New Druid Spells: How we going to RP these?

[LivT]

Talking about these ones!
Speak with Animals, Speak with Plants, Stone Tell

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Now, from experience I believe most RPers are already on board with how we act out such things from either:

• The Commune With Nature spell (+8 Survival). Every time someone's role-played the spell it is either as a preparation of a larger ritual, or a way of getting a deeper 'sixth sense' or feel more connected to the world around. At most, maybe you get flashes of important images, sounds, scents, RP out the boon to your tracking, or get insight on what plants/water is poisonous or good for you.

• The Animal Language: Almost everyone I've come across who speaks it agrees that you cannot communicate comprehensively in animal language. Translations reflect attitudes, intentions, and very, very minor commands. For example, "Fear, mistrust" "Happy to see you!" "Danger near, beware" "Follow me!" "Hungry!!!!" "Smell that? We look for that."
  The exception is dependent on the animal; singing birdsong might be more specific, such as trilling "Hey you get the F away from my nest" or "Gurl you like this plume? Lemme smash." Animal intelligence as we all know, varies immensely, and everyone I've RP'd with has been on the same page from the get go.

So. My take on Talking with Animals:

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I figured that Speak with Animals would essentially be: the animal language, but with with a... 'psychic' edge. Not so much that you can read their minds invasively, but that what they communicate might come with specifics, pictures, sounds, smells, filtering through the mind - and, well, I suppose can be translated directly into 'speech'. AND, keep with the rules established in the description.

Let's say you... need to speak with a Snow Leopard in Animal Language.

PC: Question?
SL: LEAVE. Or I KILL.

Now, let's try Speak with Animals.

PC: Help? I have a question.
SL: Stranger, get away!
PC: It's cool, see, friendly.
SL: Listening, but WILL rip your throat out, human.
PC: Have you seeing So-And-So?
SL: Hn. Yes. Here are some vague details about So-And-So. Now leave.

Speak with Animals + Animal Friendship or similar spell?

PC: Help? I have a question.
SL: Friend! I help.
PC: Thanks! Have you seen So-And-So?
SL: I have seen! I will show you/they went that way, hunting/running/injured

On Talking with Plants:

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They don't... 'talk' back. They're not treants, or mycanoids, or shambling mounds. They're trees. And shrubs. And blades of grass. If they had a brain they'd be walking around like a proper sentient plant.

That said, I would consider it a sort of mind-meld. Ask a Hundred Year Oak what happened fifty years ago, and you might actually get a clear visual of an event, within the 'vision' of the tree. Ask the tallest tree in the forest what it sees, and you might see what's on the horizon beyond the canopy. Ask the shrubs what's killing the land, you might physically feel the poison in the earth or get a sense of where it comes from.

But I doubt that plants would have any more specific thoughts or feelings. There's no brain, unlike animals. No voice or narrative. Just a sense of life and memory, but no real desire.

So if someone wants to build a house, or tear something down, you can't say "oh, the plants would appreciate if you don't do that." They don't have 'wants' beyond 'water' or 'sun', I imagine. if you want plants to have sentience, cast Live Oak and make a Treant.

And Stone Tell being much the same:

Rocks and Masonry are not Earth Elementals. And having no 'needs' like plants do, would have even less 'personality' in what is read. In this case, the spell description is pretty much it; so long as you don't think the stone is putting a voice in your head saying "Oh gee gosh! Yeah i'll, I'll tell you everything I saw!"

It's a rock, dude.

So.

Green Gods help me, I swore I wouldn't get into this sort of 'how do we RP things' after... *gestures vaguely at most of the forum* but I am actually curious about what the Nature Nerds and DMs think of this, or if they had different visions of how to RP a spell that is, very much, a RP spell. We get lore buffs, of course, so the mechanic is there for something more hard line. But really... are we gonna be casting it if not for RP purposes that often? I'd like to know folks thoughts on how we as a community do this.

[JustAnotherGirl]

If I had a toon that could get these spells, I think I'd RP it nearly exactly as you've described each one. Great question. I look forward to hearing what others have to say.

[Wolfrayne]

Most people seem to forget that animal language doesn't allow for complex sentences of conversations, for the most part its simple thing like "Friend" "foe" "eat" etc etc. you cant sit and talk about the weather with a wolf. It doesn't understand.

One of my pet peeves with this kind of thing are the people who sit around having conversations with their animals or other people who can speak to animals. The ONLY exception to this would be an animal companion who has been "awakened" and gained an intelligence score.

I would expect things like "speak with stone" and "speak with plants" would be even more simple since they dont really have complex thoughts or emotions.

[Requiem]

Really like your take on these Liv. I think in the same vein, just as you had laid out clearly in your examples, I think the perspective of each targeted example would be a good rule of thumb. None of this is what should be done, more posting food for thought and some of my own takes on the subject. Always looking for another perspective though.

An animal has the innate ability to communicate, although not in speech. You see it in a dog's tail wag, a wolf's growl, the direction of a horse's ears or the look in their eye. Animal "speech" for me has always been a trade of facial expressions, demeanor, tone and sound, approach, body language, etc. in the RP I've portrayed. Having a dog as a companion makes it a bit easier. But it can be a dialogue without words or even a sound at all.

As far as plants and stone goes, I think you nailed that on the head. I wouldn't play it off as much of a dialogue. If anything, as you said whether it be through mental images or something similar, I think the caster of the respective spells would seek to know something (The Question) and the plant/rock would return a "feeling" or sense (The Answer).

While I am not disagreeing at all with the idea of trees providing a clear vision of what they've "seen" as I can easily get behind that, I'm curious as if it would be the case without having traditional "eyes". I do imagine them sensing poisoned/corrupted soil nearby, feeling the tremors upon the ground from their roots as an army or large amount of individuals passed through, the treetops feeling the rhythmic rush of wind from a dragon's wings flying overhead, stone betraying how many footsteps of warriors are along the battlements of a castle (or even compare the current number of warrior footsteps to those a generation ago, but that's probably dipping more into Animism territory), etc.

Just my two cents.

[EasternCheesE]

After reading this, I really see it as a guideline on "how to play your druid talking stuff" properly. Brilliant description and ideas, i will totally follow it if i ever play druid myself.

[LivT]

I do imagine them sensing poisoned/corrupted soil nearby, feeling the tremors upon the ground from their roots as an army or large amount of individuals passed through, the treetops feeling the rhythmic rush of wind from a dragon's wings flying overhead, stone betraying how many footsteps of warriors are along the battlements of a castle

I hadn't considered that perspective either and really like that take, reflecting on what is simply sensed around the tree, or what has physically affected it, instead of just what it has 'seen'. Maybe the 'vision' idea can be made to fit with the handwavium of 'it's magic tho', but 'Feeling the sweep of dragon wings' rather than seeing a dragon flying, makes sense.

[Rhifox]

As a spirit shaman, it would probably depend on the "power" of the entity to me. A sleeping pebble's spirit might not be able to communicate much at all, and certainly not in words, but the spirit of a giant ancient boulder might. A flower might not be able to say much, but an old tree that's been growing in the heart of a village for centuries could.

Of course, things aren't necessarily the same between druids and shamans, nor from entity to entity. Sometimes there might be just images and flashes, sometimes there may be actual communication.

[LivT]

As a spirit shaman, it would probably depend on the "power" of the entity to me. A sleeping pebble's spirit might not be able to communicate much at all, and certainly not in words, but the spirit of a giant ancient boulder might. A flower might not be able to say much, but an old tree that's been growing in the heart of a village for centuries could.

Of course, things aren't necessarily the same between druids and shamans, nor from entity to entity. Sometimes there might be just images and flashes, sometimes there may be actual communication.

An interesting addition; considering how different it might be experienced by shamans I think, even in a small way helps to add a dimension to understanding for another class. I know for shamans, one might say the line between natural and supernatural is all but erased. Considering that helps me think about how I would flavour Iolanna's rp; I'm angling her to be a more spiritual and magic/mystic focused druid (because, why make her a tough fighter when she refuses to fight anything right?). maybe she does 'experience' the spell by sensing something like 'personality' of spirit, maybe not (she doesn't have shaman powers after all, so i wouldn't want to take away one of the things that makes that class special)