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Recommended ranks in thieving skills

Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 1:59 pm
by CrimsonMist
I'm currently working on a character with limited skill points who's intending to develop several roguish skills.

She won't have the Trapfinding skill, so certain traps are beyond her abilities anyway,

What are the minimum recommended levels for open lock, disable device, set trap and search?

The character is an elf with 19 dexterity and 16 intelligence unbuffed.

Re: Recommended ranks in thieving skills

Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 6:09 pm
by LordLP
While I can't give exact numbers (last rogue I had was Vicktor years and years ago) I will tell you - high investment or no investment in these skills. A little will get you by lower levels but will feel like a waste higher levels.

Disable Device: In relation to search, must be high to disable traps (get it very high you can actually recover and sell them). You should focus on this primarily.

Search: Your secondary choice for skill points - you want this high, especially being elf. Elves receive a +2 bonus as well. I would find a happy medium, like base skill 30.

Open Lock - Questionable if useful (though used to make navigating the netherlese temple a lot easier, not sure anymore). I would get the minimum amount you can afford to throw away my self.

Set Traps - DC's Very but Deadly/Epic range from 35-45DC - So it's 1d20 + Skill = Being said, 100% you need over 45 (modified) skill. You can lower it and take the risk - but I find traps are not worth the investment on skill starved. (Also you'll find your self using traps far to infrequently to warrant the skill dump)

Re: Recommended ranks in thieving skills

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:22 am
by dzidek1983
it depends on the jobs you want to undertake...

i presume you will use stealth so maxing Hide and Move silently is obvious pick...

now for the "utility" perks...

open locks.. unless you want to open the most of the epic locks a small 1 point will suffice really, you are adding a probably +10 DEX mod and a +20 roll, maybe some gear and thieves tools so reaching DC 40 is not so unpossible

disable device... this one is to be maxed, never know what trap will the random executioner roll up for you

search... also to be maxed for the same reason above

spot and listen... if you want to detect choose one and max it (unless you can aford the skill points take both)

tumble.. +3 AC for 30 ranks is the goal....

set trap... highest DC to beat is 45, its based on dexterity too and has a synergy with disable device, basically taking 33 ensures you never fail even on a low roll, i dont know how usefull this skill is probably in epic levels not so much, more of a RP tool cos the traps dont have high dmg or DC's

sleight of hand... for me its a RP skill... invest if you want to toy with it

use magic device.. the most powerfull skill in game.. max it and use all the goodies of other classes

diplomacy, bluff, intimidate... always usefull to have some conversation skills, for a thief bluff seems best and in fact its needed if u will use Feint, even if you dont i would heavily invest in one just to have a chance for higher awards from quests

Re: Recommended ranks in thieving skills

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:38 pm
by Nomster
dzidek1983 wrote:open locks.. unless you want to open the most of the epic locks a small 1 point will suffice really, you are adding a probably +10 DEX mod and a +20 roll, maybe some gear and thieves tools so reaching DC 40 is not so unpossible
Open Lock stands out from the other rogue skills because it allows you to take 20 in a non combat situation. Few skills do this, the only other I can think of is Heal. With 1 invested point, gear and Cat's + Gr Heroism I can reach 45 easily. I could probably go higher with more gear but that would be swapping spellslot gear which is always an annoyance. Some epic chests (yuan-ti) have higher DC but I can't remember what it was. My own goal was to reach 45 to open the door and chests in the Pirate Cave in Ulgoth's - only to discover that 2 of 3 chests don't work :lol:

That said, you don't get Take 20 on Disable Device (and the other skills) so need to invest more heavily. I'm not too sure about Search, I detect most traps with my half-elf without any investment - 7 points from Int and racial/class feats.

Re: Recommended ranks in thieving skills

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 1:45 pm
by CrimsonMist
Disable device seems a bit pointless to pump too many points into - as the thieving skills are coming from guild thief and shadowdancer, I won't have the Trapfinding skill to defuse traps with DC of higher than 20.

Stealth will be maxed and tumble taken to 30.

Re: Recommended ranks in thieving skills

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 8:30 pm
by Eden
Set trap should be really really funny.
As for open lock, 4 points at lvl 1 and maye some more, growing up, but not that many.
Place 1 point in sleight of hand, that's really funny too, even if you're going to fail.
Avoid search and disable device if you think you can affort the trap hits. Assuming you got at least 3 rogue levels, you'll have evasion that will help you to.