Bloodwalk

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tribunal
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by tribunal »

Asmodea wrote:
There are currently no rules about that though. I mean it would be polite...
It is actually very simple. Just need to become a rule. If you win remind him after duel that he need to remove the mark since he is dead. If he not do that there are penalties. Same as he can not use bloodseek ability in front of the guards. Just put it as a rule .

And I really doubt that someone will abuse such rule. Same as I really doubt that players was abused by Blood Magus at the beginning when this ability was working perfectly well ...
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Empoweredfan
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Empoweredfan »

I very much believe that such a rule would be abused to no end. If the only way to escape such a mark is by PvP, and then only if you win. Then anyone that craves PvP would just have to roll a blood mage, and spam to their hearts content. They'll either get to PvP as much as they want, or get a neat set of hostages that have no chance of beating them in PvP.

If consent is such a problem, then try reflecting on why you think it is so important that it shouldn't be there.
Nawiel: Stubborn woodpecker from the deep.
- "Responsibility is a curse, importance, an illusion."


Deleniel Vanaer: Wood Elven Sor. . . cook.

If you put your foot in your mouth. . . don't start walking. . .
Aeb Ankor
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

Mallore wrote:
Tantive wrote:That also makes another consideration. If you died and were marked by a bloodmage postmortum, with our pvp rules you forget you were marked even after 'revival', while 'normally' I think you would remember that if raised from death.
You can't interact with them. So doesn't really matter if the mark falls off at reset. And they can't interact with you.
The rune hasn't expired in the past, I kept multiple runes for years and uses.
"It is a good bet that I like your character, more than I like you... keep it IC and close to lore and we might stay friends."

"I hate snowflakes and butterflies, die die die!'


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Mallore
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Mallore »

Aeb Ankor wrote:
Mallore wrote:
Tantive wrote:That also makes another consideration. If you died and were marked by a bloodmage postmortum, with our pvp rules you forget you were marked even after 'revival', while 'normally' I think you would remember that if raised from death.
You can't interact with them. So doesn't really matter if the mark falls off at reset. And they can't interact with you.
The rune hasn't expired in the past, I kept multiple runes for years and uses.


Huh. It does strike me a bit silly. Blood does dry up. It congeals on its own in a jar or on something (agents added later in science prevents this in irl). Magic even sub staining it should expire on the BMs death as all spells expire when that happens (with very few rare exceptions).

Though I suppose it's a minor detail.


I really don't care.

Some blood Mage teleports next to me I kill them. You obviously consented to pvp and if you use some silly death magic on me on your arrival before I act I report you for God modding and hope you enjoy a perma strike. After all I might be AFK or sneezing.

Really this issue self police. I think it is going to be fine and considering most of the fear is pvp level and most of the responsibility is put on the aggressor this will self fix


I have the greatest of confidence in the blood mages to act responsible.


((As a side note I disagree with an early statement made by another that blood Mage evil rp adds something to the server or evils in general. Truth is it tends to add more greifing and angst then anything of value because of a few "evil" players who lack maturity to be members of a healthy community. If you get your rocks off by knocking over other people's sand castles because you can't build one. You are the problem. Sadly this is the case for some here.)
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Jennifer and A Drow.
Aeb Ankor
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

I think the problem here is that people are not considering that these are supernatural abilities and not spells.

Remember that Mark Blood, Blood Walk, and Burst Forth are THREE different abilities and actions.

Blood Walk: Needs no person's blood to function. A BM can move directly to and through ANY living being that has blood without notice seemlessly just by seeking the blood of a general target wanted. This is NOT PvP this is not consent needed. Exiting a target is painless by lore Tome and Blood, p. 52. Supernatural 'Except where noted above, this class feature resembles the dryad’s ability to move from tree to tree (see Monster Manual, page 79'.
A blood magus merely designates a direction and distance (“a living creature twenty miles due west of here”), and the bloodwalk ability transports him to a destination creature as close as possible to the desired location. He can’t specify a named individual as the endpoint unless he has previously obtained a sample of that creature’s blood and has it preserved in a vial that he carries.
Mark Blood: Is not a spell and NOT PvP directly it is actual physical collection of a blood sample from an individual. This can be based on DM ruling a specified amount is needed (vials/ rags/ bandages/hospital linens), quality (poured from a wound or bloody nose, gathered from slightly dirty floor of hospital, mixed with soil and grass from scene of a battle, wiped from the discarded blade of a dead foe (NPC: Orc, etc) whom wounded the target before death, etc), freshness (gathered in minutes, gathered when dry, stored in a vial for a week, stored for a year) [In the past DMs when asked have not made rulings].

This is all done in the aftermath of PvP while your character is dead, unconscious, bound, etc. (consent is for the actual PvP) or by means other than PvP, like ANY time a character bleeds and leaves blood with no consent needed (Injured fighting NPC, Bandages, any 3rd party that has access to a character blood, like healers, doctors, barbers) for a bribe or discarded.

I have in my years on this server observed one single character RP, years before BM class was added, that he was concerned about his blood being used by evil and only did RP about this 1 in 50 times the character was injured. You players out there don't act like you even care about the character's blood being literally splattered, pooled and left every where you fight EVERY SINGLE DAY. Making an affront and requiring ooc consent to gather blood is not reflected in your actual play, just vocal here...

Burst Forth: THIS IS ACTUAL PvP and DOES require consent EVERYTIME. It does NOT require an individual's blood. A blood mage can burst forth from any nearby target with usually a Fortitude save (sources differ).

Posters here don't seem to be making the distinction that there are multiple abilities and methods of use. Please stop addressing all your ire and fears that some BM will burst forth from you without consent... PvP requires consent BY RULE (not specific to BM). Burst forth is but one aspect of a BM abilities and by hamstringing all blood walk type abilities with ooc consent you are crippling all the other interesting aspects of blood mages RP and fun.

I shared all of this in earlier posts in more detail.
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Asmodea
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Asmodea »

Aeb Ankor wrote: Posters here don't seem to be making the distinction that there are multiple abilities and methods of use. Please stop addressing all your ire and fears that some BM will burst forth from you without consent... PvP requires consent BY RULE (not specific to BM). Burst forth is but one aspect of a BM abilities and by hamstringing all blood walk type abilities with ooc consent you are crippling all the other interesting aspects of blood mages RP and fun.
Being able to appear instantly next to a PC that is hostile towards your PC and that your PC is hostile towards without the other player being OOC aware or involved at all is going to lead to conflict. It just is. I don't think many really care how much HP worth of damage is done by the ability or not. It is mostly the on demand super hard to avoid conflict RP without OOC involvement at all. Trust me! You don't -want- to appear next to someone who OOCly is going to just be upset by it and instantly try to take the situation OOC to dismiss it; it's just a recipe for everyone having a bad day!

Boiled down: How is all parties involved in the interaction being willing participants going to cripple the ability? It cripples merely it being used to force another player into a situation they do not want to be in. OOCly. Which is always a one way ticket to drama, especially without DM supervision.
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Aeb Ankor
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

Asmodea wrote:
Aeb Ankor wrote: Posters here don't seem to be making the distinction that there are multiple abilities and methods of use. Please stop addressing all your ire and fears that some BM will burst forth from you without consent... PvP requires consent BY RULE (not specific to BM). Burst forth is but one aspect of a BM abilities and by hamstringing all blood walk type abilities with ooc consent you are crippling all the other interesting aspects of blood mages RP and fun.
Being able to appear instantly next to a PC that is hostile towards your PC and that your PC is hostile towards without the other player being OOC aware or involved at all is going to lead to conflict. It just is. I don't think many really care how much HP worth of damage is done by the ability or not. It is mostly the on demand super hard to avoid conflict RP without OOC involvement at all. Trust me! You don't -want- to appear next to someone who OOCly is going to just be upset by it and instantly try to take the situation OOC to dismiss it; it's just a recipe for everyone having a bad day!

Boiled down: How is all parties involved in the interaction being willing participants going to cripple the ability? It cripples merely it being used to force another player into a situation they do not want to be in. OOCly. Which is always a one way ticket to drama, especially without DM supervision.
I can have my character appear next to you in a dozen different ways... Step out if the shadows or hiding undetected, drop invisibility, reenter the physical plane from ethereal plane, you happen to be standing on my normal teleport spot, etc, etc

In real life you can't see a top down 3rd person view of yourself ... you have been startled more than once in your life by a friend, family, unknown person seeming to be 'all of a sudden' standing next to or behind you right???

How do you know how someone got there when you are not paying attention or expecting to see someone else... EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THE PLANET HAS BEEN STARTLED LIKE THIS.

This is NOT PvP hostile consent.

Edit: You want to detect a blood walk to your character, then campaign to have a skill roll added to even perceive the supernatural event that you might not even see with your eyes... a skill roll that does NOT OOC OUT MY CHARACTER AS A BM
"It is a good bet that I like your character, more than I like you... keep it IC and close to lore and we might stay friends."

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Empoweredfan
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Empoweredfan »

You seem to be ignoring what Asmodea is actually saying.
Nawiel: Stubborn woodpecker from the deep.
- "Responsibility is a curse, importance, an illusion."


Deleniel Vanaer: Wood Elven Sor. . . cook.

If you put your foot in your mouth. . . don't start walking. . .
Aeb Ankor
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

Empoweredfan wrote:You seem to be ignoring what Asmodea is actually saying.
That it is a hostile act to startle or stand next to a person.

Everything else they said was predicated on that being hostile intrusive act, requiring some ooc reaction and rule to being startled.

I showed other methods of standing beside someone else without prior awarness.

I show that standing there is not hostile by nature... you aren't killing people on the public transportation or at the office when you notice them next to you right???

I then offer a method of detection that does not intrude on the BM characters RP with ooc knowledge.

I am sure I didn't ignore them.

Edit: I responded directly to them within 23 minutes... this is not ignoring, because it seems to to me many people fear blood walk without actually knowing about it or willing to ready the class/ ability lore... while then wanting to cripple the prime feat of a class I liked to play and ruined it, that sounds like ignoring to details I have posted over the years about this.
Last edited by Aeb Ankor on Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"It is a good bet that I like your character, more than I like you... keep it IC and close to lore and we might stay friends."

"I hate snowflakes and butterflies, die die die!'


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Empoweredfan
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Empoweredfan »

And Asmodea's post was about how this saves a great deal of time and effort in avoiding OOC drama. Regardless of how the ability works.
Nawiel: Stubborn woodpecker from the deep.
- "Responsibility is a curse, importance, an illusion."


Deleniel Vanaer: Wood Elven Sor. . . cook.

If you put your foot in your mouth. . . don't start walking. . .
Aeb Ankor
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Location: Idaho, USA

Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

How does this save my 100s of hours of IC time and effort to build a character to have a unique class defining feature available, only to have it crippled by ooc knowledge of seeing a character appear standing nearby suffering no damage or ill effects, using an ooc 3rd person view and that person reacting with their own dramatics... tell me again how that 'saves me a great deal of time and effort'?

That is not a real question to me is it?
"It is a good bet that I like your character, more than I like you... keep it IC and close to lore and we might stay friends."

"I hate snowflakes and butterflies, die die die!'


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Empoweredfan
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Empoweredfan »

It isn't crippled. You can still teleport to those that says 'yes' to be marked. And drama steals away DM time. Which steals time from everyone on the server that wants to be in DM events.
Nawiel: Stubborn woodpecker from the deep.
- "Responsibility is a curse, importance, an illusion."


Deleniel Vanaer: Wood Elven Sor. . . cook.

If you put your foot in your mouth. . . don't start walking. . .
Aeb Ankor
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Location: Idaho, USA

Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

It is crippled as currently described and has been totally broken for about 18 months, no one has been blood walked in recent times.

This has not wanted to be fixed because of this exact conversation. Fear of dramatic players reacting to 3rd person ooc knowledge that their character whom was unhurt, uneffefected, many times unaware, was blood walked.

If the drama was from PvP address that PvP issue and not directly BM
"It is a good bet that I like your character, more than I like you... keep it IC and close to lore and we might stay friends."

"I hate snowflakes and butterflies, die die die!'


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Aspect of Sorrow
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aspect of Sorrow »

As someone who spent the better part of a year playing BM, probably best to see this feat limited in it's range to the same area than cross areas.
Aeb Ankor
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Re: Bloodwalk

Unread post by Aeb Ankor »

I agree 'bursting forth' should be same zone only and hostile toggle with rp out. This IS PvP after all.

Basic blood walking is not PvP and can function on the order on 100s of miles, as per lore.

These are two different abilities and uses.

Example: Attack style dimension door vs teleport
"It is a good bet that I like your character, more than I like you... keep it IC and close to lore and we might stay friends."

"I hate snowflakes and butterflies, die die die!'


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