Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

Thayvian wrote:

ZestyDragon wrote:A level 10 cap will never happen. Its an old server with an active population, who for the most part like the way it is.

As it was said earlier no one is an Elminster, the DMs have always treated PC's at about a mid power level e.g half your level, or the other counter part of npc's being twice the level they have in DnD. Further if you think being level 30 makes you the top, you are very wrong. There is a big difference between a new level 30 and a six year old level 30. so the progression of a character exists outside of the levelling system already. Your complaint is that high levels throw their weight around, well of course they do. People know them their opinion is trusted, their skills in combat have been witnessed. Why would people listen to the new guy fresh of the boat, over the person they have fought beside and spent time with over the years. Why would they be scared of someone who has no fame or infamy? Baring the personality traits.

Fact is adventures are a very very small portion of the population. So if you have not meet the person before, its more likely they are just an average joe then an adventurer. Then take into account the mentality that goes with adventuring e.g running through deadly dungeons in search of massive amounts of wealth or w/e. Then its more then plausible that average joe just ain't that intimidating, after all you did just head down to rob a floating eye ball that shoots magical laser beams.

You're losing players however and they will eventually stop getting new ones. As a new player. I see that I doubt that I will ignore these issue forever. And Log off. I'm tempted at this point to make my own BG recreation PW sever. Just to get back some of that D&D feel of old.

id help you, but dnd lore is idiotic and tiresome, imho. i only came here after mask of the betrayer, which had some excellent higher plane lore and storytellng. then after playing here for a while, i hear layer after layer of eyerolling canon, written by pulp authors, trying to mimic the silly and ridiculous lore of greek mythology, or worse, mimicing collegiate history texts, which as a history major, ive had enough real world history text and cadence, to suffer through the make-belive world of DnD.

but, no, the server is doing fine, and there will always be players rotating in and out.

please try to maje arguments based on your positions, and not dire warning of the server going to hell. I've been here long enough to know that argument has been made to bolster a case for over 5 years, and it hasnt happened yet.

Diamore wrote:

Thayvian wrote: Okay??? Than why are the Dm's on so many severs aware of the issue. And I've seen it more than a handful of times. On many severs. Sometimes it's subtle.

This is How you lose players right here. You see people Sign Up for a PW roleplay and EXPECT the BG to be solid and Persistent.

Firstly, this thread was a request for help with your RP in dealing with the issues described. I have answered it as such.

Secondly, you have misconstrued by statement about expectations and I do not know how. The server and the ongoing RP here is solid and persistent.

I disagree very much to the PW and being Solid. Otherwise I would not be bringing it up. I will give great examples here.

High levels are a RARITY in Forgotten Realms. There are only So many blackstaffs, elminsters and Drizzit's.

To conclude again as I feel people are mistakenly taking this personally now.

When you see people Casting high level spells infront of the guards. And Commoners. You would SCARE the crap out of those Commoners. This is NOT PW RP it's a joke. And their are hundreds of examples of this and things like this.

So yes my Original question is how do you RP when everyone around you is a god. ACT like a god yourself? Because that is what you seem to be suggesting. And I feel that every time I have to encounter some player that should be hundreds of years old to be at level 30. EI like the Immortal Elminster. It ruins the game.. And again as a new player if the game continues to be bad. We STOP showing up. And I have taken a break from this sever for this very reason. And. I have had FRIENDS QUIT this sever for this very reason.

So yes how do you RP when it's game breakingly BAD to see people ignore LORE. Ignore thier gods IE casting like no tomorrow (Mystra would be pissed, it's even the lore, even Elminster talks about it Constantly, for the misuse of magic) Walking gods that can take out dragons by blinking.

Anyways I'm sorry if anyone's feelings are hurt. I'm suggesting that the current LEVEL CAP ruins RP.

Not that everyone's RP is bad. And regardless if I did say that . A Negative statement is not a hang able offense. Some people DO suck at RP.

NeOmega wrote:

Thayvian wrote:

ZestyDragon wrote:A level 10 cap will never happen. Its an old server with an active population, who for the most part like the way it is.

As it was said earlier no one is an Elminster, the DMs have always treated PC's at about a mid power level e.g half your level, or the other counter part of npc's being twice the level they have in DnD. Further if you think being level 30 makes you the top, you are very wrong. There is a big difference between a new level 30 and a six year old level 30. so the progression of a character exists outside of the levelling system already. Your complaint is that high levels throw their weight around, well of course they do. People know them their opinion is trusted, their skills in combat have been witnessed. Why would people listen to the new guy fresh of the boat, over the person they have fought beside and spent time with over the years. Why would they be scared of someone who has no fame or infamy? Baring the personality traits.

Fact is adventures are a very very small portion of the population. So if you have not meet the person before, its more likely they are just an average joe then an adventurer. Then take into account the mentality that goes with adventuring e.g running through deadly dungeons in search of massive amounts of wealth or w/e. Then its more then plausible that average joe just ain't that intimidating, after all you did just head down to rob a floating eye ball that shoots magical laser beams.

You're losing players however and they will eventually stop getting new ones. As a new player. I see that I doubt that I will ignore these issue forever. And Log off. I'm tempted at this point to make my own BG recreation PW sever. Just to get back some of that D&D feel of old.

id help you, but dnd lore is idiotic and tiresome, imho. i only came here after mask of the betrayer, which had some excellent higher plane lore and storytellng. then after playing here for a while, i hear layer after layer of eyerolling canon, written by pulp authors, trying to mimic the silly and ridiculous lore of greek mythology, or worse, mimicing collegiate history texts, which as a history major, ive had enough real world history text and cadence, to suffer through the make-belive world of DnD.

but, no, the server is doing fine, and there will always be players rotating in and out.

please try to maje arguments based on your positions, and not dire warning of the server going to hell. I've been here long enough to know that argument has been made to bolster a case for over 5 years, and it hasnt happened yet.

Okay... sure.

Maecius-
"It's especially important that we make new players feel welcome here. New players are a large part of what keeps us going when older players burn out, take breaks, or otherwise move on for a while (and sometimes never return). If we fail to continually renew ourselves as a server with new and returning players, we'll eventually dwindle away." - Maecius

I have not suggested acting like a god, perhaps you should take some time before returning and rereading my recommendations.

The server does not match your personal expectations of the perfect recreation of the original material. This does not negate the RP that does occur here nor the consistency provided by players and staff. It simply means you would prefer a change.

You seem to have moved on to simply complaining and quoting block text now rather than engaging in discussion so I will avoid offering any new suggestions. Enjoy your time on the server.

Feel welcome yes. Not change the server to appease them at the expense of current players. New players won't matter at all if all the old players leave. There might be one or two new players a month however there are a few hundred old players who cycle in and out all year round. This stops being a thing when all their years of characters, gear and rp is wiped out to reset the server to level 10 limit. Which by the way would not be enjoyed by all new players as is apparent simply in the feedback your getting here.

Short answer. Without touching the mechanics, you need to re-evaluate your suspension levels. There are going to be level 30s that kill dragons, liches etc. If you can adapt that would be great. If not you are going to face the same issue with no possible solution

Thayvian wrote:

Diamore wrote:

Thayvian wrote: Okay??? Than why are the Dm's on so many severs aware of the issue. And I've seen it more than a handful of times. On many severs. Sometimes it's subtle.

This is How you lose players right here. You see people Sign Up for a PW roleplay and EXPECT the BG to be solid and Persistent.

Firstly, this thread was a request for help with your RP in dealing with the issues described. I have answered it as such.

Secondly, you have misconstrued by statement about expectations and I do not know how. The server and the ongoing RP here is solid and persistent.

I disagree very much to the PW and being Solid. Otherwise I would not be bringing it up. I will give great examples here.

High levels are a RARITY in Forgotten Realms. There are only So many blackstaffs, elminsters and Drizzit's.

To conclude again as I feel people are mistakenly taking this personally now.

When you see people Casting high level spells infront of the guards. And Commoners. You would SCARE the crap out of those Commoners. This is NOT PW RP it's a joke. And their are hundreds of examples of this and things like this.

So yes my Original question is how do you RP when everyone around you is a god. ACT like a god yourself? Because that is what you seem to be suggesting. And I feel that every time I have to encounter some player that should be hundreds of years old to be at level 30. EI like the Immortal Elminster. It ruins the game.. And again as a new player if the game continues to be bad. We STOP showing up. And I have taken a break from this sever for this very reason. And. I have had FRIENDS QUIT this sever for this very reason.

So yes how do you RP when it's game breakingly BAD to see people ignore LORE. Ignore thier gods IE casting like no tomorrow (Mystra would be pissed, it's even the lore, even Elminster talks about it Constantly, for the misuse of magic) Walking gods that can take out dragons by blinking.

Anyways I'm sorry if anyone's feelings are hurt. I'm suggesting that the LEVEL CAP ruins RP.

Not that everyone's RP is bad. And regardless if I did say that . A Negative statement is not a hang able offense. Some people DO suck at RP.

I disagree with this statement of yours strongly. You have not been here long enough to know the established LORE of this PW. As I am sure you are aware being a player of PnP and lore that PW established lore is part of the RP as well. In this world we have established things in lore as you see them being RP'd IG.

Now to take your stance on people sucking at RP then this would suggest it is not us that suck at the RP here. Point in case we all know and accept the lore of this realm that is established and RP it thusly. This would be CORRECT RP and or GOOD RP.

With that in mind by your own words the player who refuses to recognize established lore of the server is the one who sucks at RP. Not the players who all know the lore of the server which is strongly based on D&D forgotten realms. No need to even bring up edition because we are a bit of a homebrew here. Hence the 30 levels and being able to slay dragons and walk through hell fires.

Diamore wrote:I have not suggested acting like a god, perhaps you should take some time before returning and rereading my recommendations.

The server does not match your personal expectations of the perfect recreation of the original material. This does not negate the RP that does occur here nor the consistency provided by players and staff. It simply means you would prefer a change.

You seem to have moved on to simply complaining and quoting block text now rather than engaging in discussion so I will avoid offering any new suggestions. Enjoy your time on the server.

You seem to be making this very personal. And framing my points as personal attacks against the player base which is not the case.

I would ask you that you not do that and to remember I'm being objective. Thus the qoutes and examples and counter point.

Yes you are very much Right the Sever does not match my IDEAL but it does not mean that I don't want to play here. I also find your statement that any of this is a Complaint a tiny bit insulting.

Which as stated above in today's cult like culture any negative comment is pretty much as bad as murder.

No one can take Negative Critique anymore with out it being insulting.

Anyways it's not a complaint. It's an objective observation that obviously have been talked about for years.

"perhaps you should take some time before returning and rereading my recommendations. "
Highly insulting. Why? Making observations is not a crime. I am NOT upset or angry. I am not complaining. I am stating that the HIGH LEVEL CAP Ruins RP and have given many examples of this.

I have made my points clear as possible. As I feel you are taking this personally. I will no longer engage or respond to your specific questions on this thread. And I'm sorry that my view is so alien to yours. The LORE is very Important to me. This is the ONLY BG sever there is. And saddly when MOST of the lore gets tossed out the window. Ignored and just overlooked the game FEELS like BG in only name alone. It's okay to Say something about it.

Why do you think it's NOT okay to talk about it's NOT complaining it's a Distinct and very troubling observation.

Many Serves go through resets again only a suggestion. And Very seldom do they loosethere entire player base.

Also as stated above. If you have been level 30 or above for years you should delete your character and create a new one. And take all your items with you. (just my personal opinion)

In conclusion the STATEMENT having a high level cap ruins RP. And How do I RP out of this OBVIOUS and GLARINGLY DIFFICULT RP conundrum.

And again I'm sorry if you feel that it's a personal attack it's not. Is everyone here afraid of taking a look at the LORE and at least trying to to follow it. ?

Mystra get's annoyed when you missus magic. Frivolously. This is common Lore. Elmninster talks about it.

Why is the LORE not important I guess.

Also Change is GOOD. Move on delete your old Characters Make new ones.

i have suggested pocketing higher levels before i left. (mchanically encouraging epics to head to rashemon and the planes)

It had 0 support for it.

there was, "if im level 30, i should be able to go where i want, and have influence on the sword coast!"

ie i am in the NFL, but i still should be able to play pee wee football if i want

and then it devolved into, "i agree, my epic toon needs better places with better xp, but still wanna terrorize noobs at the fai"

meh.

Okay...after reading all of this thread, I have to ask:

What, exactly, are you asking to change? All you're doing so far is venting steam over personal dislikes. If someone's harrassing you unfairly, you can already report those people to the DM team. That seems to be your main issue?

The power levels of individuals vs lore is just something you have to rationalise on your own. My main character is level 21. Technically by gameplay mechanics she is epic levelled and could kick a lot of tail. Realistically, she's not that strong a character RP wise and has relied fairly heavily on others in combat situations - and she's still clueless on a lot of things, to boot.

Maybe someone else might decide that they're RPing a tough guy. Sure. Okay. And now they're bothering you and metagaming. Can't you just report that?

Again, what are you asking to see changed here, exactly?


edit - as for that pocketing idea, that won't do anything. Making it more difficult for people to backtrack to lowbie areas just makes it less desirable for high levels to come and RP peacably in an area of their choosing. Meanwhile those that get their jollies by harrassing lower levels will still do that. It has no benefits.

I don't see how the level cap ruins RP, honestly, unless you want to roleplay a specific way and not have to deal with consequences of doing so.

In-character actions should have in-character consequences, always, and if there's conflict brewing, and nobody has the sense to back down and it comes to blows/fireballs/whatever, someone's going to end up the loser in the scenario. If that's not a risk a player is willing to take with their character, they should avoid getting into that sort of situation.

By server rules, there's always the requirement of giving a RP'd out to anyone who might be a target of your attacks. Sometimes that "out" is "if you leave now I will not attack you".

There's nothing inherently meta-gamey about conflict like this, in my opinion. Characters have plenty of options available to avoid a fight, but often are too stubborn to back down in a situation that may warrant it. We need to accept as players that our characters are not the biggest fish in the pond, as it were - we exist in a world with extraordinary people. Maybe you're one of them. Maybe you're not, yet. But generally, it's a safe assumption that no matter how powerful you are, there's someone out there who could make quick work of you.

Regarding the specific incident that triggered this conversation, there was arguing and posturing on both sides, and you cast Finger of Death at someone and got a beatdown in response. I don't think that complaining that the person should have left you alone/was metagaming because they were higher level and responded the way they did is really a sensible argument to be making. It escalated and you chose to stand your ground IC, which means you are also accepting the consequences of that.

On a server with no real penalty for PvP deaths, I don't see why it's such a big deal other than a temporarily bruised ego.

The server is very welcoming to new players. That doesn't have to mean it lets new players posture at known, powerful characters, be given plenty of chances to leave, but refuse, attack them, and not have consequences for doing so.

^ As the two above posts suggests No one seems to know what Meta Gaming is so how do you report it?

Thayvian wrote:^ As the two above posts suggests No one seems to know what Meta Gaming is so how do you report it?

I don't see how my or Winterborne's posts gave any indication that we 'don't know what metagaming is'.

I simply asked you a question, and Winterborne explained why your apparent poor in-character choices lead to whatever is now causing you to be here and ranting.

Metagaming is a term used in role-playing games, which describes a player's use of real-life knowledge concerning the state of the game to determine their character's actions, when said character has no relevant knowledge or awareness under the circumstances. This can refer to plot information in the game such as secrets or events occurring away from the character, as well as facets of the game's mechanics such as abstract statistics or the precise limits of abilities. Metagaming is an example of "breaking character", as the character is making decisions based on information they couldn't know and thus would not make in reality.

Metagaming is considered unsporting or cheating in a competitive gaming context, and is in general poorly received as it subverts the emphasis of accurate character depiction based on in-game experiences and back-story that defines role-playing games. Outside of role-playing, metagaming simply refers to players using knowledge or understanding of external factors (such as community trends or coincidental events) to gain an advantage in competition.

Anyways I know that SOME people are taking this thread as peronsal attacks or that I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE SERVER LORE. well your right on the latter of the two.

I don't know the server lore. But it seems to be that the SERVER is outright IGNORING SETTING LORE.

When I made Thayan character I had to STUDY everything about Thayan Culture, Politcs ect. I'm even reading several novels on it. This Included understanding my PCs Goddess MYSTRA how she works and HOW magic works. THUS I don't Miss USE magic. I follow the lore. And Server Lore.

Anyways this is devolving into Bad Wagon syndrome he said the thing we don't like IT must be a personal attack quick get the mob.

I assure you it's not the case and to honestly just not take it so personally. If you're unfamilar with the SETTING LORE I can provide many links for you. If you want me to Better Understand SERVER LORE. Than EXPLAIN why I'm being BULLIED by highre levels meta gaming and I'm seeing EPIC LEVELS everywhere?

So I'm done I will not be responding to any more posts at all. You guys have taken it out of context.

I asked for help in how to deal with the SERVER LORE.. IE being RP ganked by higher levels that don't give you any options accept leave the area. BECAUSE THAT'S GREAT RP.

And now I'm finally annoyed. If I encounter this stuff in the future I log of come back when the offender is gone. Looks like I will be playing 2 am sessons from now on just to avoid this crap.

What I find most disgusting is I KEEP saying it's happening have encountered it hundreds of times since NWN started and everyone keeps ignoring it. I mean WALKING AWAY is just the biggest kick to the teeth. Roleplay it better. LEARN THE SETTING LORE.

Dude. You have so far done nothing but antagonize people, ignore suggestions of how to deal with it, and asked the server to contort around your expectations of how the world is supposed to work, blatantly ignoring any attempts to deal with this in any sensible way.
You frequently called people out for alleged lack of knowledge and indirectly claimed them to be what amounts to gaming and lore- associated halfwits.
Where, exactly, does that not constitute personal attacks?

At any rate, I hope playing 2 AM sessions, whatever reason for that you have, may alleviate your problems, and wish you a good time on the server despite it's apparent shortcomings for you.
So far, I found it at most a bit tedious and at most two characters I tend to avoid if I can for character-tension-issues. Otherwise, I've yet to see anything complaint-worthy.

Worst-case, do that new server thing you mentioned on page 1! Then you finally have the perfect spot if push comes to shove.