Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

I just can't see extend spell as a viable option only because ass mentioned there isn't the spell slots to support it. Specifically if the majority of the spells you would use it with would be on 3rd or 4th level.

I think a good solution to this is either make a full caster progression paladin PRC, or add more spell slots. Not a lot.. But just 1-3 more per spell level.

You could do the prestige paladin its in the unearthed arcana. Its in page 71. The requirements for that class would be 2 ranks in knowledge/lore in nobility and religion, 4 ranks in ride which we don't have we would have find alternative skill, the ability to cast protection from evil, turn undead and mounted combat feat which you have substituted for another feat since we don't have a war horse. But basicly the prestige paladin would cleric spells pregression but in the class its every other level. They could get 5th and higher spells slots because you be adding plus one caster every other getting some higher spell slots. In the book it says you will have to add the paladin to the cleric spell Iist in prestige paladin. Its powerful prc class you kinda even so that with the black guard just change some requirements to get the prc class. Its something I figure I throw my two cents in because I love paladins. The draw back there attack base be little lower but you can get some higher spells plus you can extend or do other metamagics too.

Just move the paladin casting stat to CHA, like it is in Pathfinder. The bonus slots paladins get from that change will cover their needs in that area.

RedLancer wrote:Just move the paladin casting stat to CHA, like it is in Pathfinder. The bonus slots paladins get from that change will cover their needs in that area.

RedLancer wrote:Just move the paladin casting stat to CHA, like it is in Pathfinder. The bonus slots paladins get from that change will cover their needs in that area.

I honestly think this would fix it.. But I didn't want to suggest it.
Works the same in D&D 5e too.

That works too you use the wisdom stat points to increase other abilities help get things epic divine might.

Thanks for the info Rhifox! What they make a difference is that they give pally different feats base on the variants/kits. These kits will certainly add a lot of different flavours to the pally class. But I doubt BG will make all of these available.

Akroma666 wrote:

RedLancer wrote:Just move the paladin casting stat to CHA, like it is in Pathfinder. The bonus slots paladins get from that change will cover their needs in that area.

RedLancer wrote:Just move the paladin casting stat to CHA, like it is in Pathfinder. The bonus slots paladins get from that change will cover their needs in that area.

I honestly think this would fix it.. But I didn't want to suggest it.
Works the same in D&D 5e too.

This is a good idea. Since most of the paladin go for Str/Cha, a cha-based spellbook will help her spellcasting ability. It is a minor change but will improve the class a lot.

I'd be all for that.

If we got rid of EDM...

This might warrant its own thread but I'm all for reducing paladin reliance on spells. In particular, I was thinking of removing the great smite line as selectable feats and instead give paladins GS I to IV every 5 paladin levels(GS I at lvl 5, GS II at level 10 and so on until lvl 20). Remove the uses/day and slap a 18-30 second cooldown on it; this would make the paladin's iconic ability a core part of its kit whilst removing the unfun, instagib potential great smiters possess. Thoughts ?

This neither makes the paladin more powerful nor reduces its reliance on spells. It frontloads some power but lowers its ceiling while making Smite less useful. It frees up some epic feats for paladins who would have built for Great Smite, but it funnels all paladins toward EDM.

The real trouble is that EDM is so OP that if you ever want to make paladins "stronger" melee-like, then it has to either be in opposition to EDM builds as an alternative or EDM needs to be changed from the NWN2 version and into any of the sourcebook ones. Maybe even a touch stronger than those. (Or a ranger-like progression path for paladins? For Smiting or w/e)

But increases to their strength without changing EDM or easing their reliance on EDM ultimately won't ever help.

Selande wrote:The real trouble is that EDM is so OP that if you ever want to make paladins "stronger" melee-like, then it has to either be in opposition to EDM builds as an alternative or EDM needs to be changed from the NWN2 version and into any of the sourcebook ones. Maybe even a touch stronger than those. (Or a ranger-like progression path for paladins? For Smiting or w/e)

What's EDM look like in sourcebook version?

Selande wrote:But increases to their strength without changing EDM or easing their reliance on EDM ultimately won't ever help.

I agree. Giving great smite free will only empower EDM build as one can only choose one or another currently. This will make EDM too op, having goodies from both EDM and Smite builds.

realayer wrote: What's EDM look like in sourcebook version?

I don't believe EDM exists in source, its an nwn2 feat. Divine Might in PnP is CHA-to-Damage for 1 round, and its a free action.

People claiming these 1 round per level buffs are super powerful... because they like to rest every 5 minutes. Epic divine might isn't that crazy when you consider it's wicked prerequisites.

Maximvs wrote:People claiming these 1 round per level buffs are super powerful... because they like to rest every 5 minutes. Epic divine might isn't that crazy when you consider it's wicked prerequisites.

This^

metaquad4 wrote:

realayer wrote: What's EDM look like in sourcebook version?

I don't believe EDM exists in source, its an nwn2 feat. Divine Might in PnP is CHA-to-Damage for 1 round, and its a free action.

Epic Divine Feats
I just found this out on Wizard's archive. The current nwn2 is exactly the same as the description

Maximvs wrote:People claiming these 1 round per level buffs are super powerful... because they like to rest every 5 minutes. Epic divine might isn't that crazy when you consider it's wicked prerequisites.

Totally agree. EDM needs both 21 str and 21 cha and Divine Might as requirement. Almost all the epic feats goes to str/cha if one starts out in 16 str/cha. A pally loses a lot choice in feat for that temporary damage output.