Developing the Underdark

[Melisende]

Over the last two or three months, I have spent a fair bit of time developing and playing Underdark characters. I have come to recognize quite a few of the players who regularly play in the Underdark. Unfortunately, I have also seen some of the players I have come to know and appreciate either leave or become substantially less active on the server. I cannot help but feel that this is at least in part due to the Underdark being akin to a forgotten stepchild on this server.

Things are what they are and I am not looking to rehash past debates nor do I wish to recriminate against anyone. Rather, I would like to explore what can be done to revitalize play in the Underdark and hopefully usher in at least semi regular roleplay events and perhaps some extended plotlines.

I have some plot ideas, but without player and staff support I suspect that they will have no chance at all to get off the ground. At this time the most practical approach that I can think of is to try to build up regular group play. Given the relatively small number of Underdark regulars it might be sensible to set up predetermined times - during weekends to start with - when interested players would get together to take part in a campaign (much like a pen and paper session). It is my hope that by "scheduling" roleplay sessions we will be able to secure DM support, because let's be honest, the opportunity for loot and XP from events is a major draw for players.

I am not certain whether DM Denim Rogue has any intention of furthering the plotline involving the Illithid Three, but that is one particular narrative that could support events for a wide variety of characters. If there is enough interest, I would certainly be happy to reach out to DM Denim Rogue and or the DM team as a whole to ask for support assuming that the idea of regular weekend events for the Underdark is of interest to a large enough pool of players.

So, are any of you willing to sign on to the idea of weekend group play?

[Eldebryn]

I am willing to support any such attempts for the UD, and I have been doing so whenever possible in the last months.

I am also planning something for the 7th Circle, we already have a few people being members and many more are interested in it. All I am waiting for is some more info from a certain player and then I will set the wheels into motion in an attempt to have 'gathering' for all those members and see where RP takes us

Of course you, as well as every other UD player, is invited to participate in any way possible.

[Mammothtruk]

the UD is in dire need of a few UD DMs that want to do the UD. Those types of DMs seem to be really rare.

That said I am down for gathering up and doing any time you want. Just drop a post here or PM me and I will do my best to be there.

[Eldebryn]

Yeah... it's the all-time-classic


Lack of DM/staff attention in the UD <===> Lack of UD population/action.

argument, it also goes both ways regarding cause and result in case you didn't notice...

Never gets resolved though, and there are plenty of reasons supporting each side as the 'cause'.

I believe there is indeed a connection between those two though, so one these issues has to corrected, in hopes that it will cause the other one to vanish as well.

[Blackman D]

having UD only DMs would be the best way, but then you run into the problem of no one wanting to do it so it doesnt get done

or a guy gets forced to do it that doesnt want to do it so they dont care

and the in the rare case that someone does want to do it they are never around for long for some reason

[Mammothtruk]

well if I wasnt terrible at DMing I would do it, but alas my skills are more player based in puppet RPing than conducting an orchestra of NPCs to form a story.

However if someone in the community is currently not a DM and wants to do the UD DM gig I believe they are looking for a few folks. Otherwise L2toolset!

[Molag__Bal]

There is a small group currently working on improving the UD. Some of the things being worked on right now:

- tfunke has been building UD areas like a machine, which should hopefully make the level 1-10 grind a bit easier and more interesting.

- All of the UD areas will soon follow the same naming format so that DM's will have an easier time finding players and running UD events.

- We are looking at increasing the XP gain a bit at the low levels (1 -5). The grind to level 2 with an ECL 2 race is quite brutal, and is one of the factors that drives players to the surface.

We hope that these improvements will entice more players to try out the UD. Some DM support would also be great, but that will require some DM's that actually enjoy the UD setting. I know we have a few that are happy to run UD events, if they can find a group.

[Eldebryn]

I have the impression that some of the DMs also feel uncomfortable with DMing in the UD because they are not so familiar with the setting, especially since Sshamath is a very different than the average drow city.

If anyone has that problem I would recommend the various lore topics we have in this sub-forum, the http://drowcampaign.roleplaynexus.com/ site and the FR wikia, all with great info on Sshamath.

They can even PM me if they have specific questions or little time . Don't be shy.

[Melisende]

There is a small group currently working on improving the UD. Some of the things being worked on right now:

- tfunke has been building UD areas like a machine, which should hopefully make the level 1-10 grind a bit easier and more interesting.

- All of the UD areas will soon follow the same naming format so that DM's will have an easier time finding players and running UD events.

- We are looking at increasing the XP gain a bit at the low levels (1 -5). The grind to level 2 with an ECL 2 race is quite brutal, and is one of the factors that drives players to the surface.

We hope that these improvements will entice more players to try out the UD. Some DM support would also be great, but that will require some DM's that actually enjoy the UD setting. I know we have a few that are happy to run UD events, if they can find a group.

Thank you for the information, the improvements you detail are promising and hold out hope for new players in the UD. But, to be honest, I feel that DM support is critical to any sustained upturn in the UD player base.

I believe most of us who have high level UD characters have come to terms with limited link up opportunities with other players and have no illusions that the playing field between the surface and the Underdark will ever truly be level. That said, given that access to the surface is severely restricted, regular DM events with their attendant opportunities for roleplay and rewards become crucial to sustaining a vibrant and dynamic playing environment.

I am not blind to the chicken or the egg quandary that Eldebryn raised, which is why I proposed gathering a group first and possibly "scheduling" events. Perhaps though instead of asking a current DM to dedicate themselves to taking care of the UD, a new primarily UD DM could be appointed. I have neither the technical expertise nor the time for such, but maybe someone like Eldebryn would be willing to stand for the position. I would be happy to provide some plot ideas assuming that a DM is interested in bringing such to fruition.

[Eldebryn]

Regarding the UD DMs, I came to know a few months ago that the staff abandoned this area, I think the reason was that 'it didn't work' or something like that, and that having non-restricted DMs would be better.

However, after watching the situation after all this time, I have to say this doesn't make sense. Even though that decision was made, DMs rarely choose to try DMing in the UD, even those small on-the-run events that we UDers really appreciate.

So, I guess I would support re-enabling UD-only DMs. If nothing else, such a regulation would motivate those individuals to try and work something in the UD instead of taking the easy way of DMing in the surface.

Moreover, I am looking on initiating a plot or event related to the Circle to draw many players and we might be pretty close to that actually happening.

[DM Sword]

I think the OP was bang on with his suggestion for making weekly meeting times for those interested to RP and develop their own plots. This is an excellent step in growing player numbers and gaining the attention of DMs.

I actively look for UDers to run events for when I am on as a DM (sadly that was very little in the last couple months due to RL). But in the last year or so I was lucky if I could find a group of two or more that was actually RPing with each other. Unfortunately, some of the time I would find a group of two or more and they would either not be RPing, or be talking only about OOC topics.

I know some of you have been trying very hard to get things going on your own, and I salute you for your efforts, and I assure you they have not gone unnoticed.

[The_Alchemyst]

What makes this an RP server? The rules?

If the DM interaction isn't there then all UD RP is subject to and constricted by the current layout. Coupled with how long character progression in the UD takes, difficulty, lack of area options, I think its a great formula for an anti-rp elixir.

If there is NO DM rp xp, then the only way for your character to progress, even for rp profession purposes, is to grind. Maybe talking about the weather on the surface is a viable option for reaching 1000xp to level 2, but doing so in the UD for level 2's 6000xp is somewhere between writing another R.A Salvatore novel and the absurd.

It is evident, to me anyway, that restrictive measures put in place to encourage rp and curb grinding have in fact had the opposite effect. I'd say especially in the UD the enemy difficulty is set to "powerbuild" levels if you aren't in a party, which is hard to find.

Many characters I'm sure have had their bios and lore advanced and established through DM interaction, I think the UD needs that same rp foundation put in place so the players have something to build on and grow on their own.

But, if the UD is going to be treated differently DM wise then it should be treated differently rules and settings wise.

[TalonofWindspeak]

Everyone plays for different reasons, and I can respect that..

I agree with a lot of the things brought up, but for me, I don't need a DM just to enjoy the game...

Have had lots of fun RPing just with PCs I play with, why so DM dependent, hmm? This is not a PnP game where you absolutely need a DM..

When I log in I want some action. A lot of lengthy soap opera RP seems like I'm in a typing contest in grammar school. For me a party of adventurer trying to make there way to fame & fortune is more than enough. Problem is no one stays in Underdark long enough to form a strong bond of a "team". I made PCs specifically to go into groups of such individuals, they almost always leave the server after about 2 - 3 weeks, some more, some less.

Guess what I am bascially saying is PC driven RP is more significant for me then DM driven stuff. For that you need goals and a "hook". The emphasis for PCs to get bios on to forums is great idea, even for me after what 3 years playing off and on on BG I finally did one.. It helps.

I really would like to see a bulletin board in game in Underdark. Why? Because if you look at the surface one it is invariably full of new players to the game. A lot don't have forum accounts yet and it is a great tool to interact with them to encourage RP and hopefully forum and longer term server presence.

The auctioneer buying and selling goods is really starting to become a pet peeve of mine.. it promotes practically nil RP between players, how do you RP you just bought it from a surfacer? Does that auctioneer have regular trading caravan UD to surface? And the FAI auction rules... laughable at best..

My 2 pennies worth..

Oh and trying to form another famous/infamous adventurers... ... let's get it going!

[mdchrist]

Well you'll have two new drow male wizards to beat around me and a friend are going to be joining the UD this coming weekend ^.~. Elvith Vilows and i don't remember his name but we'll be intuned, i love rping drows its tough but its definetly a fun thing to do.

[Eldebryn]

Could someone inform me of the surface's bulletin board features in a detailed manner? A PM is fine too.

I have discussed the addition of a signpost containing the rules one needs to follow while inside Sshamath (like no drawn weapons) , since I thought that was the only thing the 'bulletin board' was.


As for the DM dependence issue, I partially agree with Talon, people shouldn't rely on DMs, they should also try to promote RP and interesting stories/incidents on their own.

*However* after some time it becomes quite obvious how much the absence of DM events and interventions can affect the UD.

For instance, in the surface one can earn well over 6k exp. each week + the exp from the much more frequent DM events there. I hear people thanking the DMs constantly for the great time they have because of those events, while in the UD events have had a pretty stable frequency: extremely rare to non-existent. Not to mention that UD offers only 3-4 k exp from quests, that sometimes are even done by epic level surfacers who think it's ok to grab those easy xp without RPing at all.


To conclude, yes DMs are not the panacea of the Underdark, but they are certainly a strong "medicine" that can help us get over our issues, provided we players put some effort into the "treatment" too.

As others have said in the past, try imagining that for one or two whole months, the whole DM crew abandons the surface to work exclusively in the UD while the exp down there is increased by 50% or 100%. What would the UD/surface population ratio be at the end of the month...?