Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

I just wanted to ask to see if they at least have that ability.

you must pick it as a feat. it is +1 AC till you have 24 levels of ranger, then it is +2AC.

https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Protective_Ward

darwin.evenwood wrote:you must pick it as a feat. it is +1 AC till you have 24 levels of ranger, then it is +2AC.

https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Protective_Ward

Didn't it also give you AB increase?

ARHicks00 wrote:

darwin.evenwood wrote:you must pick it as a feat. it is +1 AC till you have 24 levels of ranger, then it is +2AC.

https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Protective_Ward

Didn't it also give you AB increase?

On BG it doesnt give AB increase

mrm3ntalist wrote:

ARHicks00 wrote:

darwin.evenwood wrote:you must pick it as a feat. it is +1 AC till you have 24 levels of ranger, then it is +2AC.

https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Protective_Ward

Didn't it also give you AB increase?

On BG it doesnt give AB increase

Welp there goes interest in playing a ranger.

ARHicks00 wrote:
Welp there goes interest in playing a ranger.

Seriously? Over one feat? Wow.

VDub wrote:

ARHicks00 wrote:
Welp there goes interest in playing a ranger.

Seriously? Over one feat? Wow.

Rangers are no real options outside of two weapon fighting feats and archer feats. Much like the paladin in this game, they haven't been given much thought.

You can't play a strength Rangers because there are no two-handed fighting style put in the game and you can't play a shield bashing Ranger because you don't have shield fighting style to choose from. You either pick archery or dual wielding. What's worst, Rangers who go full Dex suffer diminish returns. Fighters and Rogue don't suffer this much since their bread and butter is their ONE MAIN main stat. Bards, Sorcerers, Wizards, Paladins, and Bards suffer from this.

Diminish returns is when you increase one attribute/stat and ignore the others. For example, in Star Wars the Old Republic, if putting all your points in Critical, you will burst damage a lot, but your damage will be low despite ability to constantly critical hit your opponents. If you increase your power and not critical, you will do a lot of solid damage, but have almost no burst damage. However if you increase both, you can do a huge amount of burst damage. Although, you will never get both attributes extremely high, having a fair amount can make you very viable in that game.

Diminish returns is one of the reason why a Charisma Bard sucks compared to a Strength Bard. If you dump every thing into Charisma, you will a huge DC and increase sonic DC if you use Epic songs, but other than that your close quarters suck compared to a bard with at least 24 strength. Favored Soul is similar, but they also suffer if they do the opposite if they spread their attribute points between their wisdom and charisma when they have one attribute that does both like Cleric. This is why a Frenzy Bersker/Weapon builds are favored over your run of the mill weapon master build because of their high critical threat and solid damage that can be turned into burst damage with the right weapon.

How does this apply to the Ranger you ask? All of Rangers skills rely on Dexterity so you have no choice but to put apply all your points to one attribute. This forces you regardless of which style you pick to be a Dex Ranger. (That and their limited armor) While you'll get a high AB for putting all your points into Dexterity, you'll suffer diminish return because after a certain point, because if you very little damage to go with your high AB, you're not doing much compared to other classes.

In addition a Ranger can get up to 50 to 53 (With enchanted equipment) compared to everyone who can get roughly the same 55 to 56. (With same said equipment) Yes, I know they get HIPS and free feats, but as I explained a thousand times to others in the past that a Ranger needs versatility to be vital in a group. In PnP, the story caters to their style. (This includes their favor enemy) However, in MORPGs like this, you can't.

For example, if you play archer build, that's all you can really do. Your ability to melee is limited. You can play a dual wielder, but your ability to archer is limited. Damage same thing. If you go full Dexterity with little strength, you're going to do 9 to 11 damage + weapon damage. To put it simple, Melee Rangers can do more hits per turn if dual wielding, but less damage than a fighter using a two-hander and the fighter can tank better in full armor since their heavy armor protects better. Archer Rangers can do heavier damage compared other classes except the Bard (7 matching the Rangers favor enemies) and Rogue (15 to 60 damage)

Rangers do massive damage against their favored enemy, but suck when up against non-favor enemies.

Where does protective ward fit in all of this? I often play Dexterity/Strength Rangers with at least 22 in each so they can put deal damage in the front and the back. With Protective Ward, they will get 40 to 41 AB (Melee and Ranger), instead of a 38 to 39 AB. And considering, I'll be wearing Padded Armor and have no tumble, that +4 AC goes along way. To build a ranger, you have to first make sure the foundation is solid or the whole build will come tumbling down.

AND BEFORE SOMEONE SAYS, "But rangers can do X amount of damage."

I know Rangers can do 100 or more with the right gear. I'm not aiming for overpowered, but balance and RPish. If I can't RP it then it's not fun, but it's not balance, it's also not fun. I'm somewhat OCD and a perfectionist.

I have successfully played STR based two weapon fighting rangers in the server before that was not bad at archery, especially with the hunter kit accessing both styles. it's not the most OP thing ever but its viable but you have stated you are not looking for overpowered stuff.

I cannot understand how losing -2 on a raw number crunch makes the RP of a character unplayable. There is 1 point of potential AC between a fullplate and a chainmail, rangers also get a full spellbook of goodies in them.

For someone who says "AND BEFORE SOMEONE SAYS, "But rangers can X amount of damage."", many of your arguments boil down to number crunching of sheer ab/damage and discard all the other goodies Ranger comes with in relation to the classes you compare it to.

Rangers of all kinds are very well balanced for the PvE content on BG. I prefer strength rangers, I know others like dex rangers mixed with assassin for damage and indoor hips. Rangers are definitely not underpowered for pve, however it is a tad unfair to compare them to str bards, WM/FB or FS’s.
I have a str-based, shield wielding, thrower ranger on another account that is honestly one of the most fun and well-balanced toons ive has on this server, for example.
To rubbish an entire class because our devs refused to include an OP feat is a bit silly.

Okan wrote:I have successfully played STR based two weapon fighting rangers in the server before that was not bad at archery, especially with the hunter kit accessing both styles. it's not the most OP thing ever but its viable but you have stated you are not looking for overpowered stuff.

I cannot understand how losing -2 on a raw number crunch makes the RP of a character unplayable. There is 1 point of potential AC between a fullplate and a chainmail, rangers also get a full spellbook of goodies in them.

For someone who says "AND BEFORE SOMEONE SAYS, "But rangers can X amount of damage."", many of your arguments boil down to number crunching of sheer ab/damage and discard all the other goodies Ranger comes with in relation to the classes you compare it to.

I'm aware of the spells, but they don't last long and becoming a pet range is just as bad since they don't have the full spell list of a druid. (And Pet levels) My Knight of the Wild Druid build was a better ranger than an actual ranger. The closest I came to a balance build is the sword/board build with archery style using Dexterity/Strength. Modest damage, could tank, and with a composite bow, it was something fierce.

Having more than 30ish AB means you hit more and rely on HIPS less. If I want to play HIPS more than why not play a HIPS rogue for more damage?

Hammer_Song wrote:Rangers are definitely not underpowered for pve, however it is a tad unfair to compare them to str bards, WM/FB or FS’s.

Why because I would be telling the truth? Strength wise, those classes do have them beat out in certain areas or provide more versatility in those areas then they do. Ranger's strength is his dps, but moreover; his favored enemy dps. However, Ranger's damage is inconsistent while a class like a pure fighter or bard to name a few have do consistent damage cross the board.

Rangers are more or less a "vs." class and excel at when you are going up against something that fits in into their versus category. Other classes don't have this problem and some like the cleric or paladin get bonuses.

Hammer_Song wrote:To rubbish an entire class because our devs refused to include an OP feat is a bit silly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwY3vjrZkPk

Yeah that feat is far from overpowered. Melee Mastery is more overpowered along with Shield bash feats, Cleric Domains, and Luck of Heroes. Protective Ward is to a Ranger what Weapon Mastery and Weapon Focus/Specialization is to a fighter. Also I just asked if they had the feat in the game, they don't so that is the end of it. I just made a post explaining why I am not playing the class. Respect that. I'm happy you are happy with your ranger build because you build it for you.

Rangers have full casterlevel progression, their buffs are no different than any other.

Rangers come with a lot of utility and niche that most others don't have. If you ignore those and focus on sheer numbers, you will be disappointed Protective Ward giving AB or not.

ARHicks00 wrote:I just asked if they had the feat in the game, they don't so that is the end of it.

darwin.evenwood wrote:you must pick it as a feat. it is +1 AC till you have 24 levels of ranger, then it is +2AC.

https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Protective_Ward

Question asked and answered, as far as I can see? I think I'll lock this thread unless the OP wants it back open.