Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

Couple issues I have with this class.
It is not a very archetypal orc class. It seems like a very specialized class or niche, to me. Especially when comparing it to the other races prc's.
Synergy would be limited compared to the other orc prc suggestions people previously suggested. With this prc I can't help but keep thinking....an orc bard.
If the purpose of an orc prc is to encourage orc rp I find this an odd choice. Don't you think it would be odd if suddenly there were a bunch of drumming orcs wandering around the sword coast?
A party of battlerages teaming up would be cool. A party of war drummers?
Who is the war drummer going to play to?
With the low orc pop on this server, this support class is not ideal....if I was a war drummer I would not be wandering around alone which would be it's fate on this server. I would be looking for a large warband to join.

Maybe able learner instead of skill focus as a requirement ? Otherwise I think that -2 AB/Damage/saves is pretty damn big, you're not even forced to max perform to have it working since mobs have quite low will saves so I think you're grossly underestimating this feat aaron.

• High BAB

• 4 SP

• Tumble

• Will saves

• Strong offense buff to entire party

• Strong debuff to all enemies

• Another strong offense+defense buff to entire party

For a 5 level PRC? This class is very strong. With a group it's even stronger. Will I play it? Most likely not. Why? It's an orc, seperate faction from the rest of the server. IMO the server doesn't need more dividing. (And I don't want to play a drummer)

Tekill wrote:Couple issues I have with this class.

And I make comments.

Tekill wrote:It is not a very archetypal orc class. It seems like a very specialized class or niche, to me. Especially when comparing it to the other races prc's.

Dwarven Defender - the PRC that is about standing in one place? Battlerager - the PRC that is about charging at the enemy as a barbarian? Warsling Sniper - the PRC that is all about using a sling? Arcane Archer - the non-gish PRC that forces you take gish classes? Bladesinger - the generic gish build? Red Wizard of Thay - the PRC that is all about gimping your spell selection in favour of just one school of magic? Breach Gnome - the PRC that is all about fighting in tunnels? If I am honest, all of those racial PRCs are very specialized and within their own niche.

Tekill wrote:Synergy would be limited compared to othwr orc prc suggestion previously provided. With this one I would would want to mix with bard to maximize perform.....an orc bard.

It is probably because very few wish to see Bardic Pirates beating Drums. I mean if it were not the case, then 15 levels spent on Bard 3/Drummer Boy 5/Dread Pirate 7 would get you +5 AB and Magical Damage. Something that normally requires 26 levels of Bard. Anyhow, Able Learner is a feat, you can crossclass into Perform with almost every class. From the top of my head, Frenzied Berserker is one that cannot. And as for Rogues/Bards/Shadowdancers/Dervishes it is a class skill.

Tekill wrote:If the purpose of an orc prc is to encourage orc rp I find this an odd choice. Don't you think it would be odd if suddenly there were a bunch of drumming orcs wandering around the sword coast?

No weirder than a Fowl of Chicken character's clucking around due to corrupted character bic files because Myhun happened to cast Mass Fowl yet again and the server crashed. No weirder than the sudden influx of rare elven bladesingers sitting around campfires. No weirder than some characters getting to ride on the backs of random dragons. I would say that an Orc with a drum is not that much of a deviation to the serious tone this server has kept well established.

Tekill wrote:A party of battlerages teaming up would be cool. A party of war drummers?

Well, technically you would only need one war drummer, so how about a party of orcs with a war drummer instead? You know, not everyone is forced to play a specific PRC...

Tekill wrote:Who is the war drummer going to play to?

Who is any standard bard going to sing to?

Tekill wrote:With the low orc pop on this server, this support class is not ideal....if I was a war drummer I would not be wandering around alone which would be it's fate on this server. I would be looking for a large warband to join.

And here it comes to the often ignored people with evil alignments and organisations that are no good. You might be an orc, Zhents could employ orcs, Red Wizards could employ orcs, pirates could employ orcs. That 'warband' your character seeks to join doesn't have to be made out of pure orcs.

After all, you shouldn't forget that all adventurers are pretty much just murder hobos. Outcasts and wanderers that for better or worse are seeking their fortunes on the road.

And honestly, over the years, all the groups and clans and tribes of orcs have failed for the same reason. One guy stops playing, and soon after the group is no more simply due to time zone and time schedule differences.

Why not a suggested alternative PRC:
http://www.realmshelps.net/charbuild/cl ... nder.shtml
The Mighty contender of Kord

Valefort wrote:Maybe able learner instead of skill focus as a requirement ? Otherwise I think that -2 AB/Damage/saves is pretty damn big, you're not even forced to max perform to have it working since mobs have quite low will saves so I think you're grossly underestimating this feat aaron.

i promise you i am not underestimating a bonus of +2/+2. (x) mastery is one of the 10 or 20 best feats in the game. and i am not underestimating that you made a class that takes the two negative stats and made them highlight the class. i am also not underestimating that you made a "support" class for a community that struggles to get two players at the same time on. i am also not underestimating that this addition is not likely to change that. which is sad to me, because that is what i was hoping for.

hope in one hand and (#2) in the other and see which fills faster.

i thank you for your effort vale, chad and all the others unnamed for their work in this, but its not even close. sometimes we hit and other times we miss.

Akroma666 wrote:Why not a suggested alternative PRC:
http://www.realmshelps.net/charbuild/cl ... nder.shtml
The Mighty contender of Kord

Ehh... How would that translate to NWN2? More uses for the Strength domain power? Increased duration and more uses of that +12 to strength based on your base strength modifier? Well, it is a hard sell to claim that strength based clerics would need more help... (Even though it would be just... +6 strength on top of Divine Power. Perhaps not the best choice of words. )

I don't want to hijack the thread.. but thought was a barbarian-cleric with a lower CL.

Idono.. just a thought..

OWD cannot cross class with bard so that is out. shadowdancer and dervish are the ONLY TWO PRC's available with perform as class skill. rogue is NOT. those two have very specific wants and needs for lore and while they could be twisted to fit. it is not typical orc. the OWD inspirations cannot be increased with DP bonuses.

lets look at how good your will save bonus is. because i would need to spend two feats on stuff i normally wouldnt, able learner and skill focus perform. i would not be able to get steadfast that helps with those will saves. my orc builds do not fall short right now on will save. it is usually reflex and that is compensated with high HP's and evasion. so high will bonus in 5 level prc is not OMG. it's ok whatever. High BAB... i can see cleric liking this but after i built one i realized that it had trouble because of losing two feats right off the top that made my build rather mediocre compare to taking another High BAB prc that carried more linear reqs.

strong buff to party. there is no party. and its not strong
strong debuff to enemies.. its nice but calling it strong is a stretch.
save buff to party.. will saves are not typically low for orc builds. so its whatever again.

Valefort wrote:Maybe able learner instead of skill focus as a requirement ? Otherwise I think that -2 AB/Damage/saves is pretty damn big, you're not even forced to max perform to have it working since mobs have quite low will saves so I think you're grossly underestimating this feat aaron.

This would be a fantastic solution since only base ranks are considered for the DC calculation so SF: Perform really doesn't do anything for the class. This would also make the cross - class skill allocation moot since once you open up the skill you can max it on any level.

chad878262 wrote:

Valefort wrote:Maybe able learner instead of skill focus as a requirement ? Otherwise I think that -2 AB/Damage/saves is pretty damn big, you're not even forced to max perform to have it working since mobs have quite low will saves so I think you're grossly underestimating this feat aaron.

This would be a fantastic solution since only base ranks are considered for the DC calculation so SF: Perform really doesn't do anything for the class. This would also make the cross - class skill allocation moot since once you open up the skill you can max it on any level.

Able learner is a fix to the symptom, it doesn't really make much sense as a req for this class. Keep the req skill focus perform (it's a drummer it should focus on performing), and change the Inspire Fear DC to use intimidate instead.

dedude wrote:Able learner is a fix to the symptom, it doesn't really make much sense as a req for this class. Keep the req skill focus perform (it's a drummer it should focus on performing), and change the Inspire Fear DC to use intimidate instead.

Except that with your suggestion it no longer focuses on performing. So why not just drop the skill focus requirement and perhaps just increase the skill requirement?

increase the skill req? soonest you would be able to get the class due to that skill is 7. uh increase it to what? how does that make any sense at all.

Comments Only wrote:

dedude wrote:Able learner is a fix to the symptom, it doesn't really make much sense as a req for this class. Keep the req skill focus perform (it's a drummer it should focus on performing), and change the Inspire Fear DC to use intimidate instead.

Except that with your suggestion it no longer focuses on performing. So why not just drop the skill focus requirement and perhaps just increase the skill requirement?

A class doesn't need an active ability to be tied to its reqs. The perform requirement is simply tied to the class itself being a performer of sorts. Scaling the ability off perform makes people want to max perform, which is rather wonky considering the few classes that can actually progress it.

The Inspire Fear ability makes sense to scale with intimidate. It still needs the base 6 perform to actually perform the "drumming".

Intimidate can replace perform, my idea was that one has to pay the skill points to get the bonuses of the inspire fear, else the class simply gives too much.