XP reward until your pooled XP is depleted. To add to this one could also gain the bonus 35 XP when you get a RP award. So normal RP reward is around 20-35 or so. With the bonus XP of 35 you could wind up getting 55-85 RP XP a tick while talking with another PC. Coupled with some other things like dungeon diving or fishing one could earn there 8500 XP in just a couple of hours much like the quests but instead get to do something that is far less immersion breaking as repeatedly capturing Radger the badger or meta questing the Imp evil quest. This gives a RP friendly option to ALL builds and ALL alignments that does not require any Meta OOC mechanics. For Gray orcs they have to enter the towns where they would be killed and thusly have to meat AFK tag themselves. The vast majority of quests on the surface are geared and awarded towards good PCs that do things for the good of it. Bonus XP on those quests is also geared towards a goodly answer thusly forcing evil toons to Meta their PC most times in order to get this XP. It was my understanding the quests are very much a server way of getting XP without having to grind, grind, grind the maps. It is just flawed in the process of being a XP system. I agree it should be a gold system instead and XP should just be awarded weekly to a Pool system that you have to earn XP rewards for the bonus XP to be awarded. If you do not RP or go kill something then you do not get the XP. So it would not be free XP at all. Merely a bit of bonus XP that is already awarded but not in a fashion that is suitable for all players to earn the XP without losing ones soul in the process of repeatedly doing the same mindless tasks over and over be it questing or grinding. If you participate in a weekly RP session a couple of hours and you would be awarded the full 8500 XP and you got to do whatever you wanted.

To be clear I am not saying remove the quests. I am saying make their reward gold instead and nothing else. Like jobs that way PCs do not have to rely on dungeon diving to get a great drop for gold to afford the new epic gear shop. I am just saying that our way of awarding the 8500 XP is flawed and should be re-thought and modified.

Hi!

Instead of weekly or daily quests, how about cutting the reset time in half?

All quests reset in 3 days.

Middle ground and all...

~A

Sounds good.

i think it's bad that a surface char can get 8-10k in quest xp & a UD character can get around 4-5k.

This suggestion makes the current unfairness 7x worse.

While I don't disagree with the suggestion in principle, the gap between surface & UD quests needs to be corrected first.

lilani wrote:i think it's bad that a surface char can get 8-10k in quest xp & a UD character can get around 4-5k.

This suggestion makes the current unfairness 7x worse.

While I don't disagree with the suggestion in principle, the gap between surface & UD quests needs to be corrected first.

Surface quests can take 3+ hours to complete where the UD quests can be completed in 1.5 hours. I think it is more than fair. You get roughly 75% of what the surface gets for half the time. It levels out just fine.

Calodan wrote:

lilani wrote:i think it's bad that a surface char can get 8-10k in quest xp & a UD character can get around 4-5k.

This suggestion makes the current unfairness 7x worse.

While I don't disagree with the suggestion in principle, the gap between surface & UD quests needs to be corrected first.

Surface quests can take 3+ hours to complete where the UD quests can be completed in 1.5 hours. I think it is more than fair. You get roughly 75% of what the surface gets for half the time. It levels out just fine.

It doesn't level out at all. I'm unsure how a prospective 70k vs 35k (or 50k if they get your 'generous 75%' is level because it's simply not - it's clearly skewed in favour of the larger number.

My point is that there should be the same number of quests on both the surface and the underdark - that would be fair. (And frankly quick to implement).

Then you can make questing more common and both sides would receive the same benefits and that would be level and just fine.

As is, you'd be handing far more so to the surface which already levels far faster.

My understanding is new quests are not necessarily quick to implement, especially not if they are going to have a decent reason for being repeatable quests. Just look at the new quests that have been added to the server and the number of fixes tfunke and others have had to do... (turning them off for fixes/removal of exploits, etc....)

Of course if PC's were given a weekly XP pool after they completed all quests (either Surface or UD) once, then it would be much more even... Just think, once you hit ~15th level or so or group up so that you are able to turn in all your quests you could loot grind/xp grind/campfire RP/go fishing/whatever-you-want that grants XP and just get more each week until your [8-10,000 XP] pool has been exhausted... You get the same XP as weekly questing, but you gain it while doing the things you actually enjoy doing with your time on the server (including questing, by the way...if you still want to do the quests for gold you'll gain XP as you battle enemies, unlock chests or RP with others while doing the quests).

As I've pointed out on another thread, the issue really being addressed here is that the xp grind is a bad implementation.

I understand people don't want someone to go from level 1-30 in a couple of days but having to kill over 1,000 monsters to gain a level is also not a good solution.

Grinding is anti-fun.

Obviously this post is asking for an alternative & rightfully so - if anyone thinks repeating a task 1,000+ times is fun, then please don't host parties

I personally think that this would essentially replace one grind with another (monsters for questing) so let me throw out a different alternative.

Instead of nerfing xp, put a limit on how many levels a player can gain per week, e.g can gain 3 levels per week and 1 level per week post 20. This would take around 16 weeks (or 4 months) to reach 30 - adjust as suits.

With this in place you can the restore experience gain without forcing the full grind.

Players can then grind their level for the week either solo or part of a group & then spend the rest of their time role playing - players can then go and adventure in hunting areas for fun, Rp - they'd still gain treasure and can help others who needn't their weekly level.

This solution removes the grind and keeps a brake on how fast players can level.

lilani wrote:I understand people don't want someone to go from level 1-30 in a couple of days but having to kill over 1,000 monsters to gain a level is also not a good solution.

Grinding is anti-fun.

Obviously this post is asking for an alternative & rightfully so - if anyone thinks repeating a task 1,000+ times is fun, then please don't host parties

I personally think that this would essentially replace one grind with another (monsters for questing) so let me throw out a different alternative.

You do realize many of the quests require you to go out and fight/kill monsters? The same ones you killed yesterday/last week/whatever... How is this different from grinding?

I do like your idea of capping XP/level gain, but restoring XP awards since it essentially forces players to RP the slower build from 1-30, but my guess is some players who are able to spend far more time in game would argue that if they have the time to commit and want to speed level their toon there should not be an artificial mechanic in place to prevent that...

*shrug* Important thing to remember/consider is that everyone has different idea's of what is fun/un-fun... how you feel about slaying 1,000's of monsters is how I feel about the weekly quests. I used them each week to level up my first character to 30, but any more I simply can't stomach them (hence why my Bard is level 27 even though he's been played for a year and a half!) Weekly quests are the epitome of doing the same task over and over, each week...that's exactly what they are! At least with monsters I can haunt different area's of the server, occasionally get lucky with a semi-decent piece of loot to use, sell or trade or otherwise have something unexpected happen either by running in to another player or having way more powerful enemies spawn then I thought or some other unanticipated thing... With questing you know exactly what to do, exactly what you'll face, and exactly what the outcome will be...every time.

chad878262 wrote: You do realize many of the quests require you to go out and fight/kill monsters? The same ones you killed yesterday/last week/whatever... How is this different from grinding?

If you re-read my post, you'll see that was my point.

I do like your idea of capping XP/level gain, but restoring XP awards since it essentially forces players to RP the slower build from 1-30, but my guess is some players who are able to spend far more time in game would argue that if they have the time to commit and want to speed level their toon there should not be an artificial mechanic in place to prevent that...

Precisely, the solution is more eloquent because it achieves the goal of preventing players from advancing too quickly while at the same time allowing people to go out and grind quests & farm dungeons as much as they want or alternatively stand around town and roleplay to their hearts desire - all without feeling penalised or forced into grinding to gain that next level.

This solution removes the grind and keeps a brake on how fast players can level.

Ummm no it does not.....It just makes the grind the quests instead. Moving one grind to another is not a solution. Weekly XP pool is because you can either Dungeon dive which to my knowledge is what DUNGEONS and Dragons is all about or you can Campfire RP or you can Fish or you can quest and the monsters will drop more XP while you earn gold from questing. That is a real solution since it lets the player decide how they want to obtain their 8500 XP. To further point out this 8500 XP is for everyone UD and Surface alike. Also it would make monsters drop more XP per kill. So make it tick off 35 extra XP per kill or per XP REWARD however that is done and be done with it. That would mean you could be killing monsters that give 35 XP and they would award 70 XP per kill. Or if you are RPing by the fire you get 35 more XP per RP XP award thusly hitting the cap faster and you can then do other things sooner. It does not increase the leveling one can get done in a week since it is XP already awarded in the most atrocious form ever. Questing. The quests would not disappear but instead just give gold. UD quests could be adjusted to give the same amount of gold as the surface quests in total as well.

Calodan wrote:

This solution removes the grind and keeps a brake on how fast players can level.

Ummm no it does not.....It just makes the grind the quests instead. Moving one grind to another is not a solution. Weekly XP pool is because you can either Dungeon dive which to my knowledge is what DUNGEONS and Dragons is all about or you can Campfire RP or you can Fish or you can quest and the monsters will drop more XP while you earn gold from questing. That is a real solution since it lets the player decide how they want to obtain their 8500 XP. To further point out this 8500 XP is for everyone UD and Surface alike. Also it would make monsters drop more XP per kill. So make it tick off 35 extra XP per kill or per XP REWARD however that is done and be done with it. That would mean you could be killing monsters that give 35 XP and they would award 70 XP per kill. Or if you are RPing by the fire you get 35 more XP per RP XP award thusly hitting the cap faster and you can then do other things sooner. It does not increase the leveling one can get done in a week since it is XP already awarded in the most atrocious form ever. Questing. The quests would not disappear but instead just give gold. UD quests could be adjusted to give the same amount of gold as the surface quests in total as well.

Did you even read my post? I'd suggest reading it again as I didn't make the point you are seemingly arguing against.