Overwhelming Critical Longbow stacks w/ +1d6 crit on bows?

[Zhentil_Keep]

Does anyone know if the overwhelming critical feat (+2d6 dmg bonus on crits for example) would stack with a bow that already has a crit bonus added to it?
Or does it get overriden?

Example, Over. Crit +2d6 (longbow) on critical hit stacking with a bow that already has +1d6 damage on critical hits to become +3d6 bonus dmg on crit hits.

Apologies for the grammatical errors. My brain doesn't work so well at 5am.

Thanks!

[DM Arkanis]

Something tells me that they stack, but I can't remember exactly. Shoot something and see what happens...?

[Zhentil_Keep]

With all the other damage being done, it may be impossible to determine if 1d6-2d6 crit damage has been added or not. Especially when some of the damage is upwards of 100dmg.
I wonder if there is another way to determine it

[Zhentil_Keep]

I was able to figure it out.

I used the test module to create a specific scenario.
I gave a character a longbow that had +1d6 crit bonus.

The bow itself would give maximum damage of (not incl. the +1d6 crit bonus)

1d8 x 3 on crit hit (longbow)

= 3-24 damage

with the overwhelming critical feat, it gave an additional 2d6 bonus dmg on crit.

That works out to a max of 5-36 damage on its own with a critical hit. The bow had an additional +1d6 bonus on crit hits.

When I attacked a bladeling and performed a critical hit, the damage done was 39 damage.
If the critical damage bonus on the overwhelming crit feat AND the bow did not combine, there is no way the attack could have done more than 36 damage. So from my estimation, weapons AND feats combine together when performing a crit hit.

I Hope that helps anyone else who is curious, such as myself.

Anyone else agree? I think I calculated that right, lol.

[AC81]

Molag_Bal told me a while ago that they don't stack. We were talking about melee weapons but it should be the same. I can't remember which one overrides. I never tested it though, just took Molag's word because, well, he's Molag!

[TeoDeathDealer]

Are you referring to the epic feat Overwhelming Critical? The one that gives 1d6 per crit multiplier? Doesn't that require 25 strength? Hard to do with an archer.

[Zhentil_Keep]

23 strength
Depends on your archer build!! I've got a bow that does +8 mighty so I jacked up his strength.
And it seemed to stack for me? Otherise the math doesn't really make sense.... no idea where all that extra damage came from!

[Passiflora]

Actually there's a command you can use in the game when playing on a module that allows you to see detailed damage output.

Can't remember what it is, though. I though it's like /debug or something similar.

[AC81]

I was able to figure it out.

I used the test module to create a specific scenario.
I gave a character a longbow that had +1d6 crit bonus.

The bow itself would give maximum damage of (not incl. the +1d6 crit bonus)

1d8 x 3 on crit hit (longbow)

= 3-24 damage

with the overwhelming critical feat, it gave an additional 2d6 bonus dmg on crit.

That works out to a max of 5-36 damage on its own with a critical hit. The bow had an additional +1d6 bonus on crit hits.

When I attacked a bladeling and performed a critical hit, the damage done was 39 damage.
If the critical damage bonus on the overwhelming crit feat AND the bow did not combine, there is no way the attack could have done more than 36 damage. So from my estimation, weapons AND feats combine together when performing a crit hit.

I Hope that helps anyone else who is curious, such as myself.

Anyone else agree? I think I calculated that right, lol.

The problem with this is that mass crit properties (and I assume the feat too) multiply also. Pretty sure Molag tested this a while back with a Epic Minotaur axe or something. It had 2d10 mass crits with a x3 multiplier attached. The 2d10 aspect was definitely multiplied as well (yes 6d10 bonus damage!!!). For your above example (1d8 + 2d6) x3 would be the range. So 9-60 if it takes the 2d6 value or (1d8 + 1d6)x3 = 6-42 if it uses only the 1d6 value.
I think from memory Molag said it uses the smaller of the two values, this may make sense given your results. I've done lots of testing with my xbower and although he never went for overwhelming crit, his mass crits property on his xbow were multiplied THEN added to the total. There's one xbow out there that really packs a punch on crits!