Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

CleverUsername123 wrote:

DM Arkanis wrote:

CleverUsername123 wrote:Excuse me and please don't hurt me:
Do you know what the price per acre in gold pieces of land is near Baldur's Gate, and how much land is considered a 'sizable amount'?

The land around Baldur's Gate is not really for sale, per se. Through role play, and consulting the DM staff, players are able to form guilds and purchase guild houses and GP cost depends on size and complexity of the project. I am not really aware of any one player owning any kind of property just themselves.

With regards to land sizing it is a little tricky. Most maps our characters can run across in a few minutes of real time, when in game terms, they may have traveled dozens of miles. Signposts have recently been added between Beregost and Nashkel (for example) saying how many miles it is to and from these towns. Taking that into consideration, while a character can traverse the map in only a few minutes in real time, in game terms what seems to be an insignificant amount of land is actually hundreds of acres.

To quote another DM, almost anything is possible through role play. If you have an idea, you can always PM the DM team and see what happens.

Arkanis

I meant the value of the land in general, not to actually buy it. I can't find anything about that on the internet.

That would be hard to answer. Technically the land surrounding BG city proper is under the jurisdiction of the Dukes and would be up to them to adjudicate and sale/leasing of it.

A player recently asked me if I ever post anything about Drow; their culture, society, how to play them, etc. Seeing as I have an Epic level Drow toon who shows up periodically to wreak havoc, it would be hard for me to offer any real advice that wouldn't give my toon away... Here's some things that I have learned playing Drow characters:

1. It is always good to try and use Drow language outside of the language tool in the game. Sure it is easy to toggle the language bar and type normally, but it is also pretty neat to use the odd Drow word when speaking in "common" - I keep a cheat-sheet handy of commonly used words that I use, xas! I do! That said, I use rivvil as a common curse word, not just to mean "humans."

2. All for one and one for herself. Playing with any kind of group in a Drow party SHOULD have some conflict and angst. "Oh, so sorry, did my fireball accidentally singe you?" or "Yes, of course I ran away when that thing attacked us, I'm not stupid!" are things that I have heard when partied up with other Drow characters in the past. Oh, and, "Yeah, all the loot is mine. Don't touch it." Pretty much sums it up.

3. Play your character sheet. Evil is evil, but not stupid. You can lie, cheat, flit, cajole, make false and hollow promises and guess what? It is who you are. Drow characters are schemers, looking for the way to the top either the top of the loot pile, or the top in terms of divine favour. Don't be shy about making your abmbitions known, or unknown and SURPRISE! Awesome RP with your Drow character always involves a large amount of the chaotic, with a sprinkle of OMG did he really just do that...?

4. The male vs. female thing is... delicious. I know that the server has an area that is run by/predominantly male in terms of lore. I also know there are factions out there of female Llothites... (all bow down to the Spider Queen) who are mixing it up a bit. Way to go players. This is the essence of what it means to play a Drow toon - you don't know if you are at the top of your game or not, and what you say next may earn you eternal glory (couldn't help the HP reference, sorry) or get you a permastrike death... In my opinion, based on everything I've read and in bending Bob Salvatore's ear, the women who worship Lloth think themselves superior; the men who worship Lloth-haters plot to kill them; the women who love Eilistraee just want to be left the frak alone, and the Bregan D'aerthe want you to know that for large sums of gold they are available to assist you in whatever nasty chaos you want to create.

Anyone playing a Drow character who assumes that they have a large amount of Drow character friends isn't playing their character sheet properly, or is delusional. Yeah, I get you need to party-up for XP and survival, but that doesn't mean you are bosom-buddies. You keep me alive, and I take all the loot, is the Drow way.

IMHO anyhow.

Old Arkanis

I had an interesting conversation player-side with a new(er) player the other day and figured it was worthy of an, "Ask Arkanis" response. (even though I am the one posting... taps the microphone... anyone out there???)

The back and forth IC chat was totally spot on. I sent the player a tell and said, "AFK BIO BRB" because, well, I needed to go to the bathroom, and I got a response, "AFK... what's that?" I explained, "away from keyboard" then sprinted to the can (sorry too much info) and while I was there got to thinking, yeah, there was a day when I had to ask what "AFK" was as well, and that our game certainly does engender its own unique nomenclature. Thought on it for a minute, and came up with other gems... floated them past my spouse to see if she would understand, and she called me a, "weirdo" which is her way of saying she has absolutely no clue. Here they are in no particular order:

1. I'm OOC (out of character) for my wife, this means when I drink certain things I get sentimental... in game it means that you are talking as yourself rather than your character. We use it to explain/add details, or generally just convey things that are not covered IC (in character)
2. >t "Sorry, I'm running quests." My wife asked me if this was a ,"Chariots of Fire" reference and I explained that no, it has to do with the game. There are experience points awarded for completing certain quests in the game, and this is a great way to level up. Once a week, I "run quests' and complete the level-appropriate ones for experience, and this helps your toon to level faster. Sometimes I am semi-OOC when I do this - I'm just on to run the quests, not interested in a whole pile of role playing.
3. "I'm grinding" Had to explain that this was NOT a reference to Miley Cyrus/twerking or some other form of night club dance move. It refers to intentionally going out to kill monsters/bad guys to gain experience points.
4. "Party up" No, we are not playing Beer Pong or other drinking games, or hot boxing my neighbours Range Rover. Means that as players we get together and form a group to go out and adventure/role play/kill the bad guys.
5. "Camp a spawn" or "Farm" - asked if I had any new cyber vegetables today, I had to explain that farming, or camping spawns meant that you maximize your engagement of game monsters/bad guys, and minimize your running around the map looking for them because, well, you've figured out where they appear, and how often. Generally frowned upon to be AFK on a spawn point, but if you are grinding or farming an area and are actively doing it, can be very productive experience point wise. Please remember to share the map, and if others come along play nice...
6. "Hey DM the server is laggy!" DOES NOT mean that I am dragging my heels because I am tired and falling behind at the grocery store. (there is a Pulp Fiction joke reference I'm not going to make here...) It means that the game slows down sometimes, for various reasons, and sometimes it is server related (i.e. when Arkanis spawns 50 gobins) or it can be related to your own computer because it can't process things quickly enough, and your character seems to freeze, then appear in a different spot on the map, then freeze, then appear in the Fugue Plane... Make sure that if YOU are laggy and no one else is, to have party members ready with Raise scrolls.. 'nuff said.
7. "How's your XP?" or "Am I killing XP?" Is not a reference to a new motorcycle that you bought and forgot to tell your wife about... When you party up with characters either too high or too low level, you can get a lot less experience than you would if you were not in party. Getting in party via RP can sometimes reveal that the people you are partied up with are either stronger or weaker than you are in terms of levels and running around with them makes no sense in terms of earning experience points.
8. "Buff" or "buffing" is not a reference to going to the gym, although apparently I need to go there more often. It has to do with applying magical effects to your character to make them stronger/resistant through casting spells, or using wands/potions/other magical gear.
9. "AAAAH! RUST MONSTER!" If you have played this game for any length of time at all, this one needs no explanation. Rust monsters. Eating your best gear since 1973.

Let me know if you have your own "game specific" things - love to hear them.

Old Ark

Oathbreaker looks so teasing.

DM Arkanis, whats the best creature a Oathbreaker can control? (And actually have a chance of making the roll against the creature).

Nachti wrote:Oathbreaker looks so teasing.

DM Arkanis, whats the best creature a Oathbreaker can control? (And actually have a chance of making the roll against the creature).

Need some clarification questions:

1. Are you referring to a warlock who breaks their oath, but retains their powers?
2. What do you mean by "control?" Summoned creatures, regular monsters/creatures? or NPC's/characters?

Ark

d&d 5e. Its a paladin subclass.

Nachti wrote:d&d 5e. Its a paladin subclass.

5e... *has a long bath and scrubs off the 5e*

OK I hate 5th edition but, ok...

For all our info, an Oathbreaker in 5e is, "Paladins who break their oaths may take this class when they change from their original class."

There are several sub categories, most of which deal with evil/treasonous intentions.

(Gonna start by saying that this is a conversation about a 5th edition class (we play at 3 or 3.5e on the server) and I am not giving any kind of ruling about paladins, what classifies as how one falls or ceases to be one, or what powers/privileges a fallen paladin should have. This is a discussion about a certain class available in another version of the game.)

"Control" in terms of the 5e class would be something uniquely tailored to the character, and the reason why they fell/are an Oathbreaker.
Remember that this character might be actively hunted by members of their former order and/or god, and would be in a position (most likely) to bargain with other powers for protection/services, so "control" might be more of "agreement" than being in-charge of the entity. That said...

A paladin who breaks their oath but retains their powers - in my research all indications are that they must be of an Evil alignment (LE/NE/CE) so there would be two types of creatures they would control: other evil creatures (to do their bidding) or good aligned creatures to make them do things against their will either for an evil end.

"Control" at this point would depend on two things: the level of the Oathbreaker vs. the level of the creature trying to be controlled, and the willingness (or lack of willingness) on the creature to be controlled. An evil-aligned creature might go along with the Oathbreaker, to the point of accepting orders because their ends were aligned with the Oathbreaker but not actually be controlled per se. Whereas a good aligned creature might actively fight against being controlled and therefore require save checks, etc. to see if they come under the influence of the Oathbreaker. An extremely powerful demon/devil might willingly do the Oathbreakers bidding, while the most junior/novice good aligned squire might not, and fight against the intrusion.

So, would the best creature an Oathbreaker could control, would be the most powerful, good aligned creature that they could successfully command? A 30th lv Oathbreaker, in control and command of a Solar, or other high-level planar creature might be considered very powerful. A 30th lv Oathbreaker who APPEARS to have control of a Balor or other high level demon/devil may likewise be viewed as very powerful.

In the end, the "control" depends on the end/aim of the Oathbreaker. If they are looking to infiltrate an order of good aligned, as in their former paladin order, to have an "angel" on their side would lead credibility to their reason for falling, while having a demon on their side would cement the reasons why they were kicked out. If the goal is simply to infiltrate and kill everyone - take the demon. If the goal is to convert them and pervert their beliefs, take the angel.

It really depends on the goal.

Ark

My question for you today is a Semi-Official or Official DM stance and in respect of the Server Setting here at BGTSCC...

What is the Lore surrounding Eilistraee here on this server in THIS timeline? (This would be for those that know of her and worship her of course.) I would like to have Source Books pointing to it as well... give me all ya got on her please please and Thank You!!

LISA100595 wrote:My question for you today is a Semi-Official or Official DM stance and in respect of the Server Setting here at BGTSCC...

What is the Lore surrounding Eilistraee here on this server in THIS timeline? (This would be for those that know of her and worship her of course.) I would like to have Source Books pointing to it as well... give me all ya got on her please please and Thank You!!

Thanks for the question. Give me a hard one, will ya?

((OK I need to preface the answer with: my answer in no way is a DM decision, set's the server lore, or is meant to adjudicate, officiate or declare a ruling of any kind, in any way. It is just my opinion. Please don't run with, "but, yeah Arkanis said so" - that dog don't hunt.))

Our server tries to follow the FR timeline as closely as possible with respect to events/happenings as they relate to or are associated with Baldur's Gate. For ethical and metagaming reasons I cannot share specific details on what I know of the faithful of Eilistraee specific to our server.

When it comes to Eilistraee there is not a lot known about her at this time in the server time line. Here's what I have for lore up until 1353:

1. Eilistraee "works to lead the Dark Elves" back to the surface "Drow of the Underdark" p.66
2. Eilistraee took the role of a nurturing and protecting mother-goddess for the whole Drow race. "Questions for Ed Greenwood" 2006, 18.0 - 18.6
3. "The worshipers of Eilistraee mostly consisted of those drow who hoped to escape the danger and darkness of the Underdark and Lolth's evil, taking back their place in the surface world. However, in line with her ideals, Eilistraee would welcome beings of all races: elves, humans, and especially half-elves were among the followers of the goddess.[2][4] They shared the desire of seeing all races living in harmony, without pointless discrimination or wars, and worked towards that goal (and those among them who were drow also fought to build their own place on the Realms above).[4]

The faithful of Eilistraee, however, were little known and poorly understood by inhabitants of both the Realms Above and the Underdark. Her worshippers were figures of myth and superstition and were targets of prejudice and wild mistruths. Some surface dwellers believed they were the disguised vanguard of the Spider Goddess's plan to take over the surface, while those drow who followed Lolth or other evil deities suspected them of being surface elf spies and saboteurs posing as drow as a prelude to invasion. Most non-elves could not comprehend the existence of a good drow deity, while surface elves were uncomfortable considering it, finding Eilistraee a threat to their doctrine that the dark elves were wholly to blame for the Crown Wars and other ancient tragedies.[14][4]

Eilistraee was most commonly worshiped in Cormanthor among the drow there and in the Dalelands among the half-elves,[37] and also in Waterdeep and Skullport. She also had followers (mostly human, elves, and half-elves) living in Silverymoon and its surroundings.[4] All her worshipers were typically of a good nature.[2][4]

The Dark Dancer was worshiped through song and dance, if at all possible in the surface world under the moon (preferably in wooded places). Worship of her was usually accompanied by a feast.[2][4]"

"Drow of the Underdark" pp. 20-25
"Demihuman Deities" (Wizards of the Coast), pp. 13–16
"Faiths and Pantheons" (Wizards of the Coast), pp. 23–25.

What I gather from these source books is that she is an inclusive goddess, the faithful are little known, not understood - mistrusted by all, their worship is not common to Baldur's Gate and surrounding areas, and they are considered a threat to surface and UD elves alike.

Again, at this time in the server (1353) I would postulate that:
1. Drow would be KOS on the surface by any not knowing who they were, or being in protective custody, for example. At this point in the time line there are not a lot of Eilistraee worshipers and open faith on the surface is obscure, and in the UD punishable by death.
2. Their adventuring on the surface would be at night hours only "under the moon."
3. They would adhere to the utmost levels of secrecy in everything that they did - they would not, by choice, associate with any who were not of their faith for fear that there presence would become known to the greater populace. They would not post notices about their meetings, and they would not want to be seen, frankly, at all by anyone. They would not communicate or use non Drow methods of communication unless they could be absolutely certain that it could not be traced back to them, or the messages intercepted.
4. The goddess communicates mainly in visions/dreams not only to the faithful, but those she is seeking to convert. The dreams can, and often are mistaken for real visions, and can be seen/experienced by multiple people at the same time. They are hard to interpret, and usually leave the dreamer baffled.
5. The faithful would have alter-ego's/names/play different roles within UD Drow society so as not to give their true faith away - this is supported in numerous WotC paperback novels.
6. Players playing Eilistraee characters, looking for other Elistraee characters can't just post in the scry, or walk around asking, "oh, by the way who do you worship...?" I believe there should be (if there isn't) an OOC network/guild, etc. for players to find other players, but it should in no way be obvious IG how or where to find worshipers of this goddess. IC there should be a series of tests/trials/examinations before anyone knows of, or assumes another character is of this faith. (there are many "secret" guilds and associations in the game, this is one of them)
7. A "known" surface dwelling, chapel, place-of-worship for her followers anywhere near an inhabited spot on the BGTSCC map would not be tolerated by the others living in and around it. Again, the key-word is "known." The faithful are just not well known, or known at all to exist as who they are and would be looked at as Drow maurauders or invaders.

In my opinion, Drow characters on the surface should be wary of the consequences of being caught on the surface; Eilistraeen's more so because the potential for the exposure of their faith has farther reaching consequences then just hitting up one of the NPC merchants looking for stuff - it could possibly expose the entire network of characters, and lead to a hunt and extermination.

Server lore in terms of accepted role play, of course, may deviate from this. This is just MY take on what source material says about Drow and Eilistraee in general.

Arkanis

Hello Arkanis, this is kind of an odd one;

How powerful exactly is the 'Mist' of Ravenloft and what could it possibly be?

What I know;
1) The 'Mist' is said to control who enters and leaves Ravenloft and seems to be able to enter and pull people from different planes. Evil and Good, mostly for its own amusement. Considering how the Darklords work, Ravenloft could be seen as a prison for the most evil beings in existence.
2) It has altered magic to work differently in Ravenloft, to disallow plane shifting and other holy magic to not have the same effect.
3) It is not as powerful as Vecna, as per Die Vecna Die, he entered Ravenloft and essentially crashed the entire demiplane into Sigil so he could break in.
4) The Vistani are the only ones who can really travel the mist; It almost sounds like they are travelling to different planes whenever I read about them.
5) The only known escapee of Ravenloft was Lord Soth, however, I also consider this a tainted example because Margaret Weiss and Tracy Hickman complained that they 'stole one of their creations' and demanded him returned... Only to kill him off in his next official appearance.

Flasmix wrote:Hello Arkanis, this is kind of an odd one;

How powerful exactly is the 'Mist' of Ravenloft and what could it possibly be?

What I know;
1) The 'Mist' is said to control who enters and leaves Ravenloft and seems to be able to enter and pull people from different planes. Evil and Good, mostly for its own amusement. Considering how the Darklords work, Ravenloft could be seen as a prison for the most evil beings in existence.
2) It has altered magic to work differently in Ravenloft, to disallow plane shifting and other holy magic to not have the same effect.
3) It is not as powerful as Vecna, as per Die Vecna Die, he entered Ravenloft and essentially crashed the entire demiplane into Sigil so he could break in.
4) The Vistani are the only ones who can really travel the mist; It almost sounds like they are travelling to different planes whenever I read about them.
5) The only known escapee of Ravenloft was Lord Soth, however, I also consider this a tainted example because Margaret Weiss and Tracy Hickman complained that they 'stole one of their creations' and demanded him returned... Only to kill him off in his next official appearance.

I'm sensing a "stump the old man" theme forming...

Ravenloft "exists" within the demi-plane of Dread where the "Dark Powers" manipulate things.

The Mists of Ravenloft are in fact a god/demi god power that exist in vapour form (yes, like vampires) The short answer is, "The precise nature of the Dark Powers of Ravenloft is never explicitly described in the game material, with the exception of a few of the novels based on the setting, and even those are considered non-canon. In a sense, the Dark Powers are intended to be eternal unknowns, an array of mercurial, unforeseeable, and inscrutable wills whose motives and actions the player characters cannot hope to understand."
Unfortunately the Ravenloft supplement Van Richten's Guide to the Mists that was planned was never published so we'll never know fully BUT... how powerful are the mists:

1. It has the power to manipulate the weave of magic.
2. It can be/go anywhere (almost) within the Planes.
3. It can manipulate creatures with souls (important) so it is simply not a force that just manipulates the physical, but also the metaphysical.
4. In an of itself I would say it is not a sentient being, but a tool used by the Dark Powers, and it has limits/is not as powerful as some of the major power gods.

This is manna for DM's... we could use it to be anywhere at anytime, to pull just about anyone anywhere we want (ideally Ravenloft.)

I have a message in to the game developer to see if he can give me some clarification. I have a feeling the Mist was created in the game to explain how people get to Ravenloft, and it's power is subjective to the DM in question who is using it. More to come when I hear back.

Arkanis

I believe the Mists also serve as the borders for the plane itself. It could be something the Dark Powers just manipulate freely.

I know of Ravenloft existing within the Demi-Plane of Dread... but does it exist within or IS Ravenloft the Demi-Plane itself? I was told on Skype; "Ravenloft is actually not the only example of Mist being used as planes overlapping. The Mist is literally likely the plane intersecting the Prime. Ravenloft is a mobile locked thingFrom:Red Book It's likely why Vecna could 'crash' it into Sigil"

If the Mists border the realm itself, it would make sense that Ravenloft itself is the Demi-Plane.

But the Dark Powers is the real interest, which as you have said, is always kept hush-hush as to its real origins. I do agree that it is probably on the level of a Demi-God.

Flasmix wrote:I believe the Mists also serve as the borders for the plane itself. It could be something the Dark Powers just manipulate freely.

I know of Ravenloft existing within the Demi-Plane of Dread... but does it exist within or IS Ravenloft the Demi-Plane itself? I was told on Skype; "Ravenloft is actually not the only example of Mist being used as planes overlapping. The Mist is literally likely the plane intersecting the Prime. Ravenloft is a mobile locked thingFrom:Red Book It's likely why Vecna could 'crash' it into Sigil"

If the Mists border the realm itself, it would make sense that Ravenloft itself is the Demi-Plane.

But the Dark Powers is the real interest, which as you have said, is always kept hush-hush as to its real origins. I do agree that it is probably on the level of a Demi-God.

Bruce Nesmith, one of the creators of Ranvenloft tells me, "The Dark Powers are a story device for Ravenloft. So we use them whenever it is convenient. In terms of power, think about how powerful some of the Dark Lords are that they have captured. Pretty much only the gods would be beyond their grasp. Hopefully this answers your question."

Ark

DM Arkanis, can you talk about female Drow in the clergy of Vhaeraun? I know masked traitors exist -- but I am curious what role they play, as the clergy is listed as male only in 2nd editions.

Your best friend wrote:DM Arkanis, can you talk about female Drow in the clergy of Vhaeraun? I know masked traitors exist -- but I am curious what role they play, as the clergy is listed as male only in 2nd editions.

(Disclaimer: the following information is my opinion only and does not intend to set or circumvent server lore in any way. This is not a DM ruling, only Lore According to Arkanis.)

In my research I found, "Vhaeraun was the son of Araushnee and Corellon Larethian. He held the unique view among drow that males and females were equally valuable, and was primarily prayed to by those drow males who sought a better life than slavery under Lolth’s matriarchy, and that opposed it."

Faiths and Pantheons. (Wizards of the Coast), p. 114. ISBN 0-7869-2759-3.
Demihuman Deities. (Wizards of the Coast), pp. 36 & 37. ISBN 0-7869-1239-1.
A Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting Web Enhancement. (Wizards of the Coast), p. 12.
Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide. (Wizards of the Coast), p. 108. ISBN 978-0786965809.

"The shadows of the Masked Lord must cast off the tyranny of the Spider Queen and forcibly reclaim their birthright and rightful place in the Night Above. The existing drow matriarchy must be smashed, and the warring practices of twisted Lolth done away with, so that the drow are welded into a united people, not a squabbling gaggle of rival Houses, clans and aims. Vhaeraun will lead his followers into a society where drow once again reign supreme over the other, lesser races, and there is equality between males and females

Primarily I get two things from this: 1) males and females are equal in the eyes of this god, and 2) anyone looking to get away from Lloth/slavery can pray to him - the word EQUALITY suggests that females would be welcome members of his clergy as he was against matriarchy, not women.

Amongst his listed, known clergy in lore is Shakti Hunzrin, traitor-priestess of Lolth and Vhaeraun (1361 DR) Which was published after 2nd Ed. v3.0 came out in 2000, and v3.5 in 2003.

Tangled Webs. (Wizards of the Coast). ISBN 0-7869-2959-6. March 2003
Daughter of the Drow. (Wizards of the Coast), p. 212. ISBN 978-0786929290 - published in 2003 as well.

My understanding would be that v3.5 lore enhances 2nd Ed. and based on one female being in the clergy, and much other lore talking about equality, I would see no reason why females would not be considered eligible, and play full and equal roles to their male counterparts.

I have a message in to Elaine Cunningham who authored some of the paper-backs containing the lore to see if she will add anything to this discussion.

Arkanis