Shadow Conjuration

[Tenebrosity]

Hello everyone,

I don't know if it has been brought up in the past, but I'd like to bring up a suggestion concerning the spell " Shadow Conjuration " and it's higher level " Greater Shadow Conjuration " in synergy with the Shadow Weave magic.

As the spells description goes;

" You conjure a shadow variant of one of the following spells: darkness, invisibility, mage armor, magic missile or summon shadow. "

I assume it's the "Neverwinter Nights 2 vanilla" way to bring the Shadow Weave into perspective, otherwise I wouldn't see the point of using a 1st sloth spell such as Magic missile in a 4th one only for a different visual effect. The suggestion that I want to bring is to keep the "School of Illusion" for anything that come from a Shadow Conjuration, if possible. That way, it won't hinder a Shadow Weave user from altering one of these spells with the Shadows.

I'm not really an expert into Neverwinter Nights 2 balance and mechanic, I don't know if it's going to create an unbalance at some point, but that spell would be nice for a Shadow Adept , if everything remain in the Illusion school (Such as Magic Missile).


Anyways, that's just a suggestion, I don't know if it's even possible to code it, assuming it doesn't share the same line as the normal magic missile, since that one is different and darker, maybe there's some possibility.


Regards,
Tenebrosity.

[Lockonnow]

well the school is of this magic art is Illusion there a spell that is of shadow and that is
Deez'srepulsive shadow Barrier

[Tenebrosity]

well the school is of this magic art is Illusion there a spell that is of shadow and that is
Deez'srepulsive shadow Barrier

Yes, the spell Shadow Conjuration is illusion, but the Magic missile version of it, which has been altered by the shadow is still evocation and is hindered due to the Shadow Weave. My point is if the Shadow Conjuration spell alter the version of magic missile, it shouldn't make it weaker, but normal or even stronger as it has been altered by the Shadow Weave.

P.S; If it wasn't clear, Shadow Weave Magic, reduce spells from half of your schools and empower those of Illusion, Enchantment, and Necromancy.

[Blackman D]

im not sure i follow the request being made but SC's magic missile is not magic missile, it is an illusion not an evocation and it ignores all the limits of the normal magic missile (is not subject to immunity such as from the spell shield)

are you saying that its not being treated as an illusion for whatever you may need it to count as an illusion spell for?

[Tenebrosity]

I'm saying that as a Shadow Adept, when I use the spell "Shadow Conjuration - Magic missile", it tell me that

" You attempt to use the Shadow Weave but it feels ill equipped to fuel your spell, as a result the spell has lost some potency. "

That's the message I usually get when I use a spell that is not from the Illusion, Enchantment or Necromancy schools. So, whenever I use a spell from the Evocation school, for example (Magic Missile), it lose some of it's potency. My point in this thread is to make a change to the Magic Missile used by Shadow Conjuration (NOT THE ONE FROM THE 1ST SLOT) to avoid this weakened state since it's technically altering the spell in the Shadow Weave. Making a spell from the 1st slot to the 4th is a sacrifice I'm willing to take if I can use it without the usualy penalty. I don't know if it's any clearer now, hopefully.

Example!

A Shadow Adept use Magic missile (1st slot spell) and have it weakened. Too bad, I won't use it.

A Shadow Adept use "Shadow Conjuration - Magic Missile" which is a 4th slot spell for the same damage as the 1st slot one, except it has a different visual effect AND I suppose it's been altered by the Shadow Weave. No penalty should occure.

That's what I'm suggesting xD

Regards,
Tenebrosity.

[Blackman D]

yea thats weird then, it should be treated as an illusion with shadow conjuration, if its own spell or not im not sure of tho given it has its own vfx then it should be

but it should be fairly straight forward to change

[Cel'Daren]

Unfortunately the spells that Shadow Conjuration mimics are not treated as Illusion spells. Using it to cast Magic Missile results in an Evocation spell, Mage Armor results as a Conjuration Spell, and Summon Shadow results in either Conjuration or Necromancy.

Greater Shadow Conjuration suffers the same fate with its version of Melf's Acid Arrow, Web, and Lesser Globe of Invulnerability.

It is however indeed a quick fix if staff want to change it.

[Tenebrosity]

Yes, they all have their respective schools from their former spells, but we can't see it in-game, so the solution would be to set them all up to Illusion. (As Shadow Conjuration is an Illusion spell), which will grant a Shadow Weave user an enhancement to these spells altered. That way, it can serve as a filler for a Shadow Adept who wants to do some enhanced offensive spells, at the expense of a 4th circle slot for a 1st circle spell.


Edit : Also, if we wanted to make it even more flavorful, we could restrict Shadow Conjuration and Greater Shadow Conjuration to Shadow Adept only. They are not game changer spells, but that would just make more sense for a Shadow Weave user to alter it and not openly to everyone. But I know, I'm pushing it too far

[Cel'Daren]

Editing the spells so they work how they do in PnP and make them a viable option for anyone with Spell Focus: Illusion?

Good.

Taking the spells away from every Illusionist who don't use the Shadow Weave?

Bad.

The spells are Arcane in nature, and have nothing to do with the Shadow Weave. They have to do with the Shadow Plane, a whole different beast entirely. Limiting the spell to people who follow Shar would be a needless restriction, in my opinion.

[AC81]

Editing the spells so they work how they do in PnP and make them a viable option for anyone with Spell Focus: Illusion?

Good.

Taking the spells away from every Illusionist who don't use the Shadow Weave?

Bad.

The spells are Arcane in nature, and have nothing to do with the Shadow Weave. They have to do with the Shadow Plane, a whole different beast entirely. Limiting the spell to people who follow Shar would be a needless restriction, in my opinion.

+1. Bards among others.

[Tenebrosity]

Editing the spells so they work how they do in PnP and make them a viable option for anyone with Spell Focus: Illusion?

Good.

Taking the spells away from every Illusionist who don't use the Shadow Weave?

Bad.

The spells are Arcane in nature, and have nothing to do with the Shadow Weave. They have to do with the Shadow Plane, a whole different beast entirely. Limiting the spell to people who follow Shar would be a needless restriction, in my opinion.

I was just exaggerating on the last part

I honestly just want to be able to use a Shadow Conjuration of Magic missile that is not weakened due to it's school being Evocation while used by an Illusion spell of it.

[matelener]

Don't forget about level 9th Shades. So, three spells in total to be fixed.

[Tenebrosity]

Don't forget about level 9th Shades. So, three spells in total to be fixed.

I completely forgot about that one. It's the 9th circle version of Shadow Conjuration, and Greater Conjuration. The idea is the very same.

Hidden: show

http://nwn2.wikia.com/wiki/Shades

[Tenebrosity]

A little bump to know if the suggestion haa been taken in consideration.

[Nomster]

I believe Rasael typically deals with spell changes...?

You could send him a friendly PM and bring it to his attention. Alternatively, you could PM the QC team (quality control) and ask them to discuss these changes as it will likely be affecting some players at least.