Spear build

[Calodan]

Hey guys was up late going over a new spear build in the same basic mold as Kory was but for a new PC with new RP and different background. Kory was built off the idea of King Leonidas originally from 300 obviously for those that have seen him since the beginning. For this new on I am going more from Achilles for this build with the spear. A kind of Greek Hopolite so to speak. Or more aptly Myrmidon. I have not had the time to put it through JEGS and make sure it all works yet though.....Any ideas on it?

http://nwn2db.com/build/?249551

[AC81]

Can you get Dualist in ? I've heard it works with spears, though I haven't tested it. That build you posted would work well enough though.

[Steve]

A rather tough tank, this build. But you probably see the biggest downside: damage output.

Also, as M3nt has pointed out many a time, it's actually better to get 30 points in Heal than take Epic Regeneration feats. Unless, of course, the right thing is down and Heal Kits are made impossible to use during Combat....

Not to simply toot my own horn, but I've spent many an hour looking to make a spear-based build, and the best I could come up with is:

Fighter (14), Duelist (10), Rogue (3), Neverwinter Nine (3)

AC:
Base 17 + 8 (INT w/ +3 INT item) +2 (w/ +3 DEX item) + 4 (armor) + 4 dodge + 4 deflection +4 natural + 4 (Shield wand) +2 (Imp. Mage Armor) = 49 (52 w/ Combat Expertise...and more with additional spells)


AB:
38 + 2 (w/ +3 DEX item) + 4 (EB from weapon) +1 Haste = 45 (add some spells, and it gets better= +2 Heroism scroll = 47; GH and GMW = 49 and -3 with Combat Expertise)


DMG:
SPEAR Focused: 1d8 + 4 (EB) + 12 (Combat Insight 1.5 w/ Fox's) +2 Wmastery +6 (EWS Fighter) +4 (EW) + 4d6 (SA from Feint) + 2d6 (Precise Strike) + 2d6 (Flourish) = 1d8 + 28 + 6d6 = 50 per hit + 2d6 Flourish. Crit range with Keen 19-20 (x3)

[Calodan]

Fighter (14), Duelist (10), Rogue (3), Neverwinter Nine (3)


Quote:
AC:
Base 17 + 8 (INT w/ +3 INT item) +2 (w/ +3 DEX item) + 4 (armor) + 4 dodge + 4 deflection +4 natural + 4 (Shield wand) +2 (Imp. Mage Armor) = 49 (52 w/ Combat Expertise...and more with additional spells)


AB:
38 + 2 (w/ +3 DEX item) + 4 (EB from weapon) +1 Haste = 45 (add some spells, and it gets better= +2 Heroism scroll = 47; GH and GMW = 49 and -3 with Combat Expertise)


DMG:
SPEAR Focused: 1d8 + 4 (EB) + 12 (Combat Insight 1.5 w/ Fox's) +2 Wmastery +6 (EWS Fighter) +4 (EW) + 4d6 (SA from Feint) + 2d6 (Precise Strike) + 2d6 (Flourish) = 1d8 + 28 + 6d6 = 50 per hit + 2d6 Flourish. Crit range with Keen 19-20 (x3)

Damn Steve.......I was thinking a duelist would work nicely.....Just did not spend time with it. Still though what does it look like in feats, skills? Is it Min-Maxed to accomplish this? I do think my build will put out enough damage though with WM. With a Crit range of 17-20 (X4) it should have plenty of damage output. The cheese of expose weakness should give it more Critical hits as well as hits in general as well. Not much is going to take down my build either with +6 regen coupled with 9/- DR. I have another build that follows this ideal but is a F/FB instead. I tested that one in JEGS and of all my builds the REGEN DR build did the best in JEGS. I would like to see the mock up of that build you have Steve. Just to pick it apart a bit and see what kind of synergies you are cooking with there.

Also, as M3nt has pointed out many a time, it's actually better to get 30 points in Heal than take Epic Regeneration feats. Unless, of course, the right thing is down and Heal Kits are made impossible to use during Combat....

Why not take 30 points in heal as well as this? Is Regen that useless? If so why not take +3 Epic STR and get up to 18 in STR? This would up the AB and damage slightly but not by much and permanent regen is nice. There is always the bosses that use powerful spells like Vamp feast that a single heal kit is not going to solve and a permanent Regen can really help out. Not to mention how many people say that the biggest thing that makes FvS' last is the DR + the REGEN they get.......

[chad878262]

Why not take 30 points in heal as well as this? Is Regen that useless? If so why not take +3 Epic STR and get up to 18 in STR? This would up the AB and damage slightly but not by much and permanent regen is nice. There is always the bosses that use powerful spells like Vamp feast that a single heal kit is not going to solve and a permanent Regen can really help out. Not to mention how many people say that the biggest thing that makes FvS' last is the DR + the REGEN they get.......

It is not that Regen is useless so much as what you are giving up to get it... Think of the other epic feats you could have if you didn't take the regen feats. Think of the extra strength you could have without going for fast healing. I don't think it's so much that it's worthless, but like so many other things there is just a 'more optimum way'. Regardless I don't think you have ever aimed to build the 'perfect' or optimum way so I wouldn't really worry to much about it, just realize that as a tank-y build you are going to take longer to kill stuff so if your aim is to have a 'loot grinder' equivalent to Kory, well this would fail on the count. However, if your goal is an RP build that acts as a tower shield toting phalanx then this works well enough.

[Calodan]

It is not that Regen is useless so much as what you are giving up to get it... Think of the other epic feats you could have if you didn't take the regen feats. Think of the extra strength you could have without going for fast healing. I don't think it's so much that it's worthless, but like so many other things there is just a 'more optimum way'. Regardless I don't think you have ever aimed to build the 'perfect' or optimum way so I wouldn't really worry to much about it, just realize that as a tank-y build you are going to take longer to kill stuff so if your aim is to have a 'loot grinder' equivalent to Kory, well this would fail on the count. However, if your goal is an RP build that acts as a tower shield toting phalanx then this works well enough.

This build is about RP and story. However it still needs to live through a PvE session and without some sort of niche that is carves out it will die every time in an event and I for one do not like that. I spend too much time in the Fugue it ruins my experience for PvE. However it should farm Frosties no problem if needed....I just put the skills to it now too and I am hoping it will be an effective RP build. Could not get 30 Heal since the build has no class skill in heal so that is what it is. It does have UMD though so using scrolls and wands will make up for some of the deficiencies.

Here it is now with the skills added.
http://nwn2db.com/build/?249551

[Steve]

Damn Steve.......I was thinking a duelist would work nicely.....Just did not spend time with it. Still though what does it look like in feats, skills? .

Here is the build as a dwarf: http://nwn2db.com/build/?201933 I'm sure you could edit it to your liking, being as I assume, a Human Spearist. Yes, I just made that word up.

I tend to assume Bosses and others PvP foes will be Crit Immune. So while Weapon Master is nice, I never rely on those things for a top-of-the-line build. And I do think that is what you're looking for.

My current and learned opinion about "what is important in a build" is: Armor Class, Damage, AB. In that order. Gishes and Divines succeed because though they may have a few points lower AC than other builds, they have additional spells that take a whole lot of damage AWAY, such as Mirror Images, Displacement, etc.

DR and regen IS good, don't get me wrong. But what is better than those two things is simply NOT GETTING HIT. Make that your Building priority, and you'll go far.

[Calodan]

Here is the build as a dwarf: http://nwn2db.com/build/?201933 I'm sure you could edit it to your liking, being as I assume, a Human Spearist. Yes, I just made that word up.

I tend to assume Bosses and others PvP foes will be Crit Immune. So while Weapon Master is nice, I never rely on those things for a top-of-the-line build. And I do think that is what you're looking for.

My current and learned opinion about "what is important in a build" is: Armor Class, Damage, AB. In that order. Gishes and Divines succeed because though they may have a few points lower AC than other builds, they have additional spells that take a whole lot of damage AWAY, such as Mirror Images, Displacement, etc.

DR and regen IS good, don't get me wrong. But what is better than those two things is simply NOT GETTING HIT. Make that your Building priority, and you'll go far.

I am always aiming to get up in the 50s or so in armor fully buffed or geared. I do like the duelist just not my style of play and it requires a very rare belt. It took me 3 years to get a normal mith fp. That belt is another 3-6 years away for me......I have bad luck on loot.

[kleomenes]

Achilles should be a damage dealer. This is Telamonian Ajax!

[Calodan]

Achilles should be a damage dealer. This is Telamonian Ajax!

Yeah I was thinking the build for Achilles would use a scimitar or falchion. With WM these would at least bet critical hits almost every hit. So an average for those weapons would be around 50-70 for the scimitar and about 80-90 for the falchion. Would be a simple switch out too. Being as Telamonian Ajax and Achilles were training buddies their styles are similar just choice of weapon maybe?

Anyone else got a Achilles build? Let me see it! How do you see Achilles in D&D?

[kleomenes]

Ajax is most definitely a tank, he's given quite a few epithets suggesting he's immovable and stubborn on the defence, eg with the Trojans like boys driving a stubborn donkey from the field step by step, or him holding one of the ships single handed. So this build actually works well for him IMO!

Achilles is probably a EDM favoured soul or maybe favoured soul FB, with OP gear

[Thorsson]

Achilles has no magic. If he's to be a damage dealer then the obvious base is a 2H FB5. The problem is how to add AC. If you're a Human, no magic, non-Duelist that's pretty hard.

IOW you have to make a compromise somewhere.

[kleomenes]

Achilles engages god mode when he rages, as he goes from just being "among the best" to being unstoppable. I figured his demigod rage can be represented as divine power! Plus, he is in fact very favoured by the gods

[Charraj]

Wait. Spears aren't finessable, right? A spear-focused version of the build below should take out that feat, right?

Edit: Nope, need it for Duelist. Nevermind.

Damn Steve.......I was thinking a duelist would work nicely.....Just did not spend time with it. Still though what does it look like in feats, skills? .

Here is the build as a dwarf: http://nwn2db.com/build/?201933 I'm sure you could edit it to your liking, being as I assume, a Human Spearist. Yes, I just made that word up.

I tend to assume Bosses and others PvP foes will be Crit Immune. So while Weapon Master is nice, I never rely on those things for a top-of-the-line build. And I do think that is what you're looking for.

My current and learned opinion about "what is important in a build" is: Armor Class, Damage, AB. In that order. Gishes and Divines succeed because though they may have a few points lower AC than other builds, they have additional spells that take a whole lot of damage AWAY, such as Mirror Images, Displacement, etc.

DR and regen IS good, don't get me wrong. But what is better than those two things is simply NOT GETTING HIT. Make that your Building priority, and you'll go far.

[Calodan]

Wait. Spears aren't finessable, right? A spear-focused version of the build below should take out that feat, right?

Right!