Noob Help with Dex Rogue w/ Bluff

[stev]

Hi, so I'm trying to figure out how to do a basic Rogue build with some high bluff and charisma stuff for RP but I'm pretty unfamiliar with the system. I'm not looking for anything particularly 'out there', really, I just don't know what I'm doing and could do with a general build to follow or some tips and advice for building my own. Thanks!

[Kiran]

Classic sneak/assassin rogue or more of a swashbuckling type with a rapier?

[stev]

A stealthier build would be preferable - I'm planning on maybe taking Shadowdancer when I can.

[Theodore01]

- A high charisma is good. The charisma modifier adds to bluff
- These feats adds to bluff: Skill focus bluff, negotiator and silver palm. Epic skill focus bluff is not avaiable.
- Guild thief, former Shadow thief of Amn, is the ultimate feinter prestige class. It adds +4 to bluff, gives sneak dices and 2 bonus feats. It is almost a must
- Check out the rogue store and the Seven Suns merchant in Baldurs Gate for bluff gear. The Finch hat is a very good item too. It is often to be found in the Kemo auction.
- Warlock has a +6 bluff invocation.
- Half elf and half drow has +2 racial bonus to bluff
- Feint takes one attack, so it is not really useful until you got at least 3 attacks pr. round. Learn to use the feint on your lowest AB attack for the effect to apply on your higher AB attacks. Lets say you have 20/15/10/5. Dont do like this: Feint/15/10/5. Do like this: 20/15/10/Feint - 20/15/10/Feint ....
- If you successfully feint a target all partymembers benefit from the effect. The target is flatfooted for all partymembers.

- STR/CHA EDM fighter/rogue is a good feinter.
- DEX based HIPS/PTWF rogue can be built to be reasonable feinters too. You can expose weakness from HIPS, then follow it up with feint while you wait for the HIPS cooldown.
- Bard, Sorcerer, Warlock or Favored Soul GISH-builds can be made very good feinters due to their charisma and skill buffs.

Here are some feinter builds from my own build-pool, I played 2 of them at BGTSCC and I can promise feint is very strong and is working very well IF YOU BUILD AND EQUIP IT THE RIGHT WAY. Without much effort a level 30 feinter do 60-70 + d20 bluff rolls. A Bard, Sorcerer, Warlock or Favored Soul GISH-feinter can even go 80 + d20 rolls. You need a focused spot score to save that feint.

STR/CHA EDM feinter: Fighter (12), Rogue (10), Blackguard (4), Guild Thief (4)
http://nwn2db.com/build/?42175
DEX rogue feinter Rogue (17), Fighter (6), Guild Thief (4), Shadowdancer (3)
http://nwn2db.com/build/?112597

Feint SUCKS with average bluff! If you only max your bluff to 33 and not follow any of these tips, your feint will be close to useless, and you will end up one of them that say feint is useless.


Here is how you pick up 23 bluff from equipment:

Head: +4 (Finch Chapeau)
Neck: +3 (Rogue Store)
Body: +2 (Seven Suns)
Belt: +3 (Rogue Store)
Cloak: +3 (Rogue Store)
Gloves: +2 (Rogue Store)
Weapon: +3 (Rogue Store)
Weapon: +3 (Rogue Store)

[stev]

Okay so it'd probably be helpful if I specified a bit more what I'm thinking of.

Basically I want to make a stealth-focused rogue with the charisma thing as a primarily-roleplay side thing. As such I was thinking of taking Shadowdancer and/or Guild Thief.

I'm kind of hesitant to take significant Fighter dips as it might water down the theme of the character a bit, but if it's that good mechanically it might be worth it even so.

Also I'd greatly prefer a Human character primarily for flavour reasons.

Sorry for being a bit vague before! Not great at minmaxing and I'm new to this system, so I'm a little out of my element.

[aaron22]

so you want a spy style character. not necessarily an assassin style. but with some assassin skill. james bond-ish?

[stev]

so you want a spy style character. not necessarily an assassin style. but with some assassin skill. james bond-ish?

Pretty apt description, actually! Yeah, spy/infiltrator/deceiver more than an out-and-out assassin, that sort of thing.

[Valefort]

http://nwn2db.com/build/?271387

[stev]

http://nwn2db.com/build/?271387

Thanks - this one looks like it's just the sort of thing I'm looking for!

[aaron22]

cool concept. feeling... obvious high points in dex and cha but i would not skip on int. that will give you BUNCHES and BUNCHES of skills and if you pop in sin levels you will get your hips and your DA will land more often. that would be R16/GT4/Sin10. start stats 10-18-10-14-8-14. this one will hit hard but your RP will be when and where to use it.

or you could back off int(slightly) and do R16/SD3/GT3/WDerv8 could be really cool. this one doesnt hit quite as hard, but has some realy cool synergies that will get you every goodie you will want by the end. 6 free skill focuses!!

[chad878262]

If you go with Valefort's build you might consider going with STR/CON of 11 so you can use a +3 item to have 14 in each... Low STR sucks when adventuring.

[Valefort]

You can honestly get by with just 10 STR, more is of course a lot more convenient

[stev]

R16/GT4/Sin10. start stats 10-18-10-14-8-14. this one will hit hard but your RP will be when and where to use it.

Hmm... Really like the flavour on this one. My main concern would be that I'm getting HiPS pretty late and I'm not sure how well I'll be able to survive without it. Otherwise, this looks really cool! Love the flavour gained from the full Assassin levels.

back off int(slightly) and do R16/SD3/GT3/WDerv8 could be really cool. this one doesnt hit quite as hard, but has some realy cool synergies that will get you every goodie you will want by the end. 6 free skill focuses!!

I'm slightly less keen on this one, though the WD stuff also looks pretty cool and it would be nice to get some SD levels in early. My main criticism is that the WD stuff doesn't seem to fit into my intended flavour quite as much. Still pretty cool, though, just not really what I'm looking for!

[aaron22]

hips at 13 isnt bad. you can move pretty quick to 13 without it. its actually about there where hips becomes pretty important. you can fight mobs that will give good xp that will not dispell the cheap pots that help your mitigation. up to there. after that you start seeing more dispelling mobs. there are mobs that will dispell you before that, but you dont need to face them and be just fine.

[stev]

hips at 13 isnt bad. you can move pretty quick to 13 without it. its actually about there where hips becomes pretty important. you can fight mobs that will give good xp that will not dispell the cheap pots that help your mitigation. up to there. after that you start seeing more dispelling mobs. there are mobs that will dispell you before that, but you dont need to face them and be just fine.

Okay, that seems pretty reasonable, then. What might you recommend early feat-wise for a build like this? I'm trying it in the builder atm, thinking maybe 2-weapon + dodge 1st lvl, finesse 3rd, stealthy 6th or something like that?