Possible QC change - Community input appreciated

[Karond]

QC as once again discussed FS, and its relative power to other classes. While we're still discussing it, we would like to get some community input on how you all feel about this suggestion. It is as follows:

Change Favored Soul spellcasting to require wisdom to cast spells, but using charisma for DCs.

It would effectively use the same setup as spirit shaman in that case, which would make both divine spellbooks have one casting class with purely wisdom (cleric, druid) and one class with wisdom for spells and charisma for DCs (spirit shaman, favored soul).

This would change how FS works without influencing any other class which is key. One can still build for an FS with Epic divine might, but the ability points would be more strained and you would get less spells doing so than currently (although, the DCs go up a bit). It will also have slightly better synergy for DC favored souls.

Anyway, nothing is decided yet. Let us know what you think about this. It would of course have the 100% RCR still apply to allow people to adjust, if implemented.

[thids]

It's a decent balance proposal. Outside of removing the class entirely, there isn't much you can do to bring it in line. Add removal of the 10 DR at level 20 and you've got yourself a good balance change.

[matelener]

We should do that. And welcome our new monk / fs / sacred fist overlords.

[thids]

Not much of a difference with monk/cleric/sf when their number of spells are reduced. Plus it will suffer from the same issues that the cleric version suffers from.

[matelener]

Not much of a difference with monk/cleric/sf when their number of spells are reduced. Plus it will suffer from the same issues that the cleric version suffers from.

If the casting attributes become like the spirit shaman's then a monk/fs will get bonus spells per day from Wisdom.

If by the number of spells you meant known spells then it doesn't really matter. An FS easily gets every mechanically important spell from the cleric's spell list.

20 CL Cleric's spells per day look like this:
7/6/6/6/6/5/5/5/5

Fs's are:
6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6

Count in bonus spells from 22+ WIS and spontenoues casting = a roided up version of monk/cleric/fs.

[Xanfyrst]

Why not just remove it if the majority got a problem with it?

Personally, I'd prefer the other Base classes to be in line with FS rather than the other way around, PvE-wise. But suppose that's a hard thing to do without hurting PvP balance (which is already skewed).

But if the change with using wisdom for spells and charisma for DC gets approved, I suggest more divine damage spells gets added too. For shaman as well, of course.

[Blackman D]

Why not just remove it if the majority got a problem with it?

was suggested, tho we would prefer the lesser of the evils

Personally, I'd prefer the other Base classes to be in line with FS rather than the other way around, PvE-wise. But suppose that's a hard thing to do without hurting PvP balance (which is already skewed).

also suggested and has its problems yes

But if the change with using wisdom for spells and charisma for DC gets approved, I suggest more divine damage spells gets added too. For shaman as well, of course.

not sure cleric/FS really need more irresistible damage spells, especially when they have DM/EDM

[Xanfyrst]

Well, do they have to deal divine damage just because they are divine spells? And can't they have DCs to overcome?

[grymhild]

I don't have any FS characters, and I am not against this change.

[thids]

Why not just remove it if the majority got a problem with it?

was suggested, tho we would prefer the lesser of the evils

It's not really the lesser of two evils, as you are doing a half-assed job of addressing the FS balance issue by disregarding the FS RP issue completely. Removing the class while the 100% rcr is still available is the best possible solution in the long run. This is the time to do more drastic positive changes, not to patch things with bandaids. And this is certainly a bandaid, nothing more. FS complaints will still be there, and FS will still be up there.

[grymhild]

I am also not against removing FS as a playable class , or placing FS on a list of exceptional PC application only classes.

[Charraj]

No strong feelings on the issue, but would not mind FS removal either.

[Steve]

I would prefer to see the Class removed.

However, there are some that may truly miss the RP aspect of a favored soul:

"Mortals who perform great services to deities, devoting their lives and work to the cause of their god or goddess, sometimes become the Chosen of that deity."

So as an unsolicited suggestion, could the Favored Soul be made a 10 level PrC, with keeping the existing 1–10 level progression, but putting Weapon Specialization on the 10th level? Maybe even reduce spell progression to 7/10?

The WIS/CHA switch doesn't really appear to be a fix for OPness, just a change of build plans.

[thids]

FS RP is suited for singleplayer, not for a pw with ~50 people online.

[Karond]

Removing classes diminishes overall content. Personally, I would prefer if we added content rather than removed it. As such, I would very much like to see RDD back in a balanced state, just like time domain or indeed some spells. I try to lobby for this point of view whenever I can.

So, removing FS just makes the server feel more poor. It's thus better to alter it in my opinion.

The WIS/CHA switch doesn't really appear to be a fix for OPness, just a change of build plans.

Perhaps at first glance, but look closer. The synergy towards dark blessing, EDM or divine shield loses out considerably. The monk/FS builds aren't a real concern, as the cleric/monk weren't even before the dispel fix which hurt them. FS remains a good class, sure, but has few routes towards synergy left open to it with the change.