Swashbuckler / IB / WD / WM now Swash / WoD / WD / WM!!

[Steve]

I actually build this:

http://nwn2db.com/build/?263465

Lol. Is this just insanity in a shiny package? Besides not doing it, what would you change?

EDIT: had to drop IB because Bleeding Wound doesn't pop unless through unarmed or light weapon.

[chad878262]

Wha....Wh....Huh?

So many non-synergies...hurts my eyes. I question if you would not be better dual wielding kukri's with DEX 25 instead of STR 25... AC can be similar since you would be able to apply INT to AC up to +5 (though would need at least 2 more points in INT). You just have to find two feats to get Greater TWF (WF: Katana and Exotic WP = TWF / ITWF so have to drop LoH and may have to alter stats to get PTWF in epics). Remember that with the combat modes the offhand is not impacted, so when using AT you would get all 5 offhand attacks + the 3 main hand attacks = 8 APR. So you can apply more bleed damage and sneak attacks using Feint which I think overall would give you more damage at the cost of maybe 3 points of AC (42/53 is still pretty good though). If you want to keep the concept I think you are better off dropping Invisible Blade since it is only giving you 6 points of bleed per hit. I would say with the Katana you are better off going F12 over SB 8/IB5 since you would get +8 damage (Epic Weapon Specialization / Melee Matery). F12/WD10/WM8 would be better than what you have, IMO.

[Steve]

He must be either unarmed or wielding only light weapons in order to inflict a Bleeding Wound.

Ha! I just read this. So yeah, IB with a katana is a no go.

[chad878262]

I got this started for you, but don't have time to play around and see if anything better can be done with it. Could focus on getting Weapon Master sooner, but saving feats isn't really an option since you won't get 8 Hide/MS/Tumble fast enough to get all 10 levels of WD and 7 WM. However, can still get all the feats you were getting with your SB/IB build and instead of 6 bleed damage per hit you have +8 from Epic Weapon Focus and Melee Mastery. Not sure if it still fits your concept, but worth a look maybe:

http://nwn2db.com/build/?263480

[Steve]

It's a decent split, Chad...thanks for trying it out. I was hoping in my original quest to avoid Fighter class...I can easily switch out IB for 5 something...but god help me it always seems best to choose Anointed Knight or WoD for a melee.

[chad878262]

It's a decent split, Chad...thanks for trying it out. I was hoping in my original quest to avoid Fighter class...I can easily switch out IB for 5 something...but god help me it always seems best to choose Anointed Knight or WoD for a melee.

Best, but not required. Dervish would be good for offense or divine champion for saves and extra feats. Could go SB/DC...Damage needs to come from somewhere though.

[Akroma666]

I like it, if you can somehow get improved evasion, you can get epic dodge.. not sure you can squeeze that in or not since you need to drop swash.

[Steve]

I had to change out Invisible Blade for Warrior of Darkness, in order to make it all work. Unfortunately that goes against my idea for a full-sword-sneaky-blade type!!

[chad878262]

It's never going to come out perfect because the primary things you are gaining from SB are wasted on this build. That isn't to say it isn't viable of course, but I think it is the biggest issue causing you frustration. Weapon Finesse and Insightful Strike aren't really doing much for you here making Fighter the clearly better choice. Swashbuckler is a fantastic class to mix with Weapon Master, for example SB19/WM7/WD4 for monster crits that also lower STR/CON. Another option is SB12/A8/Duelist 10 or SB15/A8/D7. However, SB free feats really work with a DEX/INT build, nothing they get really helps a STR build all that much.

I understand the thought experiment and it certainly can work, but I don't think you are going to come up with something you are 'happy' with because there is nothing SB is giving you different from Fighter, it's just less. Making a build different works out when it gains something by going that different route. It can be 'weaker' so long as it is gaining something it would not otherwise have. In this case SB is not really giving you anything that a Fighter doesn't do better in every way. You can argue for those couple extra skills, but that isn't all that much. Those four Fighter feats for 6 levels just help the build so much more.

[Steve]

You're reading too much into it Chad!

I've realized that Swash was there for high BAB, Bluff skill to unlock IB, and free Mobility feat.

But with IB gone, I could take Fighter 8 for more feats, or Ranger. Pretty much the build was to make a katana wielding WM + IB, but since Bleeding Wound is limited to certain weapons, it'll never work!!

[Akroma666]

You're reading too much into it Chad!

I've realized that Swash was there for high BAB, Bluff skill to unlock IB, and free Mobility feat.

But with IB gone, I could take Fighter 8 for more feats, or Ranger. Pretty much the build was to make a katana wielding WM + IB, but since Bleeding Wound is limited to certain weapons, it'll never work!!

Take monk 9 and get improved evasion so you can get epic dodge maybe?

[Steve]

That would be an excellent Fear to acquire, high DEX (25) and katana won't mix.

[Akroma666]

That would be an excellent Fear to acquire, high DEX (25) and katana won't mix.

My bad, forgot the sex requirement.. dang

[Sun Wukong]

Replace your levels of Weapon Master with Ghostfaced Killer, you get some sneaky abilities to make use of instead of critical hit damage that does not do you anything against critical hit immunity.