Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

You know giving more xp per kill isn't going to reduce the grinding au contraire it sets the focus on grinding cause that's how you gain xp even more efficiently then.
One could also say that gaining xp through grinding more quickly while allowing you to test more characters and different styles would lead you to focus on leveling tons of different toons without ever focusing on actually playing the character but rather you just chasing a certain level with that character having little to no connection to it IF and only IF you would solely just grind it to 30 without much RPing which could occur if xp per kill is just so effective that you'd think why even bother with RPing?

That's why I think increasing RP xp is the better way to go cause it sets the focus on what should be the focus on an RP server and on playing the character ICly rather than OOCly running around killing one monster after another which quiet frankly would almost make a character evil ICly if he'd just run around killing 100s and thousands just for sports so to say.

If you emphasize on xp per kill that puts a certain pressure on people to grind to not lose too much ground to others. If grinding is less effective compared to RPing it's releasing that pressure allowing for more RP focused play.

To your point of the developers ignoring the majority, I have to say the community of all kinds of games request all kinds of changes often they are not ignored but their thoughts are being evaluated and then not followed for various reasons. Often because what they think would be good for the game might actually hurt it instead or it just leads into a direction the developer doesn't want his game to go.

I have to say I am confused about the amount of people that seem to like to grind on this server. It is an old game with relatively poor graphics and basically everything feels a bit old, if I wanted to play something for the action part of the game I'd search for a newer game with better graphics and more fluent mechanics... But that is just me.

Rask wrote:I still don't get how increasing XP gain is going to negatively effect anyone's RP on this server. Who cares if someone get's to 30 a little easier than you did when you did it?

This server should be about having fun, trying out lots of RP across a few characters. Not about killing edless hours of Xvarts to keep up with the people around you. It's easy to tell people to work hard to get to 30 when you have the free time to dedicate those hours to both grinding to progress AND role play in equal measure. This is not the case for some.

For new players, I am sure many burn out once they hit a certain level and it starts to become more and more of a chore to progress. Especially when they run into events and they are almost always geared toward level 21+ characters in CR. And then to come here and read a thread like this, and the last one, where over 50% of the server votes in favour of XP increase for kills, but the vocal minority of hardcores wins out anyways.

It shows people that not only do the players who are more casual not really matter, but that the majority speaking out on something also go unheard for no truly good reason.

Because honestly, I have not seen one good reason to not do it come up. Not a single one. Mostly it's just people's personal playstyles being they like to grind for longer or think that other people reaching level 30 easier than they did will somehow make their RP worse (it wont.).

I like grinding... and while 1-20 is fine, 20-30 could use a slight boost. Nothing major necessarily, even making epic mobs give 30-35 xp instead of 20 or less would help but not in an OP way. It will still take you a long time to reach 30 but at least it wont be such a chore. RP is fun and all but i play for more then just sitting around flapping my gums all day, rp without combat and loot is boring lol. If i wanted that i would play on a social server.

I like to combine the two things, RP can be done standing or sitting around but usually that requires something to happen prior to that or at least afterwards. Just sitting around talking I agree is not that enjoyable.

After looking a bit at the numbers from the votes of both posts about xp its clear most would like to see more xp comming there way and who can blame them?

So i would like to ask the Admins - what is holding you all back?

This is just a question but i would very mutch like the Admins to give there view.

Face wrote:After looking a bit at the numbers from the votes of both posts about xp its clear most would like to see more xp comming there way and who can blame them?

So i would like to ask the Admins - what is holding you all back?

This is just a question but i would very mutch like the Admins to give there view.

I noticed a small increase in xp for both RP and mob killing the last couple of days.

Hawke wrote:

Face wrote:After looking a bit at the numbers from the votes of both posts about xp its clear most would like to see more xp comming there way and who can blame them?

So i would like to ask the Admins - what is holding you all back?

This is just a question but i would very mutch like the Admins to give there view.

I noticed a small increase in xp for both RP and mob killing the last couple of days.

Only seen it with rp xp.
And this doesnt anser the question.

I would like if XP and loot where used more as a carrot to guide people towards the longer dungeons/adventures. Those where having a group is a real benefit, if not essential. This all leads back to boss's giving way more xp, and better loot as well. Getting to the end of a big dungeon should be something special.

Today people often just loop around the boss, or stay in a meat-grinder area for hours *cough*xvarts*cough* because that is more xp/hour. Yesterday I killed two bosses, they both gave the same xp as two minion kills (but was WAY harder) and ZERO loot. I also had to run for dear life from a boss. I would have loved to go seeking fellow adventurers to join me in slaying that vile beast, but that is just so much easier if there was a bigger carrot for slaying it than to say "well, we did it, it's dead". I know that is enough for some, and the RP around it should be reward enough, and it is. It is one of those things where when you do it, you are glad you did it, but it's a hurdle you have to cross to get rolling. Hence, bigger carrot

We need more ways to funnel people towards the fun experience adventuring together is. Could be xp + loot payouts as mentioned above, could be resource collection (smells like crafting?), could be more dynamic quests that scale over all levels, so you don't just go murdering 50 giants, but instead go stop a giant raiding party or something.

Good idea but then the bosses would need to be made so strong that you just can't solo them anymore in my opinion maybe even the mobs before the body already being a challenge so that a single guy can't just l them by himself.

Otherwise people will just go there alone again don't you think?

dedude wrote:I would like if XP and loot where used more as a carrot to guide people towards the longer dungeons/adventures. Those where having a group is a real benefit, if not essential. This all leads back to boss's giving way more xp, and better loot as well. Getting to the end of a big dungeon should be something special.

Today people often just loop around the boss, or stay in a meat-grinder area for hours *cough*xvarts*cough* because that is more xp/hour. Yesterday I killed two bosses, they both gave the same xp as two minion kills (but was WAY harder) and ZERO loot. I also had to run for dear life from a boss. I would have loved to go seeking fellow adventurers to join me in slaying that vile beast, but that is just so much easier if there was a bigger carrot for slaying it than to say "well, we did it, it's dead". I know that is enough for some, and the RP around it should be reward enough, and it is. It is one of those things where when you do it, you are glad you did it, but it's a hurdle you have to cross to get rolling. Hence, bigger carrot

We need more ways to funnel people towards the fun experience adventuring together is. Could be xp + loot payouts as mentioned above, could be resource collection (smells like crafting?), could be more dynamic quests that scale over all levels, so you don't just go murdering 50 giants, but instead go stop a giant raiding party or something.

Like I said, I had to run from a boss in an area that was definitely within my CR. Some places might need a looking-at though. But you can't stop people from going below their CR and killing a boss. I just wan't people to rather go with a group and hit a place within, or above, their CR. That should give the most payout. It's definitely the most fun.

Face wrote:

This is just a question but i would very mutch like the Admins to give there view.

This is what Maecius wrote a few pages back:

In the end, goals are achieved if you stick to them. There definitely are level 30 characters on this server. And the reward is made more profound for the effort put in. I've only had two characters hit level 30 in my many years playing here. And both times it was a great feeling, I'll admit that. I even posted a bragging screenshot the first time I hit 30. But part of the reason it felt great is because it took like a year and cost hundreds of hours of dedication to a single character.

I'm not 100% set in stone on this position, but from a game design perspective, the reason people want to be level 30 is because it is an achievement -- with measurable payoff:

I'd just hate to see a medal of honor turned into a participation trophy.

dedude wrote:Like I said, I had to run from a boss in an area that was definitely within my CR. Some places might need a looking-at though. But you can't stop people from going below their CR and killing a boss. I just wan't people to rather go with a group and hit a place within, or above, their CR. That should give the most payout. It's definitely the most fun.

Well doing that is easy. JUST DO IT. I do all the time in groups. I push them to rise above their safe constraints and push something truly worth the time. If you risk it you can get great rewards! Two things on this server will allow you to survive first and most importantly. AC and HP. These two things are the most important part of a build. THen after that AB and Saves. You can do 25 damage a hit and kill stuff just fine but you got to be able to stand there and take their hit too or avoid it all together.

Steve wrote:

Face wrote:

This is just a question but i would very mutch like the Admins to give there view.

This is what Maecius wrote a few pages back:

In the end, goals are achieved if you stick to them. There definitely are level 30 characters on this server. And the reward is made more profound for the effort put in. I've only had two characters hit level 30 in my many years playing here. And both times it was a great feeling, I'll admit that. I even posted a bragging screenshot the first time I hit 30. But part of the reason it felt great is because it took like a year and cost hundreds of hours of dedication to a single character.

I'm not 100% set in stone on this position, but from a game design perspective, the reason people want to be level 30 is because it is an achievement -- with measurable payoff:

I'd just hate to see a medal of honor turned into a participation trophy.

seems me and Maecius have a very difrent opinion
And so seem most of the other people that voted.
Come on cut that time in half im sure we all grinded enough monsters that we now may relax a little.
Let us gain xp at a pace where folks with a life and the folks that are sick of the grind can gain xp at a rate that doesnt want to make you scratch your eyes out.

Calodan wrote:Well doing that is easy. JUST DO IT.

You missed the point. Game designers are shepherds, players are sheep. Some times sheep need to be steered away from the cliff and over to the grassy meadow for the herd to prosper.

dedude wrote:

Calodan wrote:Well doing that is easy. JUST DO IT.

You missed the point. Game designers are shepherds, players are sheep. Some times sheep need to be steered away from the cliff and over to the grassy meadow for the herd to prosper.

So be the SHEEP DOG and lead them! I did not miss any point at all.

I used to hate, hate and hate the loot system. I still do. However it is not the monstrosity you think it is. If you want to push higher CR then just do it. Higher CR for your PC does indeed have a LOOT INCENTIVE to go there. I run FAI loot at level 7 which is far and above the loot from BG to FAI which is the proper CR for my PC. I find plenty of things to sell and or keep from time to time.

Now if you want the really fat lootz you got to run the epic dungeons. VOD, FROST KING, GREY PEAKS, WROMTHRAX, YUANTI those places have the LOOTZ. Fact of life in BG. More danger = more reward so if you wish to see that reward you are wanting then you must try and do things that are above you.

Also I am pretty sure in this thread I posted the loot loops for CRs on this server up to level 21. Try it sometime and tell me I am wrong then. I make plenty of gold and that is with using consumables on the reg to push higher CR and get higher lootz. We veterans are not saying this because we hate change. We are saying this because it is true. I have had a hard time with that too. Even called AC81 a liar and that was not true. My understanding of things was flawed.

Regardless of how we feel about the xp system, I don't think demanding answers from management is the way to go. I think we can all agree that they want this place to succeed, and when it comes to arguments about what will make that happen, you can't really argue against having 96/96 players on Saturday (I couldn't log on ) It's kind of their trump card, and it's based on reality rather than theorycrafting.

Could it be tweaked? Sure. I'm sure they're listening to the angst, even if the answer turns out to be "no." With or without you or me, the place will still be the most popular server for medium-RP on the interwebz. . .

And I think K'yon's prediction about grinding in the face of higher mob rewards is pretty spot-on.