Baldur's Gate : The Sword Coast Chronicles : NWN2 Persistent World

Hello!

So as everyone knows, we have a bit of a proliferation of planetouched characters on BG. The reason for this is obvious, these races tend to be very strong for particular builds, while also having very limited consequences on aesthetics or sociability (compared to other strong races such as mountain orc). While this applies to both aasimar and tieflings, there is a noted exlusivity with aasimar that you don't really see with tieflings. While tieflings are good for rogues and wizards, you still see plenty of other races rolling these classes. But for divine spellcasting classes, it is almost exclusively aasimar.

So I'd like to ask, to our aasimar players:

* As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

* What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

* If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?


Please only provide a single response to this topic with your answers to these questions. This is a survey, not a discussion thread.

Thank you for your feedback!

* As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

Originally I wanted to make Monroe more standoffish and I thought an Aasimar could play into that. I since let go of that idea, but that was the reason I picked Aasimar over Human. Not going to lie, he didn't need another feat and +2/+2 for a Bard Spotter was definitely appreciated.

* What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

I would have a tougher time disregarding Human if they had actual stat bonuses. If not feat-starved or multiclassing, I tend not to pay attention to that race. Aasimar feels like there's no drawback - it's a safe choice.

* If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

N/A

* As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

I do love the RP value it brings having celestial blood. Not to mention the unique face, skin, and eye colors. I plan to be one for my Blackguard, liking the whole fallen angel like aspect to it. Of course it helps they have good stats for the build I will be running as well.

* What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

I would not want to change. I like playing something that is not human normally. Human tends to bore me personally. Perhaps I would roll a Tiefling instead, but the - cha kills that idea for the build I want to run that I use my Aasimar for. In fact Aasimar are the only race that have a good cha and wis score.

* If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

N/A

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

I have one Aasimar pc, I am likely making another in the future. That said, even the two of them would make the minority of my rooster, so I would preface by saying I am not a primarily Aasimar player.
When it comes my existing pc, the choice was both motivated by RP and mechanical advantages. The pc is a Mulhorandi priest, him being the descendant of a god is an integral part of his background, his lineage makes him better as a divine caster, but is also the reason IC why his society would allow him to become a priest in the first place.

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

I will echo Alcreed's sentiment. I don't have much interest in playing human, I prefer to pick non-human races because of the physical and psychological differences that they bring to the RP. The blanket CHA penalty on all other planetouched is more of a deterrent to me than the Aasimar's CHA bonus is an incentive. I could have made Lykah a Triton-descended Aasimar, and that would have made her build significantly more effective, but from an RP-perspective, it just wouldn't have given me the same satisfaction.
I would not blame other players for thinking differently though. When it comes to my experience in the server, the issue is that a lot of people desire to play CHA-focused builds, and Aasimar offers an option that still looks "human" enough and gives a racial +2 to said stat. The only other race that provides it is Drow, which, obviously, comes with a far steeper RP-investment. There is greater synergy between Aasimar and the divine classes, to be sure, but I don't think that removing the +2 WIS, or even adding a -2 to some other stat would deter players much. There are Aasimar Bards and Sorcerers that have no interest in anything outside their CHA score, after all.
I can see how the reduction of requirements for certain feats (such as EDM and Great Smiting) might result in less Aasimar Paladins, as some people might feel compelled to select the race instead of Human for the sake of getting said feats, but I do not have any experience with the Paladin class nor have discussed the matter at sufficient length with paladin players to say for sure.
I will say that it may not fix the imbalance overall, as there are plenty of non-divine Aasimar running around as well. Also, when it comes to divine classes specifically, most of the Aasimar I have met in game are descendants of Solars, Devas, and other Good-aligned Outsiders; it seems likely that the players who picked them for their paladins and good-aligned clerics/FvS might still wish to play a spawn of the Heavens regardless of the mechanical advantages that they provide; although that is just speculation on my part.

It is to be noted, when it comes to players who don't want to pick humans for RP-reasons, and wish to select a non-human race for their thieves and wizards, that tieflings are not the only surface race that provide Dex / Int bonuses. There's elves, genasi, halflings that also provide a class-appropriate boost. But when someone needs a Cha boost, the Aasimar are pretty much the only option (and many non-human options are disincentivized by having an outright malus to CHA).

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

I wouldn't really know about this. The non-Aasimar pcs I have already belong to classes that their race is well-suited for, or suits their background.

* As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

Obvious reason - I needed the flavor of that "boy who is not aware of his heritage". Besides, many of my characters in DnD are either humans or half-elves and I just wanted to shift from it to something else

What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

To be fair, nothing. Humans already the best race to pick in any class, including divine casters. Aasimars only outshine them in paladin class but I doubt it's enough to make any reworks. From me experience playing a cleric (and drow wizard for a week), any ECL+2 race is actually a tough start (especially since I made Landar way before the rework of death penalties). Leveling takes more time and in return we have free 5 casts of light (any cleric can prepare and then spontaneously cast cure wounds instead) and some damage resistances that only handy on lower levels.

* As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

My latest Aasimar character relies on the background of being "divinely blooded" or birthed as part of a family history, which brings the character closer to a divinity in their existence, something like being "favored" but not having to be a Favored Soul, or something like that. Obviously, because of BGTSCC content, having a Aasimar Race bonuses on the Sheet just allow for more options in order to "endure" the content that has been usually designed to withstand min/maxing builds or powerbuilds. For me personally, the benefits of Aasimar is that I can put more Ability points into Intelligence, so that my Class/PrC choices with limited Skill points can be expanded or varied, which I enjoy for the role-play benefits.

* What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

I can make an EDM build with Human no sweat. Human Race choice is the best for a host of reasons. What would "encourage" me to NOT pick an Aasimar or any ECL Race is if they could not reach Level 30, which is how it is supposed to be, right? Perhaps if Epic Level Feats like Ability Bonuses could be taken with any Feat level up—like say Fighter Bonus or Divine Champion bonus—instead of a General Epic Feat slot, it would far, far easier to achieve a high performing build.

* If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

The Race one chooses should have some value to it, either positive or negative, in terms of the Setting. With Human being the most "accepted" Race over all, except in non-Human regions, or villages/towns/settings. Literally, in terms of RP, there is no difference if you're playing a Drow-looking Tiefling in a mask or a shining-white Aasimar paladin trudging through the Underdark. Player acceptance for gaming enjoyment overrides any type of realistic "schism" that should be had with choosing X Race, and the responsibility to it. Maybe that is too high a bar for BGTSCC to uphold, and I get it: we want to have fun, not be forced into roles we just don't like (or just don't like being forced in general!). But what I'm getting at is that consequence for choosing Aasimar, in non-mechanic terms, would likely steer myself and maybe others to choose a mechanically weaker Human, in order to not have a "higher demand" RP put upon.

Or...you could just give Humans a +2 to whatever single Ability they wish at creation. With the idea that THIS Human character had a "skilled-from-birth" path toward their profession of choice(s).

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

I definetely chose the aasimar for both the +2 CHA, as much as the RP that follows. The concept of Rose however was inspired to an old one, from another server that is now closed, and I opted to follow it. I don't think I would have as much fun while playing a human or an elf or a tiefling or a hin or a gnome.

Also Rose is tied to Milil, and it's known that accomplished bards are an extention of Milil Himself. So, of course I'm not going to change this.

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

Nothing you could offer would make me change the race, not even if Humans suddenly offered +10 to Charisma.

I am sure however that, for EDM classes, requirements dropped to 19 instead of 21 would help a bit for humans.

Alternatively, dropping to 20 and granting to humans +1 to all stats like in 5e.

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

I'm playing an Aasimar, so... N/A

1. I choose Aasimar for my druid because I liked the idea of being a bit different than human , to complicate rp a bit of an otherwise , initially , generic druid .
The +2 wisdom also helped in reaching the high wisdom requirement of dragon form , though this was 8 years ago , not sure if it still applies .

2. In the case of this druid , choosing human would have been acceptable for me , though I was leaning towards Earth Genasi as well , for the character's flavor .
Besides my tendency to choose exotic races over humans and elves , I see the problem as some huge stat requirements on epic feats , which make building harder to do , examples include dragon form , epic inspiration and so on .

3. I have a human Favored Soul as well and the extra feat/skill points are nice enough . Though some +1 to mental stats might help compete against celestials .

* As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

Mainly RP/background. Playing a character of celestial blood is way more interesting than a human. Humans are boring, in my opinion. And that's just a sentiment that's been carried by a lot of DnD players through DnD's history. RP is a means of escapism, and playing non-humans is one way of doing that. And Aasimar, like someone else stated, is human-looking enough, but not too far of an appearance divergence like gnome. Plus aasimar lore is just more interesting to me.

* What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

Nothing really. In my experience, no stat bonus or feat is going to get me to play a race I'm simply not interested in. In the past I tried to create an alt halfling character to become a really good rogue, and even the stat bonuses weren't enough for me to enjoy roleplay as a halfling long-term.

* If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

I have other alts and one non-aasimar that plays a class that aasimar benefits from based off of the racial CHA bonus. Adding the Charisma bonus to the race (elf) would make it more viable mechanically, I guess. But it's not the reason I chose to play an elf or that particular class. It wouldn't make a difference. It's just RP preference and the character I've already created in my mind before even considering build/mechanical optimization.

As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

So, I am planning a character right now, I do not play an aasimar yet. Right now, Aasimar is by far the most attractive race for this concept from a mechanics side. The 4 additional attribute points help so much. I actually leveled the character as a test as a human, however I had many problems regarding the attributes (as I need wis and cha among others...). Aasimar just solves this with a fingersnip and at almost no cost, the lower leveling speed is negligible and I can still end on level 30.
I do not need the bonus feat human would give, I even have one feat in the Aasimar build which is more or less exchangable. The loss of skill points does not hurt that much, either, as I would have to lower the int on the human, which would lock access to feats, which would result in the same number of skill points, however still worse than the Aasimar and a lock on certain feats...

Of course this change in race will result in a way different background story and starting concept from a roleplay point of view, as I do not want to play Aasimar as simply human.

What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

I would like it if all races were on the same level mechanics wise, be it be by either boosting humans/elves/.. and other races to ECL+2 or lowering the advantages from other races down to ECL+0. Or meet in the middle at ECL+1.
Pathfinder 1 or even more Pathfinder 2 have a good approach to this, in my opinion, regarding the attribute distribution problems. Give races some choice in their preferred attributes, with humans being able to choose one boost freely, while elves may have to decide between boosting dex/int (optional while having con reduced and one free boost). Aasimar could be locked to Wis/Cha then, Tieflings to Dex/Int,...
And/Or the disadvantages from ECL could be introduced, lowering the maximum level to 30-ECL. Humans and other ECL-0 could still get up to level 30, while others have to stop at 29 or 28.

If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

I am not playing a class combination right now which would be favored by going Aasimar. My wizard would have been favored more by going tiefling/air genasi though.

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * As an aasimar player, what reasons do you pick this race for the builds you play? Are there any RP considerations, or is it solely mechanical?

Predominately mechanical vice solely.

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * What would you as a player need to encourage you to pick another race for your build? Examples could be, changes to feat stat requirements (eg EDM).

Changes to feat stat requirements would be intriguing and could compel me to play other races.

Rhifox wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:37 am * If you aren't playing an aasimar, but are playing a class that is normally favored by aasimar, what do you feel you would need to make it feel like a more viable pick for your race?

Parity in mechanics.


Cheers!
MrSmith

I don't feel like I would choose to role-play an Aasimar if humans had the same stat block unless I had a very specific background story in mind.
I've shoe-horned in such backstories to fit the mechanical advantages, but it wasn't something that I felt particularly interested in.

I played a Hoarite Monk for a time. His backstory being that his family had been politically exiled from Unther and settled in Waterdeep. He'd begun training under the Order of the Even-Handed, but Hrusse had noticed his similar origin and divine blood and swayed him toward a different path of Justice before sending him to a tend to the Shrine of Hoar established near Baldur's Gate and answer any calls for his justice.

As ability points costs more (3 I think past 16) having a +2 to Wisdom allowed 6 points to be freed up toward non-primary abilites (Dex, Str, Con, Int)

The same character could have been pulled off as a human but more min-maxed, less viable, and less well rounded.

For as much hate as 5e gets in this community, the ability score bonuses should be implemented here and we wouldn’t have to talk about this issue ever again.

Their know i have the most powerfull Divine char one can have the Archhealer

I was like, 'what would it be like to play a paladin', so I joined the reverse-darkside.

At the time I was rolling my paladin I had no RP concepts other than to see what it would be like. I mixed in a bit of rogue to get expose weakness if I recall correctly and I made him a divinate because I wanted lots of pally spells and long cast times.
I did not grasp the pvp advantages of smite evil at the time- and was not interested in pvp.

I have never rolled a human on this server and never will. I'm already technically a human in RL, so why would I want to RP one...people are gross!
I picked Aasimar for mainly mechanical reasons- higher Chr meant having higher STR = good!
But, I thought at the time the aasimar would add some divine flavour to the character- but mostly just juicy stats.

He looked fairly human- a lot of aasimar models look mostly human. I think traditionally both them and Tieflings could be mildly fiendish or angelic looking. That was sort of the loophole. Having silver hair and pale skin was good enough requirement at one time.
Tiefs walked around with two horn stubs and maybe what looked like a sun burn if that's all they wanted. Today's Tiefs have evolved into goat people.
*avoids eye contact with V*

But I made sure to put in his description, certain hints of his true racial heritage. I think I RP'd his backstory that his great grandmother Agatha Angel Kissed had a short romantic dalliance with an angel. Then the next thing you know....

He served Tyr and I RPd him as a cross between a wild west sheriff and the detective Columbo. I probably played him as a smidge more towards neutral good than lawful good but who pays attention to these trifling details.

Oh, when I retired my paladin I rolled up a half-elf cleric and have had zero regrets!
Its pretty sad when the Half-Elf becomes a snow-flake race.

NURF PALADINS! BAN AASIMAR! KILL YOUR IDOLS! DO YOUR HOMEWORK! AND FOR GODS SAKE STOP EATING GOAT CHEESE!