Enable higher tier dungeons for all

[EasternCheesE]

Can we have UD being opened to surfacers and vice versa as a temprorary thing to go and see how it goes?
While i understand the concern about UD being flooded by surfacers and everyone starting playing drow, i'd myself just make it so UD race on surface get 50% of xp (while not killing party xp). Like, it's quite logical cause when they learn the ways to fight trolls, it's not much useful knowledge to them in UD, thus less valuable experience.

Currently, UD is almost dead with less than 10 people playing in general and rarely more than 3 of them do even play at same time.

So, if thing goes well, then cross-surface way could stay open, if it fails, we can just go back to what we have right now.

[abousalif]

I approve the suggestion of Easterncheese.

We ca discuss all we want about what could happen, but we will never really know until we try.

[Ariella]

Can we have UD being opened to surfacers and vice versa as a temprorary thing to go and see how it goes?
While i understand the concern about UD being flooded by surfacers and everyone starting playing drow, i'd myself just make it so UD race on surface get 50% of xp (while not killing party xp). Like, it's quite logical cause when they learn the ways to fight trolls, it's not much useful knowledge to them in UD, thus less valuable experience.

Currently, UD is almost dead with less than 10 people playing in general and rarely more than 3 of them do even play at same time.

So, if thing goes well, then cross-surface way could stay open, if it fails, we can just go back to what we have right now.

We already tried it, the server started with both being fully opened without even any travel rules. The problems that stemmed from that are what have lead to content being blocked on both sides. With the server split on the horizon we will be able to see more areas in both the UD and Surface as devs decide to work on them. At the end of the day most of the focus moves with the majority of the player base. Meaning unless you can convince everyone to move down under It's always going to have less content.

[c2k]

So, years ago, the Upperdark was introduced to be the areas that both the UD and the Surface could wander around. Perhaps the server shrinkage and the servers not being split has put a spur in that philosophy for the time being, but it seems that after the server split, it would be beneficial to put the highest level of content in these areas, should the above remain true.

[Svabodnik]

Possible middle-of-the-road solution could be to introduce more passages between UD and surface for higher tier dungeons, and have just those zones be shared. Could be limited to just a handful for those which already have a subterranean portion, such as a half-collapsed passageway leading down in the naga/dragon cave in Serpent Hills, for example, or the lich's cave in Cloudpeaks.

[Steve]

But what is the fundamental point, really?

Is it so that UD PCs have more Epic Areas in which to Level? I understand that the UD has so few Areas, and with CL +2, having to revisit the same 1-2 Areas over and over and over is absolutely no fun. But this can be solved after a server split, since more Areas can either be copy-then-converted for the UD usage, or just new Areas created specifically for down below.

Is it for variety, in general? Again, a server split would provide room for Area increase in the UD. I know, it is hard to wait.

Is it for Role-play interaction? Well, at this moment, UD and Surface PCs can cross the divide for RP. It just REALLY has to be for RP, and yes, it means a very temporary crossing over (no permanents stays). When the general view is that traveling between the Surface and the UD should be simpler, it actually goes against the very Canon Lore of the Forgotten Realms, where there are only a few, rare passageways between the two realms, AND, how dangerous each realm is for the opposing realm Races, Daylight Adaptation or no DA!!!

How about how Drow weapons disintegrate in daylight?!!?

[Svabodnik]

Having a handful of connecting transition between high-level UD and high-level subterranean "surface" zones does nothing to simplify travel between surface and UD than the means that already exists. Current travel can readily be performed by a high-teens level character that intends to hack their way from point A to point B, never mind just opting to buy a couple potions of Invisibility from the local Thayan alchemist. Three to five tunnels through perhaps the most dangerous regions available, spread throughout a span of terrain the size of a country, would hardly impact the impression that passage between above and below is a trying task.

There is likewise nothing forcing this to be a permanent change. As new high-tier areas are introduced for UD players, at whatever rate this happens to occur, transitions to previously shared zones can be removed. As shifts of earth may permit new passages to open, old tunnels may likewise collapse. In the meanwhile, while new areas are conceptualized, lore is consulted, zone maps made or re-decorated, mob spawns introduced and balanced, and treasure allocation determined, UD players get a handful more zones that are already tried-and-tested to romp on through at the cost of slapping a couple transitions in and changing the relevant zone tags to permit shared XP/looting.

As a complete aside, which is largely irrelevant if only subterrenean regions are shared, the subject of drow weapons disintegrating in sunlight. The cases of that being represented in the books is through specific Drowcraft weapon and armor enhancements, which give bonuses over comparable items when used within regions of a faerzress in exchange for the sunlight degradation quality (FRCS Underdark, p. 68-70), and a blurb on from Drow of the Underdark regarding specifically crafted items intended to have his function as a deterrent.

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"The drow are enormous believers in the efficacy of magic items and weapons, and a large fraction of their casters specialize in the creation of such goods. Minor magic items are bought and traded with little fanfare in drow bazaars, treated like any other commodity. More potent items are eagerly sought by matriarchs, priestesses, and adventurers alike. For generations, the drow utilized a process that caused their magic items to disintegrate when exposed to sunlight, in the hope of making them less attractive to potential thieves and invaders. This practice has all but died out in modern times, partially because it didn’t function as a deterrent, and also because many drow found their campaigns against the surface races hampered by the time limits such items placed on their activities." (Drow of the Underdark, p. 29)

Sshamath functions as a major nexus of trade for a vast variety of being, many of which aren't drow, and far-wandering dark elf adventurers could simply opt not to use items manufactured by their own race with this specific deterrent quality. The concept that a UD character's items suddenly poof out of existence the moment they stick their toe out of a cave is not so much a necessity, as an RP option if a player would want to introduce this flavor as an aspect of their character.