Teleportation Scrolls - Soubar

[Rhifox]

I either completely missed it or misinterpreted it, since you mentioned it in your first post, Zerros, but a DM has informed me that you did RP with Vesak about it. In that event I'm in support of adding the scroll as there is IC rationale in the adjustment to the merchant's stock. I apologize that I missed that originally since it was in the original post -- my impression of this request had been as a more or less OOC request due to all of the other reasons given, which I disagree with. But an IC change in stock due to characters making IC requests of the merchant is a justifiable reason for the merchant to start carrying it.

In the future it should be the DMs who communicate these sorts of IC developments to staff rather than players posting suggestions in follow up to DM RP. By posting a suggestion it became a matter of discussing the OOC merits of the inclusion, rather than simply following RP developments, and I was against it on that OOC basis. I'm not against it if there is an IC basis.


To answer some of the other posts that came up:

Its not really like the epic store though, because unless you make blank scrolls super rare people are going to share spells rather than hoard them. Comparing the epic store to scrolls is comparing fish to birds, they are two different animals. Just think about how many wizards on the server can cast 9th level spells right now? If you were to erase every scroll vendor and make blank scrolls rare, then and only then would scrolls be rare enough to hoard. But does this actually sound fun to you? Does anyone actually want this?

We had a recent event where a balor NPC was present at an Underdark option and offered to sell 'any spell desired'. No one but me took the balor up on that offer. That is the kind of RP that is negated when you allow players to just completely fill their spellbooks with every spell in the game: There is no longer any incentive for characters to pursue additional magical knowledge. That is absolutely a robbery of the wizard class fantasy.

Now, again, I'm not saying there will be any change to the existing system. It's far, far too late in the server's development to do that. But any such system would be a full thing, not simply 'no scrolls in stores', but changes to how easy it is to trade them, limitation of which ones you could take on level up, addition of alternative mechanics to research spells, and so on. You'd want to support things like labs and libraries allowing spell research, bosses dropping their spellbooks which could be used to research and learn new spells, and so on. Things that make it more immersive and interesting to learn spells, instead of 'day trip to all the local scroll stores', 'caster book banks' (as AoS put it), or 'taking missing spells on every RCR level up'.

In any event, as said, that's more a personal wish, not something that's actually going to happen on BGTSCC.

You are missing the point here, Rhifox does not go into why people gather, Rhifox merely points to people gathering in specific locations and use teleport to go from A to B taking away the opportunity from players encountering other players on the road.

Rhifox could have pointed out that some players also spend time at the larger cities but it remains 100% true that teleportation means roads are rarely used and so random encounters between players are reduced.

Yes. I'm mostly speaking from personal experience where I have tried to set up in places I knew an actively roleplaying group would be passing through, only to learn that they teleported around me instead (not to avoid me, but simply out of convenience). Trying to create dynamic RP just resulted in wasting time because of teleport.

People that are actively roleplaying do not 'take the roads' any more than anyone that's just grinding. If someone can teleport, in almost all cases they will teleport. That hurts dynamic RP, that hurts fostering opportunities from different groups running into each other randomly, that hurts things like ambushes or blockades.

Instead of forcing/punishing players, why aren't we incentivizing more? Make it worth their time to roleplay on the roads. Make them WANT to travel on the roads more.

Do you have any suggestions?

[Rhifox]

The mindflayer already has plenty of amazing scrolls that aren't available on any other vendor. I'm not keen on adding Teleport to it on top of all the great scrolls it already has for the sake of maximum convenience, different vendors having different spells is part of the module's design.

I haven't seen a good case made here to change our module's design either by removing teleport scrolls entirely or by adding them to Soubar.

The now deleted suggestion to address this In-Character was by far the best “good case” suggestion.

It was deleted since I didn't realize it apparently already had been (and apparently mentioned in the first post, which I missed). I just didn't have time to edit my post since I was at work at the time, so just deleted it until I could get back home.

[Valleriani]

I either completely missed it or misinterpreted it, since you mentioned it in your first post, Zerros, but a DM has informed me that you did RP with Vesak about it. In that event I'm in support of adding the scroll as there is IC rationale in the adjustment to the merchant's stock. I apologize that I missed that originally since it was in the original post -- my impression of this request had been as a more or less OOC request due to all of the other reasons given, which I disagree with. But an IC change in stock due to characters making IC requests of the merchant is a justifiable reason for the merchant to start carrying it.

In the future it should be the DMs who communicate these sorts of IC developments to staff rather than players posting suggestions in follow up to DM RP. By posting a suggestion it became a matter of discussing the OOC merits of the inclusion, rather than simply following RP developments, and I was against it on that OOC basis. I'm not against it if there is an IC basis.

Ah yes! We were feeling like it should be brought up too! But I will leave it to the DM to talk to the group in the future and if it's a no, that's okay! It was a IC discussion though with Vesak on the matter. Sorry about that!

[Endelyon]

The mindflayer already has plenty of amazing scrolls that aren't available on any other vendor. I'm not keen on adding Teleport to it on top of all the great scrolls it already has for the sake of maximum convenience, different vendors having different spells is part of the module's design.

I haven't seen a good case made here to change our module's design either by removing teleport scrolls entirely or by adding them to Soubar.

The now deleted suggestion to address this In-Character was by far the best “good case” suggestion.

I didn't see that suggestion but that would be a great avenue to approach this imho, player effort to introduce these scrolls into this market.

[Titania_1]

Do you have any suggestions?

Sure.

To get players to mingle on the roads more often:

- Add more quests to the roads.

• "Fetch me" quests like the badger quest (( "My dog got scared and ran down the road! Please, could you find him for me and bring him back?" This quest allows the quest item to move about the zone which takes more effort than clicking a stationary object that stays in the same place. Maybe do similar to the badger quest and allow an evil option. "That dog is always keeping me up at night with its barking. If you silence it and bring it back, I'll pay you handsomely" )) Or things like herbalism quests, like an NPC asking for certain ingredients for a recipe. Or maybe like the hunter in FAI, maybe have an NPC merchant there asking players to go back to the tradeway to find an item or good that's dropped out of his/her wagon.

- Create bounties to kill a certain number of monsters (only found in these road zones) to earn gold and/or exp

- Increase spawns and random encounters ("You've been ambushed by outlaws!") on the roads to make them decent leveling areas for the appropriate levels.

- Make the roads have more rewarding plants/herbs to make them areas that are more frequented and desirable to travel to.


To get the players to actually rp on the roads:

- Make the road zones offer double rp exp. 40-51 exp. This is especially good for low-levels who feel compelled to just immediately run to typical leveling areas to get out of those single digit levels as fast as possible. Gives them a reason to rp instead, a chance to feel out their character, and maybe come across more experienced characters on the road instead of isolating themselves in the Graveyard or Kobold ruins.

- Make the roads offer a reward token for roleplaying in those specific zones. Suggested method would be having a counter in the background for a character that only activates in designated zones, and counts up when roleplay exp procks in that zone. Once this counter hits a certain point, an RP token (Call it something like "Traveler's Token", "Road Coin", or something indicating that you get these from the roads) drops into the character's inventory. These tokens can then be used at a merchant ( Possibly the Nexus ) to exchange for special items. Like an item that gives you an exp boost (( 150% exp boost for up to 5,000 exp )) or one-use consumables (maybe some consumables like you'd find at the one merchant near the entrance inside Beregost. The one selling contact medallions and Chimes of Opening), maybe even epic items (by epic items I mean those stores selling items for 300-500k). Maybe fun cosmetic or rp items as well.

Why exp boosters? Because you're encouraging the grinders to stop grinding and rp in a location you'd like to see more rp happen in. You can't change a grinder's mindset, so give them a reward for putting their limited time aside to do something out of their comfort zone so their next grind session is quicker and more fulfilling.

Why one-use consumables and epic items? Because the way you get gold in this game is by loot running and grinding your heart out. If you're spending time roleplaying, you're not earning gold. So this allows another way you can get the items and consumables you want, through RP. This also caters to level 30's who don't get exp anymore, but are still pursuing to better their gear and gold count. On the same note, maybe gold can also be an exchangeable thing at the merchant. X amount of coins gives Y amount of gold. Since some people might just wish to increase their gold to afford items players are selling in auction or on the forums. Maybe their character is built more for rp than loot runs and can find more success in acquiring gold doing what their character was built to do. (Maybe this would encourage people to put more emphasis in an rp build rather than a "I need to survive PvE to be successful" build. )

I think these ideas incentivize and encourage players to do what you want them to do without creating player frustration by adding more pointless hurdles that consumes their time. It gives them the choice and an alternative to the anti-social nature of grinding and loot running, while having the roads see more use and rp. It just has to be worth it.