Poll: XP Modification

[Akroma666]

Honestly, if the exp pool takes time and energy to code, I think it would be simpler to just put a blanket +30% exp in epic levels. The fact your exp gain goes down and the amount of exp needed goes up just exacerbates the situation. I'd be happy with that and revamping old zones to be grind zones. Let's face it, people grind xvarts, gnolls, graveyard, etc. It would be nice to have another area that's level 19-24 that you could grind that isn't the horrible annoying Giants or the trolls that require fire/acid. Something that swarms you like xvarts with a few casters and whatnot that could make a situation bad fast if left unchecked.

My first thought is to revamp fields of the dead... Turn up the spawn timer by like 100% and making them spawn in groups of 2-4. Basically you could roam the field and get ambushed or find groups of 2-4 skeletons that give a level 21 PC around 80exp for all 4. That's 20exp a kill roughly for a mob that could swarm for more exp and more threat. Toss a boss spawn in there for 50exp with a basic rare loot table like an Ursa only instead some sort of mummy, Goliath, vampire, etc. Make his timer every 5 mins on a random spawner... Golden

[Rask]

I agree 100% with what you said. I appreciate where Maec is coming from on this. But if you look at this poll, and the last one, it add's up to something like 70 people voted in favour of an XP increase between the "raise across the board" and "raise for epic levels" It would look bad if nothing came of it. Raising XP in areas takes almost no effort (as we found out the other night.) and it seems to have been almost universally praised by the player base.

"Almost no effort" is a bit of a misnomer since I spent probably close to 5 hours last night working out how the delivery system functions, doing script updates and recompiles and then observing the adjusted effects in game (on top of whatever time I spent on data collection from the forum and player messages afterwards).

We're taking user suggestion into consideration but we ultimately don't design the game by popular demand. We're weighing our options currently and there may be a change or there may not, but some of the arguments presented here are a bit of a logical fallacy in my eyes, as I'm sure that 70 people would also vote in favor of me handing out +5 4d10 magic damage weapons to them and universally praise me for doing it--that doesn't mean it's good for the game as a whole.

I realize it's an extreme example as the game balance will certainly be less drastically altered by a mild or moderate boost to kill exp but the point here is that we have to carefully weigh these things before any final decisions are made, because if the game becomes too easy there's likely not going to be many players starting polls to suggest it be made harder--they'll just get bored and play something else instead.

A test was done of a brute force method to force exp a consistent adjustment at all level ranges whether that adjustment was appropriate for those level ranges or not. Testing needs to be done, internal discussion needs to be had, the development process needs to be adhered to. We can't just toss a totally random change into the system and then assume it's good because it didn't seem to show any problems between the course of one reset to another.

I understand what you are saying here, and I admittedly did not know the effort put in there, but it seemed to come about fairly quickly compared to most "updates" so I had assumed it was a (reasonably) simple process. I still think that an increasing XP % after level 19 is the way to go personally. I have no idea how simple this is to do, but I feel like the "problem" levels, are actually all after 19, and XP needs to be gradually increased for epic areas to make it less of a sudden wall.

I also liked the idea that someone else made, where looking at some of the epic areas, how their spawns work and how well used said areas are for grinding is something that effects it. Sitting in Xvart from 11-20 is done simply because there are no other areas that have that fast spawn-rate in large groups like that. We should have more viable areas.

[Miyuki]

I think simply increasing RP xp is a good way. A bank, even weekly could be not doable to those who can't RP every day. Not to forget that i talked to some players who have the same problem as me - to find other players for RP anyway. So i often run around alone until i find someone who has time and fancies some RP - or not.

I would also like see more quests at european/australian friendly times again. In the beginning i was lucky in the european afternoon sometimes. I was able to join into some spontanious quests thanks to DMs like Creo, Soulcatcher or others.
But that isn't the case anymore. I often don't even see a DM online at my times. I don't know if that counts here, too. But i don't know where to post it otherwise. Quests are a way to gain xp, too. They also lure players to a certain place if the DM makes a shout to announce the quest. That makes people come together to RP for a while, too.

Just my experience here.

[Face]

The people have spoken

[SBlack]

I think simply increasing RP xp is a good way. A bank, even weekly could be not doable to those who can't RP every day. Not to forget that i talked to some players who have the same problem as me - to find other players for RP anyway. So i often run around alone until i find someone who has time and fancies some RP - or not.

Actually it could and you just gave me a really good idea. The xp system in place protects against people like me who have a lot of time on their hands and can level quickly and strongly dissuades the casual player who scrys and sees an army of +++ then says 'bugger this' it's too hard to get to the level I want to and moves on.

Weekly XP Pools to be drawn from until expended.

Which will narrow the gap a bit between the dedicated players who don't have as much time on their hands and otherwise those who feel the pressure to level up. It would also address the epics issue where leveling is a pain and alleviate people shooting from 21-30 too quickly. And also allow some people who don't have the time to feel the pressure to spend all their time on a single character.

[Egg Shen]

How is this different than what Calodan and others have been advocating this whole time? I'm sure I'm missing one of the finer point somewhere in the details.

I'm not 100% set in stone on this position, but from a game design perspective, the reason people want to be level 30 is because it is an achievement -- with measurable payoff:

I'd just hate to see a medal of honor turned into a participation trophy.

I think I'm the only one who was advocating something along these lines. I won't dig in too deep as I don't want to derail this thread (some good ideas and discussion here) and I've already admitted defeat. Not on the idea's merits (nobody has ever been able to say anything against it which doesn't boil down to something that my overly opinionated brain sees as a very weak and/or contradictory argument), but because I'm learning that people actually like the MMO "addiction" style of leveling.

So from a game design perspective, I'd say you are right, Maecius. I just thought that this place was a little more sophisticated or maybe just a little different in it's gaming needs/wants.

The two analogies you used above are interesting, though. The participation trophy concept rightly gets a bad rap, because when you are in a competition there is a clearly defined winner and a loser. It's trying to blur the lines so the losers don't feel as bad. This is silly. But DnD isn't a competition. There are no winners and losers. People who don't understand true competition will sort of try to make the game a competition through a variety of means (very MMO), and leveling is certainly one of them.

As for the Medal of Honor reference, they really stop being meaningful once everybody has one, or two, or more.

[Rask]

How is this different than what Calodan and others have been advocating this whole time? I'm sure I'm missing one of the finer point somewhere in the details.

I'm not 100% set in stone on this position, but from a game design perspective, the reason people want to be level 30 is because it is an achievement -- with measurable payoff:

I'd just hate to see a medal of honor turned into a participation trophy.

I think I'm the only one who was advocating something along these lines. I won't dig in too deep as I don't want to derail this thread (some good ideas and discussion here) and I've already admitted defeat. Not on the idea's merits (nobody has ever been able to say anything against it which doesn't boil down to something that my overly opinionated brain sees as a very weak and/or contradictory argument), but because I'm learning that people actually like the MMO "addiction" style of leveling.

So from a game design perspective, I'd say you are right, Maecius. I just thought that this place was a little more sophisticated or maybe just a little different in it's gaming needs/wants.

The two analogies you used above are interesting, though. The participation trophy concept rightly gets a bad rap, because when you are in a competition there is a clearly defined winner and a loser. It's trying to blur the lines so the losers don't feel as bad. This is silly. But DnD isn't a competition. There are no winners and losers. People who don't understand true competition will sort of try to make the game a competition through a variety of means (very MMO), and leveling is certainly one of them.

As for the Medal of Honor reference, they really stop being meaningful once everybody has one, or two, or more.

Or in our case, over 50% of the server. Since most players have been here a few years or are returning vets (like me.)

[Steve]

I don't have a Level 30 toon.

I've never experienced better RP, or Fun, or "reward" in relation to the higher Level of any of my PCs.

The only measurable difference between playing a higher level PC vs a lower level, is the ability to PvP a lower level, and thus "win" an argument via "might equals right."

Now, if there is proof lying around that DMs are only running meaningful events for Epic and/or Level 30s, and it is only a mechanically epic PC that can truly "make a difference" on this Server, or leave a lasting impression upon other PCs and/or the History of the Sword Coast...well then, I guess there is truly reason to be getting "up there" as soon as humanely possible.

But until I see that, I just don't agree that XP needs to be more available and quicker gained.

[Theodore01]

I've never experienced better RP, or Fun, or "reward" in relation to the higher Level of any of my PCs.
I just don't agree that XP needs to be more available and quicker gained.

An excellent point

[VillageGreenWitch]

I don't have a Level 30 toon.

I've never experienced better RP, or Fun, or "reward" in relation to the higher Level of any of my PCs.

Good point - and possibly true for many char concepts I assume.

Of course you can RP a level 1 wizard apprentice sitting in a library with his mentor scribing scrolls and more scrolls and even more scrolls, gaining insight and knowledge and ultimately power.
You can RP a squire training with and serving his knight, getting stronger and better by that.
You can RP an acolythe gaining influence and power within a church /cult . . .

All these concepts require either a DM being there for you and rewarding you constantly - which is exactly what happens in PnP, which is not a realistic expectation to have in a online game, though.
Or they require an established higherlevel character RPing with you.


But have you ever played a spy/infiltrator/burglar/pickpocket/hitman that is seen by everyone, whose lies cannot trick a dead kobold and who's unable to disable even the simpliest of traps/open the easiest of locks?
And have you ever tried on ANY online game to get in contact with teh local Thieves Guild/other criminals? There are two types of thieves - the clever, hidden ones . . . and the dead ones.
And so your little level 1 thief will be on her own. No higher level/rank char helping them out and RPing with them within short time.
No chance to RP training because the last thing she wants is audience on her training sessions - at least audience that is not allied with her.

For how long do you think this kind of RP experience is "high quality"?
How long will you enjoy RPing your thief among a population of epic know-it-and-see-it-alls, failing over and over again, just because 10 ranks in her core skills are just pathetically low compared to all those epic chars around that have more WIS ability modifier than your thief has bluff?

Or are you just saying that such a char should sit around the campfire and simply chat until she is level 15+ and has at least a reasonable chance to do some things that she trained even before reaching level 1?

There <i>are</i> character concepts that simply don't work in an online RPG based on a D20 level-defined (opposed to a GURPS-like skill-defined, forexample) system when the majority of the other chars are 15-20+ levels ahead.
Period.


I am not complaining, mind you.
I just explained why I consider your point good but not necessarily valid for those chars that aren't good.

[Steve]

For how long do you think this kind of RP experience is "high quality"?
How long will you enjoy RPing your thief among a population of epic know-it-and-see-it-alls, failing over and over again, just because 10 ranks in her core skills are just pathetically low compared to all those epic chars around that have more WIS ability modifier than your thief has bluff?

What you are outlining is not a problem with XP rate-gain, but the problem that in D&D—be it PnP or CRPG—the underlining mechanics of it and the Rules of it, were never designed for experiences within such a great level range as 1–30. Never. Any D&D campaign is usually such that PCs are within 3 levels of each other, and the storyline they encounter should support that power range.

Because BGTSCC is Levels 1–30, we are basically suffering from a build in disadvantage regarding mechanical power. Again, it has nothing to do with rate-gain from XP. The upshot is that nothing is holding a Player back from actually getting to Lvl 30. Yet still, even when your PC is Lvl 30, there is a pretty big change your build isn't going to support the kind of "power against others" that you've written about.

Or are you just saying that such a char should sit around the campfire and simply chat until she is level 15+ and has at least a reasonable chance to do some things that she trained even before reaching level 1?

I absolutely DID NOT SAY THAT. Sitting around the campfire is the last thing I do, when playing an adventure game...unless it is forwarding the adventure RP. I kinda don't understand what your writing though: how can a Character train for things before Level 1, that are only mechanically available to them at after Level 15? That is simply impossible. I cannot respond adequately to such a proposed impossibility.

There <i>are</i> character concepts that simply don't work in an online RPG based on a D20 level-defined (opposed to a GURPS-like skill-defined, forexample) system when the majority of the other chars are 15-20+ levels ahead.
Period.

If there are character concepts that don't work here, then don't play them. Why would you play something that you know simply doesn't work? Additionally, I do not agree that the majority of other characters are 15–20 levels ahead. And even if they are, then, as D&D was designed, you must go out and find other characters that are your PCs level range. This is just what Players do!

I am not complaining, mind you.
I just explained why I consider your point good but not necessarily valid for those chars that aren't good.

Do you mean "good" in terms of alignment? If an evil minded PC can only "succeed" if they are a certain level, in your opinion...well, I agree to disagree because I've played a boat load of low level Evil PCs and had no problem really playing that Character. Of course, I no longer am playing Evil characters trying to do Evil things because I do not believe that type of RP is supported by DMs or the Environment or other Players, enough to make the effort at all, worth your RL time doing it.

[VillageGreenWitch]

What you are outlining is not a problem with XP rate-gain, but the problem that in D&D—be it PnP or CRPG—the underlining mechanics of it and the Rules of it, were never designed for experiences within such a great level range as 1–30. Never. Any D&D campaign is usually such that PCs are within 3 levels of each other, and the storyline they encounter should support that power range.

Because BGTSCC is Levels 1–30, we are basically suffering from a build in disadvantage regarding mechanical power. Again, it has nothing to do with rate-gain from XP. The upshot is that nothing is holding a Player back from actually getting to Lvl 30. Yet still, even when your PC is Lvl 30, there is a pretty big change your build isn't going to support the kind of "power against others" that you've written about.

True, I worded it poorly (happened a few times apparently, see below).
At least partly true.
It's simply a big difference if just the druids/rangers/bards see you sneaking around to get to the unguarded backdoor of the rich mans' house - or if 9 out of 10 PCs see you just because your're moving (-5 hide) and they happen to have 10 ranks in spot (at level 20).

I have played NWN2 rogue chars for years, I always was able to eventually succeed at being a good spy, for example. What you need for that is - among a lot of other skills, both IC and OOC) a heavy investment into hide/MS including skill foci, stealthy etc.
As soon as you reach a certain level (which is, depending on the particular build, usuallyy ~ 15) you have invested heavily enough to be way ahead of most characters that only lazily invest a couple ranks in listen and/or spot.
Below level 10 you simply have no chance there - regardless how clever your RP ideas are.

I absolutely DID NOT SAY THAT. Sitting around the campfire is the last thing I do, when playing an adventure game...unless it is forwarding the adventure RP. I kinda don't understand what your writing though: how can a Character train for things before Level 1, that are only mechanically available to them at after Level 15? That is simply impossible. I cannot respond adequately to such a proposed impossibility.

I didn't mean to insinuate anything, sorry.
What I meant, though, is: If you are starting your char with a level of Rogue you thereby declare that his background is rogue (oh sweet logic ).
Which means she has been trained in, for example, bluff.
But as soon as she arrives in BG she realizes that everyone around here seems to have trained much harder in bluff and sense motive.
And she'll become a good liar around level 15 only, because at level 15 she'll have (investment of the full 18 ranks provided) enough bluff to perhaps successfully telling a lie to someone who never really trained in any social skill but has such a high wisdom due to being a treant most of the time that he outdid all the "how do I lie successfully and convincing?" lessons our little thief received.

I hope that is a bit more understandable.

If there are character concepts that don't work here, then don't play them. Why would you play something that you know simply doesn't work? Additionally, I do not agree that the majority of other characters are 15–20 levels ahead. And even if they are, then, as D&D was designed, you must go out and find other characters that are your PCs level range. This is just what Players do!

And again I worded it too short/wrong, it seems.

Many character concepts work from level 1 onwards in an online enviroment, others rely on skills so heavily that they don't work (as in "you can't really convincingly play them") below a certain level.
And I continue to use roguish types of chars not because these chars were the only example but just because I have started playing such chars online on BGTSCC (and later other servers) in 2009 and can say that I have quite some experience about the RP coming with such chars.

If you don't believe that the majority of characters are level 11+ or even 21+ just open the player scry and count the # of chars listed with a "+". Compare them to those listed with "++" and "+++".

And yes, looking for people of the appropriate level range is what players do. - And then? Running around and grinding. Have you ever tried to find someone in an online game that allows you RPing your rogue (as in "scouting ahead, disabling traps, warning the others of danger, all while waiting patiently until you come back because they know that bad things may happen if they don't let you scout")?
(Almost) the only times when I experienced such was during special DM events that were designed around rogues.
Additionally as a clever rogue you might not even want the others to know that you are a rogue in the first place.
So you just run with them, slaying whatever moves in your path.
That's not "RPing your sheet", though - although D&D is all about slaying everything that moves - (Exaggeration!) - and therefore probably not "high quality RP experience".

I am not complaining, mind you.
I just explained why I consider your point good but not necessarily valid for those chars that aren't good.
Do you mean "good" in terms of alignment? If an evil minded PC can only "succeed" if they are a certain level, in your opinion...well, I agree to disagree because I've played a boat load of low level Evil PCs and had no problem really playing that Character. Of course, I no longer am playing Evil characters trying to do Evil things because I do not believe that type of RP is supported by DMs or the Environment or other Players, enough to make the effort at all, worth your RL time doing it.

I did not mean evil-aligned characters as a whole. You can be a member of the Zhentarim or the Red Wizards or a drow or just a Garagos-following fighter and have a lot of fun.
The alignment system is "black and white" anyway (I will avoid getting started on that now as it is just another can of worms ).

So you got frustrated with the RP of / reaction to certain character concepts and changed your char concepts to be a fun-having part of this community. That's of course one way to solve the issue. (Although I cannot confirm that the staff here does not want to work with non-shiny chars.)
(It's sad to read that you have given up on such chars, they are usually so much more interesting to play/encounter than the 1001st Feylock, Eilistraee drow, Harper Archmage, Helm FS or Istishia Cleric.)

Another way would be to allow low-level toon to level up at a pace that doesn't force them into passive "soon I will be good enough" RP for months on end.

I therefore applaud the raise on RP xp that happened recently.

And I voted for the xp pool to remove the need to do the (after the first time completely ooc) quests over and over again to get those couple thousand xp/week.
My current chars (levels 16 and 19) cannot go to the Xvarts - and from what I remember from the last time whan I was there with other chars it is a chore to grind there, anyway. A completely boring, ooc, non-RP chore. I can (somewhat stretchingly) justify regular loot runs with Shea on an IC base.
I cannot justify at all to have her run in circles and slay beings for RL weeks.

[Steve]

...or Istishia Cleric.

Hey! I play an Istisian Cleric!!!

Below level 10 you simply have no chance there - regardless how clever your RP ideas are.

I underlined "there" because...the There is The Problem. Your Level 10 Rogue should be "active" in a Lvl 8–12 environment, ONLY! Else, it will always fail. This isn't a problem for Rogues, it is a problem for all builds, and will always be a problem in a Level 1–30 sandbox.

Your best bet, in my humble opinion, is avoid higher-than-your-PCs-level encounters. Create your own group that works. Ask DMs for help.

What I meant, though, is: If you are starting your char with a level of Rogue you thereby declare that his background is rogue (oh sweet logic ).
Which means she has been trained in, for example, bluff.
But as soon as she arrives in BG she realizes that everyone around here seems to have trained much harder in bluff and sense motive.

Have you ever tried to play basketball with a pro-baller? How about just someone that is a regular/daily amateur player? Yeah, you'll get your arse whupped quick.

My point is: there is no perfect, and there is no reward without risk. Failure is part of the game, either on BGTSCC or just D&D in general. EVEN LEVEL 30s SHOULD FAIL, if they operate outside of their skill/powers. I think this should be the norm, actually, and even so that the Server is setup to de-level 30s when they act...immortal.

Many character concepts work from level 1 onwards in an online enviroment, others rely on skills so heavily that they don't work (as in "you can't really convincingly play them") below a certain level.

Again, this is because you are playing in a Level 1–30 sandbox. You, as the Player, need to adjust to the reality of the sandbox. I'm not trying to "tell you what to do," but, I'm kinda telling you how to see what you need to do, in order to understand that "convincing" is just relative. And if you skew relativity away from your PC's level, well...it isn't going to work out very well.

Have you ever tried to find someone in an online game that allows you RPing your rogue (as in "scouting ahead, disabling traps, warning the others of danger, all while waiting patiently until you come back because they know that bad things may happen if they don't let you scout")?

I'm that someone! No, seriously: in our New Adventures adventure last Friday, I was constantly trying to get the Ranger and the halfling thief to be the scouts, and use their skills that mine and other PCs totally lacked. This is EXACTLY how I play my game. And I also value the low level existence just as much as any—I fully believe the good stories can be written at any level.

Another way would be to allow low-level toon to level up at a pace that doesn't force them into passive "soon I will be good enough" RP for months on end.

But, this is exactly what I disagree with. Instead of focusing on "leveling up," the WAY the Server should be headed is to make EVERY LEVEL VALUABLE IN THE GENERAL PLAYING EXPERIENCE. Don't mean to shout this, but I really want to shout this!!!

Role-play isn't about mechanical power. RP is, in my humble opinion, about "acting out" the existence of your Character Sheet at that moment. If you give attention to that and focus on the fun found in that moment, then not only are you a good RPer, but fun to RP with!!

[Face]

...or Istishia Cleric.

Hey! I play an Istisian Cleric!!!

Below level 10 you simply have no chance there - regardless how clever your RP ideas are.

I underlined "there" because...the There is The Problem. Your Level 10 Rogue should be "active" in a Lvl 8–12 environment, ONLY! Else, it will always fail. This isn't a problem for Rogues, it is a problem for all builds, and will always be a problem in a Level 1–30 sandbox.

Your best bet, in my humble opinion, is avoid higher-than-your-PCs-level encounters. Create your own group that works. Ask DMs for help.

What I meant, though, is: If you are starting your char with a level of Rogue you thereby declare that his background is rogue (oh sweet logic ).
Which means she has been trained in, for example, bluff.
But as soon as she arrives in BG she realizes that everyone around here seems to have trained much harder in bluff and sense motive.

Have you ever tried to play basketball with a pro-baller? How about just someone that is a regular/daily amateur player? Yeah, you'll get your arse whupped quick.

My point is: there is no perfect, and there is no reward without risk. Failure is part of the game, either on BGTSCC or just D&D in general. EVEN LEVEL 30s SHOULD FAIL, if they operate outside of their skill/powers. I think this should be the norm, actually, and even so that the Server is setup to de-level 30s when they act...immortal.

Many character concepts work from level 1 onwards in an online enviroment, others rely on skills so heavily that they don't work (as in "you can't really convincingly play them") below a certain level.

Again, this is because you are playing in a Level 1–30 sandbox. You, as the Player, need to adjust to the reality of the sandbox. I'm not trying to "tell you what to do," but, I'm kinda telling you how to see what you need to do, in order to understand that "convincing" is just relative. And if you skew relativity away from your PC's level, well...it isn't going to work out very well.

Have you ever tried to find someone in an online game that allows you RPing your rogue (as in "scouting ahead, disabling traps, warning the others of danger, all while waiting patiently until you come back because they know that bad things may happen if they don't let you scout")?

I'm that someone! No, seriously: in our New Adventures adventure last Friday, I was constantly trying to get the Ranger and the halfling thief to be the scouts, and use their skills that mine and other PCs totally lacked. This is EXACTLY how I play my game. And I also value the low level existence just as much as any—I fully believe the good stories can be written at any level.

Another way would be to allow low-level toon to level up at a pace that doesn't force them into passive "soon I will be good enough" RP for months on end.

But, this is exactly what I disagree with. Instead of focusing on "leveling up," the WAY the Server should be headed is to make EVERY LEVEL VALUABLE IN THE GENERAL PLAYING EXPERIENCE. Don't mean to shout this, but I really want to shout this!!!

Role-play isn't about mechanical power. RP is, in my humble opinion, about "acting out" the existence of your Character Sheet at that moment. If you give attention to that and focus on the fun found in that moment, then not only are you a good RPer, but fun to RP with!!

This is all nice but we still have to run the skin of our feat at the xvarts to try and gain xp and im sure 9 and a half out of 10 people would rather have it go faster so they dont have to sit there and bleed for RL weeks.

[CaelusKazaran]

...or Istishia Cleric.

Hey! I play an Istisian Cleric!!!

Below level 10 you simply have no chance there - regardless how clever your RP ideas are.

I underlined "there" because...the There is The Problem. Your Level 10 Rogue should be "active" in a Lvl 8–12 environment, ONLY! Else, it will always fail. This isn't a problem for Rogues, it is a problem for all builds, and will always be a problem in a Level 1–30 sandbox.

Your best bet, in my humble opinion, is avoid higher-than-your-PCs-level encounters. Create your own group that works. Ask DMs for help.

What I meant, though, is: If you are starting your char with a level of Rogue you thereby declare that his background is rogue (oh sweet logic ).
Which means she has been trained in, for example, bluff.
But as soon as she arrives in BG she realizes that everyone around here seems to have trained much harder in bluff and sense motive.

Have you ever tried to play basketball with a pro-baller? How about just someone that is a regular/daily amateur player? Yeah, you'll get your arse whupped quick.

My point is: there is no perfect, and there is no reward without risk. Failure is part of the game, either on BGTSCC or just D&D in general. EVEN LEVEL 30s SHOULD FAIL, if they operate outside of their skill/powers. I think this should be the norm, actually, and even so that the Server is setup to de-level 30s when they act...immortal.

Many character concepts work from level 1 onwards in an online enviroment, others rely on skills so heavily that they don't work (as in "you can't really convincingly play them") below a certain level.

Again, this is because you are playing in a Level 1–30 sandbox. You, as the Player, need to adjust to the reality of the sandbox. I'm not trying to "tell you what to do," but, I'm kinda telling you how to see what you need to do, in order to understand that "convincing" is just relative. And if you skew relativity away from your PC's level, well...it isn't going to work out very well.

Have you ever tried to find someone in an online game that allows you RPing your rogue (as in "scouting ahead, disabling traps, warning the others of danger, all while waiting patiently until you come back because they know that bad things may happen if they don't let you scout")?

I'm that someone! No, seriously: in our New Adventures adventure last Friday, I was constantly trying to get the Ranger and the halfling thief to be the scouts, and use their skills that mine and other PCs totally lacked. This is EXACTLY how I play my game. And I also value the low level existence just as much as any—I fully believe the good stories can be written at any level.

Another way would be to allow low-level toon to level up at a pace that doesn't force them into passive "soon I will be good enough" RP for months on end.

But, this is exactly what I disagree with. Instead of focusing on "leveling up," the WAY the Server should be headed is to make EVERY LEVEL VALUABLE IN THE GENERAL PLAYING EXPERIENCE. Don't mean to shout this, but I really want to shout this!!!

Role-play isn't about mechanical power. RP is, in my humble opinion, about "acting out" the existence of your Character Sheet at that moment. If you give attention to that and focus on the fun found in that moment, then not only are you a good RPer, but fun to RP with!!

This is all nice but we still have to run the skin of our feat at the xvarts to try and gain xp and im sure 9 and a half out of 10 people would rather have it go faster so they dont have to sit there and bleed for RL weeks.

I personally cant stand the xvart grind for more than 20 minutes at a time. Thus I will likely never actually get higher than 15. I just dont have the time or patience for it. It also takes away from my RP value as most people just run in circles mass murdering without actually conversing which makes RPing while grinding there difficult.