Blood Warrior

[aaron22]

i agree. it does kind of target a specific build, but it seems very fun.

[metaquad4]

It adds a different kind of defensive PRC to martials, gives Orcs their own class, and gives Barbarians a good PRC (but, frenzied beserkers can work off it too, if you don't want to go barbarian). 3 birds, one stone.

[aaron22]

Blood Warrior:
-Requires: orc/half-orc, non good, 1 useless feat and Rage and/or Frenzy (Limits class selection)
-5/- DR
-Party rages/frenzies/charges with you
-Suffer no negatives from rage/frenzy/charge
-Upon rage/frenzy/charge, gain concealment for the duration (up to 60% for rage/frenzy and 70% for charge)
-Immune to Fear
-Fast Healing 1

for me i would add stun with the fear. and i would also add the greater restoration. this makes it pretty scary to caster types.

It adds a different kind of defensive PRC to martials, gives Orcs their own class, and gives Barbarians a good PRC (but, frenzied beserkers can work off it too, if you don't want to go barbarian). 3 birds, one stone.

it also gives a player a reason to roll an orc. and build it melee.

edited to alter req's

[metaquad4]

So far:

Hit Dice: 1d10
Saves: High - Fort/Will, Low - Reflex
Skill Points: 2+INT
Skills: Concentration, Intimidate, Survival, Heal, Craft Armor, Craft Weapon

Requirements:
Race: Orc/Half-Orc
Alignment: None Good, None Lawful
BAB: 6
Feats: Rage or Frenzy (Potentially add Charge to this), Toughness, Self Sufficient, Steadfast Determination
Skills: Intimidate 10

Feats:
1: Distorting Rage, Distorting Frenzy, Distorting Charge
2: Blood Warrior Damage Reduction (DR 1/-)
3: Bonus Feat
4: DR 2/-
5: Rapid Recovery
6: DR 3/-, Champion of Blood
7: Tireless
8: DR 4/-, Indomitable I
9: Bonus Feat
10: DR 5/-, Indomitable II

Distorting Rage:
While Raging your movements, bloodlust, and fury physically distort your enemy's perception of you. You gain 10% concealment. This advances as you gain more improved forms of rage:

Great Rage = 20% concealment.
Mighty Rage = 40% concealment.
Epic Rage = 60% concealment.

Distorting Frenzy:
While using Frenzy your movements, bloodlust, and fury physically distort your enemy's perception of you. You gain 30% concealment. This advances as you gain more improved forms of frenzy:

Greater Frenzy = 60% concealment.

Distorting Charge:
While Charging your movements, bloodlust, and fury physically distort your enemy's perception of you. You gain 15% concealment, and a further 15% for every other feat that enhances charge. These feats are Powerful Charge, Furious Charger, and Dire Charge.

Blood Warrior Damage Reduction (1/-):
You gain damage reduction 1/-. This damage reduction increases by 1 for every even level of Blood Warrior you take. This damage reduction stacks with all like damage reduction.

Bonus Feat:
At level 3 and at level 9, you gain a bonus feat. These bonus feats are drawn from the following pool:

Powerful Charger, Dire Charge, Epic Rage, Thundering Rage, Extend Rage I, Extend Rage II, Extend Rage III, Extend Rage IV, Extra Rage, Power Attack, and Improved Power Attack.

You must have the requirements to take the feat.

Rapid Recovery:
You gain Fast Healing 1.

Champion of Blood:
When you activate Rage, Frenzy, or Charge, every member of your party within 20 feet (A "huge" radius) is given the same benefits as you. If you do not have tireless, they will become fatigued after. If you have tireless, they will share in its benefit with you. If they have tireless and you do not, they will not be fatigued.
Special Synergy: If you have Inspire Frenzy, this feat applies to it as well.

Tireless:
You no longer suffer from fatigue after raging. When using Frenzy and Inspire Frenzy, you and targets no longer take constant damage.

Indomitable:
You gain Immunity to Fear and Confusion. At level 10, you gain Immunity to Dominate and Daze.

[thids]

Distorting Rage:
While Raging your movements, bloodlust, and fury physically distort your enemy's perception of you. You gain 10% concealment. This advances as you gain more improved forms of rage:

Great Rage = 20% concealment.
Mighty Rage = 40% concealment.
Epic Rage = 60% concealment.

Distorting Frenzy:
While using Frenzy your movements, bloodlust, and fury physically distort your enemy's perception of you. You gain 30% concealment. This advances as you gain more improved forms of frenzy:

Greater Frenzy = 60% concealment.

Distorting Charge:
While Charging your movements, bloodlust, and fury physically distort your enemy's perception of you. You gain 15% concealment, and a further 15% for every other feat that enhances charge. These feats are Powerful Charge, Furious Charger, and Dire Charge.

hahahahahahaha
no. Stop trying to bait people.

Also, blood warrior is a homebrewed class which does not fit with what orcs are supposed to be in FR.

[aaron22]

i think this looks really fun.

as far as the available feats, do you think there should be epic feats within that list if the levels are taken above level 20? i would think this necessary. but maybe i am incorrect in this thinking.

[metaquad4]

Yeah. Epic Feats wouldn't be available if under 20, obviously.

[metaquad4]

hahahahahahaha
no. Stop trying to bait people.

Also, blood warrior is a homebrewed class which does not fit with what orcs are supposed to be in FR.

You are free to come up with a martial PRC for orcs that would be better, and is in relatively on-par with the baseline for a martial PRC that we established (Dwarven Defender). Please, refrain from just copy-pasting a link and make a post with feats/requirements that would fit into NWN2. More suggestions are always welcome on the suggestions board.

And, I'm sure everyone roleplays an orc the exact same. Definitely. Yup.

Rant about Homebrew whiners:

Hidden: show

Also, if you hate homebrew why are you on NWN2? The entire game is BASED off PnP, making it homebrew (They took the idea of FR DnD and customized it into a video game. You'll note that customization is a big thing in DnD. That is its core spirit, even.).

Not the mention spells, feats, even skills. . .some have been added that didn't exist, some have had their effects changed. . .all that is homebrew.

Any move that any character or DM makes on our server that didn't exist in canon, it is homebrew (heck, the same could be said of PnP. And events in PnP tend to be far more world-changing).

Anytime you (or anyone else) complain(s) about anything homebrew, remember what you are playing on. Remember that DnD was created in the spirit of customization to tailor interests, needs, and desires. Complaining about homebrew basically flies in the face of what makes DnD such a special game.

If you REALLY detest homebrew, there are PnP "purists" out there who follow canon storylines/source books strictly and don't change anything. And generally, they are exceedingly boring to play with. I suppose in nwn2, the closest you can go to it is AFLA (more hardcore than purist, but they try. Its nearly impossible to do in NWN2 though. I won't dismiss it as impossible, I'm sure it -technically- can be done.)

[aaron22]

Rant about Homebrew whiners:

Hidden: show

Also, if you hate homebrew why are you on NWN2? The entire game is BASED off PnP, making it homebrew (They took the idea of FR DnD and customized it into a video game. You'll note that customization is a big thing in DnD. That is its core spirit, even.).

Not the mention spells, feats, even skills. . .some have been added that didn't exist, some have had their effects changed. . .all that is homebrew.

Any move that any character or DM makes on our server that didn't exist in canon is homebrew (heck, the same could be said of PnP. And events in PnP tend to be far more world-changing).

Anytime you (or anyone else) complain(s) about anything homebrew, remember what you are playing on. Remember that DnD was created in the spirit of customization to tailor interests, needs, and desires. Complaining about homebrew basically flies in the face of what makes DnD such a special game.

that is why there are DM's. its all homebrew with a DM present, because it may or may not be whatever the DM decides it is for the players.

you are confronted by a huge troll.. fight!=slaughtered!! with ten more right behind him.

[metaquad4]

Yup. DMs (and to an extent, players, when DMs approve of/do not denounce but are aware of their actions/bios/whatever) decide what is canon for us, and what isn't, when they act. They write the story, players populate it.

And, of course, Area/Content Designers have a hand in shaping it as well. Gatta give them a few props :-3

*Attempts to move the train back onto its rails*

[thids]

Very well, if you two think sitting on skype and orchestrating this "discussion" proves some point, carry on. Who am I to argue.

[aaron22]

Very well, if you two think sitting on skype and orchestrating this "discussion" proves some point, carry on. Who am I to argue.

your input would be appreciated. but if you don't want to, that is fine too.

rails
i want to create a comparison here with what i think it should be compared to. i will use points to express strength/weakness. of course my number values are quite subjective.

Blood Warrior
Hit Dice: 1d10
Saves: High - Fort/Will, Low - Reflex +1
Skill Points: 2+INT
Skills: Concentration, Intimidate, Survival, Heal, Craft Armor, Craft Weapon

Requirements:
Race: Orc/Half-Orc
Alignment: None Good, None Lawful
BAB: 6
Feats: Rage or Frenzy or Charge, Toughness, Self Sufficient, Steadfast Determination -2
Skills: Intimidate 10 -1

Feats:
1: Distorting Rage, Distorting Frenzy, Distorting Charge +4
2: Blood Warrior Damage Reduction (DR 1/-) +.5
3: Bonus Feat +1
4: DR 2/- +.5
5: Rapid Recovery +1
6: DR 3/-, Champion of Blood +2
7: Tireless +1
8: DR 4/-, Indomitable I +2
9: Bonus Feat +1
10: DR 5/-, Indomitable II +2

total= +13

Dwarven Defender
HD: d12 +1
Saves: high-will/fort, low-reflex +1
Skill Points: 2+Int
Skills: craft alchemy, craft armor,craft weapon, listen, parry, spot +.5

Req's
Race: Dwarf
Alignment: any lawful
BAB: +7
Feats: Dodge,Toughness -1

Feats:
1: Defensive Stance x1, Improved Defense 1 +4
2: Uncanny dodge +.5
3: Defensive Stance x2 +.5
4: Improved Defense 2, Trap Sense 1 +1
5: Defensive Stance x3 +.5
6: Dwarven Defender DR 1, Improved Uncanny Dodge +4
7: Defensive Stance x4, Improved Defense 3, +1.5
8:
9: Defensive Stance x5, Trap Sense 2 +1
10: Dwarven Defender DR, Improved Defense 4 +2.5

total= +17

[Ravial]

How about instead of this, give a thought to a good old Orc Scout?

Hidden: show

Orc Scout

Slipping down from the wild, barren high country into the more civilized lands of the south, the scout begins his work. His task is not to fight the enemy directly, but rather to gain valuable knowledge about the enemy’s strengths, weaknesses, and movements. With the scout’s help, the enemy will be destroyed, and he will play a valuable role in that downfall. The scout’s contribution to the foe’s demise
is visible not in the execution of his missions, but on the battlefield when the opponent realizes that the orc commanders know far more about them than they should. Part wilderness warrior and part spy, the orc scout is a hero to his people. His glory comes not from prowess in combat, but from risking his life to bring his chieftain accurate intelligence about the enemy’s activities. He prepares for this role by training himself to survive in inhospitable climes, to make clandestine observations from afar, and to return home safely with his knowledge intact. Most orc scouts are barbarians, fighters, or rangers who have chosen to be trained for special missions on behalf of their tribe. Orc scouts normally work alone or in pairs. Rarely, they gather in a triad when the task at hand is too demanding for a solo mission or twin group. Their goal is to spy on the enemy and get home safely to tell what they know.

Hit Die: d8.

REQUIREMENTS To qualify to become an orc scout, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Race: Orc, half-orc, or tanarukk.
Base Attack Bonus: +5.
Skills: Move Silently 6 ranks, Wilderness Lore 4 ranks. Feats: Alertness, Endurance, Stealthy.

CLASS SKILLS The orc scout’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are: Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intuit Direction (Wis), Jump (Str), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Search (Int), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), Use Rope (Dex), and Wilderness Lore (Wis). See Chapter 4: Skills in the Player’s Handbook for skill descriptions.

Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier.

Feat progression:
Level 1: Fieldcraft +1, blend into wilds
Level 2: bonus feat, fast movement (40ft)
Level 3: Fieldcraft +2, sneak attack +1d6
Level 4: Bonus Feat
Level 5: Fieldcraft +3, Fast movement (50ft)

Class levels: 5
Save progression:
Fort from level 1-5; +0, +1,+2,+3,+3
Reflex from level 1-5; +2,+3,+3,+4,+4
Will from level 1-5; +0, +0, +1, +1, +1
BAB progression: Medium

CLASS FEATURES: The following are class features of the orc scout prestige class.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Orc scouts are proficient in simple and martial weapons and light armor.

Fieldcraft (Ex): At 1st level, an orc scout gains a bonus on a number of skill checks due to his intensive training in these capabilities. The orc scout gains a +1 bonus on Climb, Heal, Hide, Intuit Direction, Listen, Move Silently, Search, Spot, and Wilderness Lore checks whenever he is engaged in a scouting mission. The bonus increases to +2 at 3rd level and to +3 at 5th level.

Blend into Wilds (Ex): At 1st level, an orc scout learns to blur his lines with the aid of colored body paint, carefully chosen clothing, and posture, making it much difficult for others to see him. This technique requires 1 minute to implement but grants the orc scout a +10 competence bonus on his Hide check. An orc scout can use this ability only when he is in a wilderness area, and only if he is not under observation by foes. If he moves at all, he loses the benefit of blending and must make his Hide check normally (see the Hide skill description).

Bonus Feat: At 2nd level and again at 4th level, an orc scout gains a feat from the following list: Blooded, Forester, Resist Poison, Survivor, Toughness, Treetopper. Fast Movement (Ex): At 2nd level, an orc scout’s speed improves to 40 feet, as shown on Table 6–4. An orc scout in medium or heavy armor, or carrying a medium or heavy load, loses this extra speed. At 5th level, the orc scout’s speed improves to 50 feet. Orc scouts with levels in barbarian add that class’s fast movement bonus to their orc scout base speed.

Sneak Attack (Ex): Often an orc scout must strike an opponent unawares in order to accomplish his mission. At 3rd level, an orc scout gains the ability to execute a sneak attack if he can catch an opponent unable to defend himself from attack, striking a vital spot for extra damage. Any time the orc scout’s opponent would be denied his Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (whether he actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), the orc scout’s attack deals +1d6 points of extra damage. Should the orc scout score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied. It takes precision and penetration to hit a vital spot, so ranged attacks can only count as sneak attacks if the target is no farther than 30 feet away. With a sap or an unarmed strike, an orc scout can make a sneak attack that deals subdual damage instead of normal damage. He cannot use a weapon that deals normal damage to deal subdual damage in a sneak attack, not even at the usual–4 penalty, because he must make optimal use of his weapon in order to execute the sneak attack. An orc scout can only sneak attack living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to strike. Additionally, any creature immune to critical hits is similarly immune to sneak attacks. The orc scout must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach a vital spot. An orc scout cannot sneak attack while striking at a creature with concealment or by striking at the limbs of a creature whose vitals are beyond reach. If an orc scout gets a sneak attack bonus from another source (such as rogue levels), the bonuses to damage stack.

[aaron22]

so DD value is at 17 and BW is at 13...

i may be under-valuing the displacement advantage that occurs while rageing/frenzying/charging on the BW, but i also may be under-valuing the AC bonuses from the DD. if i undervalued them both equally then i would still need something to make up for the appx. 24% value that DD gets if we want to make these two comparable.

from looking at them side by side, the improved uncanny dodge on the DD really sets it way above.

trying to consider something of similar quality to add. the IUD with the listen/spot skill essentially makes sneak attackers weak melee without their ability to both hide and perform any kind of sneak damage.

maybe a greater spell mantle? i dont want it to be invulnerable but want it to be planned for accordingly.

[metaquad4]

Maybe if it required Sorcerer/Bard/Favored Soul.

It'd either need innate blood and training. Or intensive learning and training. And the level of training in magic required to cast that level of spell would be pretty intense. Far too intense for a barbarian/beserker PRC.

Improved Uncanny dodge is meh. It doesn't actually protect against sneak attacks (unless the attacker is below level 10!). Uncanny dodge is great, since it doesn't deny your AC.

I'd say, at the renditions we posted, they are about equal and in line with logic. Adding advanced magical abilities would make it logic-defying (within the rules of this universe).

I'd have put the concealment at +6, personally. Concealment is pretty good.

You are also vastly underestimating Champion of Blood. A Barbarian 20/Champion of Blood 10, for example, could give their party 60% Concealment, +10 STR/CON (stacking with enhancement bonuses), +8 will saves, +7 natural AC (ice troll beserker). It won't last too too long (since much of your party probably won't have high con), but it'll last long enough to help them survive and dish out some serious hurt. I'd put it at +5, at the very least, on its own.