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Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:01 pm
by mireigi
Deathgrowl wrote:No. Don't think you can be a radio station for specific minds.

And it seems unlikely, at least for arcanists. Would be a bit OP as well. I can see a cleric being able to send a message to all fellow followers of his god within a radius, though.
Or just add Psionics to the server? :D

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:21 pm
by Storm Munin
@carski

Dominate someone who knows the person and have them send for you?

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 6:33 pm
by Carski
Storm Munin wrote:@carski

Dominate someone who knows the person and have them send for you?
That is far too easy! 8-)

But seriously, if there is no way to utilize the Weave to put out a calling of sorts, then is there legitimate example of a mage placing an arcane symbol slash message where only those aligned to the cause would be able to decipher the code? How to leave arcane bread crumbs?

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 6:56 pm
by Deathgrowl
The problem would be 0% chance of being found out. That's a bit too powerful in my opinion. If we're not going to be allowed to have detect alignment, why are we going to be able to send out messages to all members of an alignment? I think it's a dangerous train of thought to suggest something that is completely fail proof by default.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 7:16 pm
by Carski
I am not asking for invulnerability here. I am asking for any source material of legitimate use of the Weave to reach a mass audience of Weave sensitives. Now, Deathgrowl you are implying that any Weave sensitive would immediately make it there business to seek out the sender. How about the possibility of a Weave sensitive of good morality hearing a message that is of evil context, but consciously ignoring it, because it sounds, well…evil?

This is a topic about Lore Assistance, not "my opinion is this is too powerful." Either it exists in Lore, or not. I could just as easily put out of the forums a message saying "you come across a magical symbol that interests you. It strikes you as a symbol of arcane power that denies lawfulness, denies propriety…and if that symbol appeals to you, you attempt to unravel its meaning. ///PM me for more details."

But what I am asking for in this Lore Assistance thread is whether there exists an arcane or weave-based underground railroad, where magic itself provides a secure means of communication? Secure being relative, since if some overly curious mage wants to search out the call, I am not opposed, either.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 7:24 pm
by NegInfinity
Carski wrote:Anyone have an idea or example for a legitimate way a mage (sorc/wiz) could leave a message or send out a general communication to other mages, but such that only those of likemindedness or sensitivity to the Art, would receive it? Something like a weave-based message board? How to mages secretly communicate, indirectly?
Suggestion: Send invisible pigeon. Seriously.

Any invisible messenger. Someone with low or no magical skill won't see that. So, bind any creature to your will, give them a sign with message, send them somewhere, and before they leave, make them invisible.

Or if you want to be really serious, make your messenger walk through ethereal demiplane. That requires true seeing AND focus to notice.

As for "similar interests", I doubt that is possible, unless all of those mages belong to single secret society or something.
How about the possibility of a Weave sensitive of good morality hearing a message that is of evil context, but consciously ignoring it, because it sounds, well…evil?
From what I remember after reading complete arcane, weave didn't appear to be sensitive to anything in particular, and goddess of magic - mystra - is bound by some kind of agreement to grant magic to everybody.

If that interests you, act of extreme evil can be felt with lasting consequences, but it carries no message in it. Divine casters of all sorts, may hear about "something" strange happening from their sources of power, but I don't remember anything specific in relation to wizards.

I think you might want to try reading about divination school.

-----

By the way, it wouldn't be incredibly surprisigng if there is no mechanism like that at all.

Complete arcane gave strong impression, that wizards are not incredibly fond of each other and are not exactly in a hurry to share secrets and reach others. Every wizard knows arcane language, for example, but each has unique writing system in their spellbook, so deciphering each other's spellbook is not a trivial task and requires spellcraft check (fairly high one, IIRC, for pnp, anyway). So, basically, unless wizard/sorc is in guild/secret society of sorts, there is probably no mechanism to reach out for large audience other than making some spectacular catastrophe. Creator of Chuuls kinda comes to mind.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:14 pm
by Valefort

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 3:33 am
by mireigi
Carski wrote:But what I am asking for in this Lore Assistance thread is whether there exists an arcane or weave-based underground railroad, where magic itself provides a secure means of communication? Secure being relative, since if some overly curious mage wants to search out the call, I am not opposed, either.
In a sense there does. Drow House Insignias allow for instant telepathic communication with any and all wearers of a similar Insignia within 1 mile*. They are typically restricted in use by either bloodlines or require some command word to activate / deactivate the psychic link with the other House Insignias - this is to prevent someone from outside the House obtain a House Insignia and use it to eavesdrop on the communication. House Insignias are detailed in the book "D&D 3rd Edition - Drow of the Underdark; page 99".

*: It is possible that House Insignias have longer reach on the surface due to the absence of the Faerzress, which inhibit magical energies and may even alter some magical energies with unpredictable effects.

It stands to reason that if the Drow are capable of crafting such items (the how-tos is also listed in the book), other races would be able to as well, provided they have sufficient knowledge to do so.

You might be able to convince a DM to grant such an item to members of your guild, if you're in one that could craft them. Although the RP required for it will likely be long and have several requirements along the way - IF they decide to grant your request at all, since it is a very powerful tool, limited by distance or not.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:18 am
by Deathgrowl
This again is magic provided the sender knows the recipients or at least has some former connection to them. What Carski is asking, is as I said, a radio broadcast for same-alignment, same-faith or such. Something that everyone, regardless of previous knowledge even of the sender's existence would receive.

And I don't think that exists. And my point was that it is likely for good reason - both here and in PnP.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:21 am
by Valefort
Summoning Wind
(Complete Arcane, p. 124)

Transmutation
Level: Wu Jen 5,
Components: V, S,
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: 10 miles/level
Target: Up to 10 creatures/level
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No

You send a message or sound on the wind to a number of specific creatures that you identify while casting the spell. You need not directly know the recipients, but you must be able to distinguish them by their location, position, or some feature other than race or character class. For example, you could send a summoning wind to the soldiers of your palace guard or to the governors of all the provinces in the empire, provided you know that such characters exist.

You can prepare the spell to bear a message of up to twenty-five words, cause the spell to deliver any other normal sounds for 1 round, or merely have a summoning wind seem to be a mysterious stirring of the air. The wind travels to each recipient provided that it can find a way from you to their locations (the wind can travel around virtually any obstacle, but can't pass through closed portals or windows, regardless of whether they're airtight). You choose its speed (from as slow as 1 mile per hour to as fast as 1 mile per 10 minutes), but the summoning wind is as gentle and unnoticed as a zephyr until it reaches the recipients, where it delivers its whisper-quiet message and dissipates.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:03 am
by Carski
This is very interesting, Valefort. Nice that you could find it. And Magic Mouth which is referenced on that page, could also suffice, if tailored correctly. Seems however something requiring DM assistance or approval, to utilize. Not to mention the lack of Wu Jen PrC on this server. That is way Magic Mouth may be better suited.
Valefort wrote:
Summoning Wind
(Complete Arcane, p. 124)

Transmutation
Level: Wu Jen 5,
Components: V, S,
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: 10 miles/level
Target: Up to 10 creatures/level
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No

You send a message or sound on the wind to a number of specific creatures that you identify while casting the spell. You need not directly know the recipients, but you must be able to distinguish them by their location, position, or some feature other than race or character class.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 9:11 am
by kleomenes
If the goal is to reach those who are prior to contact unknown I do not know what to suggest.

Perhaps a very difficult scrying. You can scry those you have no knowledge of (+10 to their will save) provided you have some connection, perhaps a field of arcane research / similar goals is enough. Then, having scryed them, is that sufficient familiarity for sending? Probably. The recipient doesn't need to know you.

Its not particularly practical as the whole process would be very time consuming and hit and miss.

If dealing with creatures you know, Telepathic Bond + Permanency might assist (but, its going to be very XP intensive)

All of this looks to require heavy DM oversight though and isn't really doing what you want.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:31 pm
by Hoihe
You could try leaving Arcane messages in places that may be of interest towards fellow arcanists. Like, magical runes that only make sense if the reader has X ranks in spellcraft and such.

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:06 pm
by TheKai
So this question is about good aligned warlocks.

Reading the FR wiki (I know, I know, not the most accurate of sources) that "A warlock is an arcane spellcaster who gains power through pacts with powerful entities, most commonly devils, elder evils of the Far Realm, fey or demons." Is it entirely out of the realm of possibility to have a pact with a celestial? I.e. Solar, Planetar, etc?

Further reading, only lists these pacts: Dark Pact, Fey Pact, Star pact and Infernal Pact. Is there no Celestial Pact?

Anyone have any links or info they'd like to share?

Re: Lore Assistance

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:36 pm
by Deathgrowl
FR Wiki has 4.0 info on warlocks. Don't look at that. I can give you a bit of information from the 3.5 book Complete Mage (not Complete Arcane):

Devils are by far the most numerous, I think.
Complete Mage, page 7-8 wrote:Demons:
Perhaps surprisingly, few demonic powers are responsible for the pacts that create warlocks. As any planar scholar would tell you, demons fixate on rampant destruction over planned corruption, which means that most don't have the interest (or talent) required to broker such deals. (...)

Fey:
A growing number of warlocks draw their power from the mystical realm of faerie. Fey have always enjoyed a special link to the magical energy that suffuses the natural world, and most sages agree that mortals - even the long-lived elves- can't begin to comprehend the sheer untapped potential that rests within faeriekind. (...)
A feyblooded warlock is equally likely to be a well-meaning chaotic good, an unpredictable chaotic neutral, or a coldly malevolent neutral evil individual. (...)

Slaadi: (this is my favourite! :D)
As beings of pure chaos unconcerned with matters of morality, few slaadi care enough to make pacts with mortals. Some of the most potent of them, however, such as the mightiest of the death slaadi, occasionally empower warlocks for their own unfathomable reasons. Warlocks whose power derive from the slaadi can be of any alignment, but most are chaotic.

Celestials:
The mere suggestion that the paragons of virtue would grant such dark powers to mortals seems at first to be unworthy of discussion. However, some particularly wild or chaotic celestials, such as the eldarins, share more in common with the fey than with archons or angels. Is it so inconceivable that the mighty denizens of the Court of Stars (the eldarin lords detailed in Book of Exalted Deeds) might see fit to share some fragment of their power with charismatic mortals?
A warlock who has celestial power to thank for his invocations is most likely to be chaotic good, though such power has also been known to corrupt even the most well-meaning soul. For another take on a celestial-themed warlock, see the enlightened spirit prestige class (page 60).
So according to this, celestials may grant warlock powers. But that is snowflaky. :P