Suggestion: Remove all +1/+2 items from the Loot Tables

[Winthorp]

Here's what would make gear and economy more interesting: stuff breaks over time and needs to be repaired. And there's always a chance (albeit small) that it just breaks and it's gone.

The way it is now, once you have your "epic" stuff, sure, you are still looking for more powerful stuff, but there's no "real" incentive in trading or such.

[Calodan]

Here's what would make gear and economy more interesting: stuff breaks over time and needs to be repaired. And there's always a chance (albeit small) that it just breaks and it's gone.

The way it is now, once you have your "epic" stuff, sure, you are still looking for more powerful stuff, but there's no "real" incentive in trading or such.

Could you imagine finally affording that epic weapon of smiting after a year of RP for the average person who has 2 hours a week and it breaks after only so many sessions of RP later?

If we do that then the gold ratio has to go way up to accommodate the least of us. That will never happen though because of players like me who have all day nearly every day to waste their miserable life away on video games.......Safe to say I have a addiction but this is better than heroin right?

[Steve]

As far as the OP suggestion goes, I think it is a pretty simple no from everyone in "power". It is still the intention to release the pack horses at some point, which will allow the weak characters to drag some armors back to town, but you all will have to be patient while we still have issues with the database access.

Are you the current Director of Communications?

When QC/Devs-Scripters/admins comment, I read it as personal opinion, to engage in the discussion, unless, someone being either an HDM or an Admin say: "the official decision is no."

Unless...the current paradigm is QC and Devs are "in charge" and their personal opinions drive the Server, as in, multiple captains of the ship.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, truly...but if Staff is going to be snarky in their comments, then I'm taking that as play, and NOT official/simple/obvious decisions

Not at all. And especially, I don't accept others speaking for others, as "what I should believe the others to think." People should speak for themselves, and when needed, the top dogs simply need to state what is or what isn't going to happen, and what is being debated behind closed doors to us proles.

I'm fine with outcomes being generated, even if they go against a suggestion. So bring it!

[Winthorp]

Here's what would make gear and economy more interesting: stuff breaks over time and needs to be repaired. And there's always a chance (albeit small) that it just breaks and it's gone.

The way it is now, once you have your "epic" stuff, sure, you are still looking for more powerful stuff, but there's no "real" incentive in trading or such.

Could you imagine finally affording that epic weapon of smiting after a year of RP for the average person who has 2 hours a week and it breaks after only so many sessions of RP later?

If we do that then the gold ratio has to go way up to accommodate the least of us. That will never happen though because of players like me who have all day nearly every day to waste their miserable life away on video games.......Safe to say I have a addiction but this is better than heroin right?

Oh I absolutely get it, but the alternative is that you reach an end point in which you don't really need to upgrade or change your gear anymore, and eventually that makes the economy stagnant.

Fair enough, here's an alternative: You can repair stuff, but it's quite costly. Also, stuff CAN break, but it doesn't disappear. Instead, one very specific blacksmith (one for weapons, one for armors, one for cloaks and boots, one for jewelry, etc) is able, for a hefty fee, to repair your stuff.

The problem with eternal items is that they kill the economy, given enough time...

[dedude]

Are you the current Director of Communications?

When QC/Devs-Scripters/admins comment, I read it as personal opinion, to engage in the discussion, unless, someone being either an HDM or an Admin say: "the official decision is no."

Unless...the current paradigm is QC and Devs are "in charge" and their personal opinions drive the Server, as in, multiple captains of the ship.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, truly...but if Staff is going to be snarky in their comments, then I'm taking that as play, and NOT official/simple/obvious decisions

Not at all. And especially, I don't accept others speaking for others, as "what I should believe the others to think." People should speak for themselves, and when needed, the top dogs simply need to state what is or what isn't going to happen, and what is being debated behind closed doors to us proles.

I'm fine with outcomes being generated, even if they go against a suggestion. So bring it!

I'm sorry Steve, I know your game is riling up drama and discussions on the forums, and I accidentally fell in and responded. I was not trying to be snarky, I didn't even comment on how stupid I thought the suggestion was. First part was obviously my (educated) opinion, ignore it if you will, and the second part was a public service announcement.

[Steve]

I know your game is ...

You know nothing about me! lol. Assumptions are easy to make. I make them too.

[Egg Shen]

Here's what would make gear and economy more interesting: stuff breaks over time and needs to be repaired. And there's always a chance (albeit small) that it just breaks and it's gone.

The way it is now, once you have your "epic" stuff, sure, you are still looking for more powerful stuff, but there's no "real" incentive in trading or such.

Could you imagine finally affording that epic weapon of smiting after a year of RP for the average person who has 2 hours a week and it breaks after only so many sessions of RP later?

If we do that then the gold ratio has to go way up to accommodate the least of us. That will never happen though because of players like me who have all day nearly every day to waste their miserable life away on video games.......Safe to say I have a addiction but this is better than heroin right?

Oh I absolutely get it, but the alternative is that you reach an end point in which you don't really need to upgrade or change your gear anymore, and eventually that makes the economy stagnant.

Fair enough, here's an alternative: You can repair stuff, but it's quite costly. Also, stuff CAN break, but it doesn't disappear. Instead, one very specific blacksmith (one for weapons, one for armors, one for cloaks and boots, one for jewelry, etc) is able, for a hefty fee, to repair your stuff.

The problem with eternal items is that they kill the economy, given enough time...

There is no 'economy' here. There are unlimited items and unlimited gold. If the only reason we continue to play is because we don't have 'perfect' gear, then we have bigger problems than our imaginary economy.

So, things that we can currently do if we "perfect" a character include:
Starting a new character.
Using our wealth to foster our own plots and guilds and agendas.
Continuing to amass wealth for no reason other than bragging rights
Roleplaying - we'll find lots of interesting conversations to join in when we aren't focused on what is apparently the only reason to play (i.e. getting outfitted in epic gear) Our fingers will be free to engage in typing.
Trolling for DM attention. They can probably find a way to rid us of all our gold or equipment if that's our thing.

I mean, there ARE people with perfect gear on this server and they continue to log in and play, so perhaps we should ask them what they get up to in game that gives their character's life meaning.

All snarkiness aside, we really should consider some in character gold sinks that encourage our characters to invest/donate in some way. Just in case none of the above mentioned activities seem fun.

[Winthorp]

There is no 'economy' here. There are unlimited items and unlimited gold. If the only reason we continue to play is because we don't have 'perfect' gear, then we have bigger problems than our imaginary economy.

No one said anything about playing only for the gear. Not sure why you'd even bring that up. Bringing up a point no one made and argue against that is called "straw man argument". It's what people with reading comprehension problems or double digits IQ do.

So, things that we can currently do if we "perfect" a character include:
Starting a new character.
Using our wealth to foster our own plots and guilds and agendas.
Continuing to amass wealth for no reason other than bragging rights
Roleplaying - we'll find lots of interesting conversations to join in when we aren't focused on what is apparently the only reason to play (i.e. getting outfitted in epic gear) Our fingers will be free to engage in typing.
Trolling for DM attention. They can probably find a way to rid us of all our gold or equipment if that's our thing.

I mean, there ARE people with perfect gear on this server and they continue to log in and play, so perhaps we should ask them what they get up to in game that gives their character's life meaning.

All snarkiness aside, we really should consider some in character gold sinks that encourage our characters to invest/donate in some way. Just in case none of the above mentioned activities seem fun.

"perfect"... what? Who said anything about perfect anything? The simple point is that an environment where the economy works and exists and affects things is more fun than an environment that, given enough time, will become hopelessly static.

[Egg Shen]

Yes, thank you for educating me about one fallacy while skirting dangerously close to committing one of your own. You kept the insults unspecific, so maybe it's not really an ad hominem?

I guess I read more into your post than you intended (presumably because of poor reading comprehension). But with my newfound knowledge of what a straw man is, and since we're clarifying what we meant with our posts, I think I was mostly reacting to the idea that the economy (as you imagine it) has anything to do with our enjoyment of this server and is only very loosely related to the topic at hand. Sure, Steve brought it up in his initial post, but it was mostly ignored because it made no sense (sorry Steve ) It was almost like you brought up a non-existent problem in order to lend weight to a solution you favored...

I was making the simple point that based on your concept of what a stagnant economy is ("you reach an end point in which you don't really need to upgrade or change your gear anymore, and eventually that makes the economy stagnant"), we should already be suffering the effects in game since many people have reached said point. Yet people continue to play and enjoy the server by doing some of the things I listed in my post, a few of which relate specifically to unloading coin even when you no longer need gear.

In the end I agree that having more worthwhile things to spend your coin on is a good thing. Weapon breakage/repair is simply an annoyance. I'd rather you just take the coin from me as a tax so I don't have to spend my limited game time with mundane crap like fixing my weapon. Requiring food and making it expensive probably seems like a next level, super clever and fun economic stimulus package to you as well, right?

Hopefully this connects the dots on how I meant for my post to relate to your post.

TLDR - I no likey weapon maintenance. And I disagree with some of your fundamental assumptions.

[Calodan]

And now we are going to argue over a video game.....

I can tell you it is not as bad as any may seem to think it is. God this is going to blow your mind but the RIG and system is cranking out tons of items and gold right now. We have accelerated to ludicrous speed on items in the RIG compared to when I first got here.

Just do not expect great things from low level areas is all. It won't happen since it is low level PCs who need that +1 to +2 stuff. Including things like that, that have +1 or +2 with other goodies. Something else that was nigh impossible.

Maybe the server just needs to put the item level restrictions back up? That would make them useful again.....

[chad878262]

Maybe the server just needs to put the item level restrictions back up? That would make them useful again.....

I would support this 100% as I know many others would. Unfortunately it would cause a lot of trouble (i think ) due to PCs jabbing illegal items equipped if we revert back to level requirements. In addition the level requirements had little impact when it came to +1/2 Items. I think+3 only required level 7 IIRC... Maybe level 11?

[aaron22]

perhaps a new formula should be considered to bring back item level restriction. while i am sure this would put a cramp in a lot of people's style including my own, i have always thought this better FOR THE GAME. it may not make a lot of sense in the real world. this can be said for a lot of things that are in the game right now and will continue to be implored by people and employed by the admin. its a video game people not a life simulator.

[Steve]

The majority of Items I find in Epic CR Areas, are with +1/+2 stars, or worse. Just review the many screenshots I've posted.

Item Restriction should be turned back on. I'm sure a clever Dev can figure out how to setup a log in script to check for items and I equip them.

The low EB items have been turned into crap because high EB is cheaply available and infinitely everywhere. I've honestly seen better Items left in donation boxes, than what I find, currently.

But if my problem is that I don't Loot Farm enough, or widely enough, then sure, I'm just not going to find non +1/+2 items. If this is the system, and I see how much the setup interferes with time spent role-playing, then yes, I see what the Staff wants, and though I disagree on its setup because of how it affects the Server, this is the paradigm that few wish to see changed. Bummer.

[Sun Wukong]

Just do not expect great things from low level areas is all.

I found a quarterstaff with +1 EB, +1 Cold Damage, +1 Electrical Damage, +1 Acid Damage. I do not know about you... but it was the first time my jaw dropped down in a while. It made me want to RCR my Rogue/Cleric/Hierophant into a Monk/Cleric/Hierophant - but it actually works pretty nicely on my current build. I might be missing that heavy shield AC and some points in spot skill, but who cares... I love that quarterstaff.

Now, all I need to do is convince a DM to add +1 Fire damage to it to have my Staff of Four Seasons, instead of just Three Seasons. Oh shame, I need to be on my best behaviour, get involved in server RP beyond random adventuring.

[Sun Wukong]

Item Restriction should be turned back on. I'm sure a clever Dev can figure out how to setup a log in script to check for items and I equip them.

I hope not, do you know how annoying it was to actually find something nice and not be able to use it until you had levelled up enough? Do you know how long I kept using some random +1 Weapon because my character was not have high enough level to use that +3 weapon with 1d4 acid damage he found at level 6?

The item restrictions serve no purpose beyond annoyance. In fact, I remember those making all spellresistance items pretty much useless. Spell resistance of 14? You are not using it until level 15+ at which point it did nothing!

But if my problem is that I don't Loot Farm enough, or widely enough, then sure, I'm just not going to find non +1/+2 items. If this is the system, and I see how much the setup interferes with time spent role-playing, then yes, I see what the Staff wants, and though I disagree on its setup because of how it affects the Server, this is the paradigm that few wish to see changed. Bummer.

Just go to Soubar, go north, then south-west to Troll Claw Fjord, go through the ogre cave, peak into Titanfist mines, go to the troll cave and run back to Soubar. It is about an hour of your time and if you play on popular hours you will most likely get someone to tag along with you. If you do it every day, you should find some neat '+3' item every now and then. I just found +3 heavy shield with +3 to Listen.