Spirit Shaman

[chad878262]

Just wanted to call out the major difference between monk/druid vs. Spirit shaman/monk is the necessary stat requirements. A druid / monk could attain all the good stuff a SS/M could plus would have the insane DC of druid with max WIS. A druid monk could honestly just put points in STR for attack/damage and still get max WIS for AC and DC while the spirit shaman needs to worry about CHA for spell DC. So the druid/monk combination would need to be reviewed separate from SS even if shapes didn't work with monk abilities (not saying it wouldn't be fine, just that it isn't like for like).

[kkrazlite]

Just to be clear. You guys agree that it is alright to get 80+ ac from a spell?

Yes exspecially considering all the cons of trying to reach that A.C. it's just another gimmick class that focuses on one aspect in terms of combat but is out-trumped in all others, seeing as to even reach that A.C. you need to give up so much.

Now of course if the class somewho got to the point where someone could still have that 80 A.C. and all the spell progression and DCs of a druid with good damage and decent ab without having to worry about any epic lvl caster simply chucking a MORDS at you . . . Then i would dissagree gladly.

[mrm3ntalist]

Yes exspecially considering all the cons of trying to reach that A.C. it's just another gimmick class that focuses on one aspect in terms of combat but is out-trumped in all others, seeing as to even reach that A.C. you need to give up so much.

Its not the problem of a class. Its a problem of a spell. To recap about Shapechange, it should be changed to:
- Nightwalker and Horned Devil should have the AC lowered, preferably by denying the AC bonus from wisdom
- The rest of the shapes should be buffed and maybe given their immunities in order for them to be more useful

This way Shapechange is a better all around spell, which can see more uses.

[kkrazlite]

Yes exspecially considering all the cons of trying to reach that A.C. it's just another gimmick class that focuses on one aspect in terms of combat but is out-trumped in all others, seeing as to even reach that A.C. you need to give up so much.

Its not the problem of a class. Its a problem of a spell. To recap about Shapechange, it should be changed to:
- Nightwalker and Horned Devil should have the AC lowered, preferably by denying the AC bonus from wisdom
- The rest of the shapes should be buffed and maybe given their immunities in order for them to be more useful

This way Shapechange is a better all around spell, which can see more uses.

If you took out the AC bonus from wisdom you would be destroying the only good thing the class choice has to offer. . . Druids don't use the spell and mages shouldn't due to them being purely caster friendly. Now I do agree on some aspects that making the other choices of shapes more proficient is a plus so that it makes it alot better in terms of constructive rp and what your character is SUPPOSE to change into, instead of changing to the shape more previlant to combat.

But taking out a core aspect of the combination just because of the fact a single class uses it "too well" I don't agree with.

[AlfarinIcebreaker]

Just make it a single casting ability class instead of monkeying around with Blood Magic and now this.

[Nekoame]

Can druids multiclass with monks now?

[mrm3ntalist]

Can druids multiclass with monks now?

no

[kkrazlite]

Can druids multiclass with monks now?

No someone just brought up the idea with some changes of course.

[nightingale]

My main is a monk/SS. I decided not to get shapechange because

1) it is dispellable
2) you don't need more than 70 ac on this server.
3) you can't heal yourself
4) you also can't use *items* or *feats* like knockdown or Expose Weakness, which you need because your AB is low.

Interestingly, I partied a good amount with the Favored Soul/Epic Divine Might build and he is WAY more powerful than me. He has much higher caster level, way better saves/immunities (including crits/sneaks), MUCH higher damage and AB. I like to make original builds so I like my SS (I was talking about the monk/SS with shapechange idea when I started here about 5 years ago, and have worked on the idea for years) There is really no reason to nerf them unless we want to also start nerfing other more powerful builds too.

Spirit Shamans are really overlooked, and they are NOT weak, which makes them fun because I get to feel original by playing one. One thing to notice about their spontaneous casting ability is they have more flexible choices between blast or heal. FS don't get the blasts and sorcerers don't get the heals, this makes spirit shamans, in my opinion, the most versatile of the spontaneous casters.

I think that the possibilities that SS offers may come as a surprise to most, and that surprise might be bringing attention to the SS now, but they are not overpowered, just overlooked.

[nightingale]

I redid the paladin spirit shaman with blackguard because the DMs don't want paladins to use Blood Magic. I posted on the old forum about this many years ago, and suggested the blood magic could be seen as a self-sacrifice, that seemed to be accepted at the time, but apparently there has been a change. So here is the new SS/BG build:

http://nwn2db.com/build/?276679

The DC build here:

http://nwn2db.com/build/?261639

can be similarly changed, basically you just lose a feat to cleave.

[Miyuki]

Are evil Aasimars allowed? I mean, the way i learned it, they are as rare as good drow or pretty much impossible. How is that handled here?

[Rinzler]

Are evil Aasimars allowed? I mean, the way i learned it, they are as rare as good drow or pretty much impossible. How is that handled here?

We have plenty of good drow here so I don't think that'd be a reason why you couldn't.

[Miyuki]

Hm...ok, good to know then. Thanks, again learned something. ^^