Coming Soon: Discussion Thread (2023)

[selhan]

We have been working on expanding the experience of gathering, herbalism, cooking, cosmetics, healing kits and alchemy in minor ways. You should find several tool for this, easily accessible.

OH cool. Looks like Sayushi about to make big business LOL!

[Kitunenotsume]

So far it's good, though I'll be listing any little bugs I find with the system in the thread here: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=79456

A couple suggestions I have off the bat though:

1) Remove the 10 XP from gathering water from wells, and allow for more than 1 cup of water from a well. It's a DC 0 check, and the water-sources would supposedly be sustaining the entire city. If I need 5 cups of water, It seems silly tthat I'ld need to visit 3 districts around the city for a bucketful.

2) Reduce the XP from Mudwort. it's everywhere, it's a DC 4 weed, and it grants the same XP as DC 26 gathering nodes.

[Ashenie]

Hello there!

For the first suggestion, it is coded in the script and I can't do that individually. There is a timer however so you can use a well or an herb multiple times, after 6 minutes.

For the second suggestion, all herbs have the same experience reward. I could bring a discussion to add tiers to the experience rewards and make them based on difficulty challenge instead, though the initial idea was also to offer alternative experience gain, even when you are low level or don't have much points invested to harvest.

Thank yo for the suggestions though, I come back with more answers soon,

Cheers,

Ashenie

[Lockonnow]

the Herbalist's workbench do not work in tranquil pools

[Louvaine]

Juniper Berries automatically stack into one slot, but when one of them is used (I used it for Lesser Restoration, if that matters) all of them have no charges and therefore are unusable.

[Ashenie]

Hello there,

Yes, for items like Juniper berries, this is sadly a game limitation. Either we make them unstackable, and they each take one inventory slot, or we make them stackable, and they need to be first decoupled from the stack before being used. There is no good solution when an item works with charges and is stackable. A few other herb items will be like that. For the specific case of Juniper Berries, I realized that you only have one charge for 3 effects, so I made them a single use instead. So the issue is solved for this one.

I went for the following solution : Harvestable herbs remain stacked, to avoid inventory issues from harvesting.
Since preparing or buying herbs is mostly done in a moment when you have time, I made the brews and buyable herbs with charges unstackable.

Neither is ideal. Another solution could be to make all of these item a single use property and make you choose, but some have a double effect. So it's not ideal either.

For the herbalist bench, it was already corrected, but we need to wait for next update.

I hope these explanations help,

Cheers,

Ashenie

[Aspect of Sorrow]

Store to a value on an item treated as a berry bag with a quantity ceiling to emulate encumbrance than physical items. Systems then can dynamically call against various ingredients and won't inflate the item templates and the ingredients scale as needed fairly easily. Modal UI and conversation prompts then can be framed around this system.

[DaloLorn]

Store to a value on an item treated as a berry bag with a quantity ceiling to emulate encumbrance than physical items. Systems then can dynamically call against various ingredients and won't inflate the item templates and the ingredients scale as needed fairly easily. Modal UI and conversation prompts then can be framed around this system.

We've come up with the same solution internally (more or less), but need to discuss it further to hash out the specifics... and have someone who is not me make a special storage UI for it.

[Kitunenotsume]

I've got a bit further, and have some additional observations on the various implementations.

The limit of 6 harvests per reset per character for each resource type is workable, but has put a serious damper on my ability to test, conbined with a growing lack of clarity of the system.
The issue I see is that the limit leads to 1.2 bags of flour or bottle of fragrance per reset, and 2 cups of butter. 1 bag of flour is required for a loaf of bread. The [loaf of bread] is evidently an ingredient, as it cannot be used or eaten like the [A loaf of bread] available for ~15gp in various taverns.

I think it would help to have:
1) some visibility into what the various production options are - either as a forum-post, wiki-page, or rank-based insight without having the ingredients so we can know what to look for and buy from others. Exploration and discovery is fun to an extent, but I no longer have a functional inventory in the process (3 full tabs just from the new items), and have made disappointingly little headway as the only thing I can cook with this clogged inventory is Meats and Bread.
2) multiple units of return per process - especially if a processing step requires multiple units of resource, I feel there should be as many units returned, even if that results in a lower value-per-item. For example, the Fragrances that sell for 1-k each, but take 5 flowers; creating 5 fragrances that sell for 200 each is the same value, but more functional for RP.

Discovering that I can bake only one loaf of bread per reset was very discouraging. The fact that it would take potentially 28 hours (over 4 reset windows) to gather enough resources by myself to serve a party of 5 bread is making me seriously reconsider how much I am inclined to try using the system, as I cannot functionally RP at that time-investment, nor feel inclined to commit the alts - especially given that I can accomplish a more functional goal spending 60 GP at the Lost Anchor or other taverns, and simply remarket the product as I have before.


For apples the same 6 harvests create a profit of 600 GP (and 1380 XP) without leaving the radius of a fireball. Given the harvest limitations, this can be overcome through use of multiple characters funneling into one - either different players or alts, for a fairly substantial return at low effort to maximize productivity.
In comparison, Northern Troll Hides compensate 124 GP for each hide (and no turn-in XP) and requires successfully slaying multiple mobs (the drop-rate is not guaranteed) before trucking the hefty payload across 2 servers. While admittedly this profit is uncapped per reset, it is significantly slower and more cumbersome than the 6-minute cycle-time of running through as many alts as someone cares to use.
This dissonance of effort vs return is also a bit jarring, as it somewhat implies that bread is for the super-rich, vegetables are rich-people food, and meats and monster-kills are the most commonly available sustenance (which is a bit backward). I'm aware that limitations exist due to XP-sources and gamificatiton, but the numbers used for monetary compensation may be worth review in comparison to other sources of similar activity.

[JustAnotherGirl]

Has falconry been added, or is it still being worked on?

[selhan]

looking forward to this.

[JustAnotherGirl]

Me too! For some reason, I thought it went in with the big update. Seems not though unless I'm missing something.
Can't wait for Ashling to be able to do the falconry thing on screen instead of off.

[Planehopper]

No, it hasn't. It's 95% done and has been for some time, but may need some tweaking now with changes to cooking. I was waiting for some time for icons (which I am not complaining about, you cant rush artistry) but in the interim I've lost a bit of interest and moreso the free time, but once the icons are ready (they are created as far as I understand it) it shouldn't be much longer.

Hopefully the long delay isn't building up too high of expectations! It is still intended to be added, however.

[JustAnotherGirl]

Thanks, Planehopper! I'm still looking forward to the falconry, but am not trying to rush anything. I know everyone has real lives and things get busy! I just wanted to make sure I hadn't missed it going in. Keep up the great work!

[tfunke]

I finally got around to nwn2 again and wow, just WOW!

Just walked around the city, with the biggest grin on my face, because it's incredible what you have done Ashenie. Sure words like "incredible" get thrown around often, but having spent many many hours building in the toolset, I can confidently say this is a legit masterpiece!

"It is a city with a personality, which is no simple task!"

10/10, A+