Questions for experienced casters, with trickster experience

[Twotricks]

I have few questions for spellcasters about spells for my arcane trickster build.

1. I would have 16 level of Wizard/Trickster levels, and would take Practiced Spellcaster feat.
Would I be able to cast lvl9 spells ? You need 17 levels of wizard to cast first lvl9 spell ?
Would my spellcaster lvl be 20 ?

2. If i have natural Int 18 , would I be able to cast lvl 9 spell if Int is boosted with equipment ?

3. Reserve Spell feat : Invisible needle. I see Arcane trickster Wizards are taking it to sneak attack. Why is it better than attacking with ranged weapon or melee ? How many attacks in round can you make with Needle ? Does it expends spell slot when used ?

4. Reserve Spell feat: Umbral Shroud. How good is it ?

5. What Epic spell would be most fitting for Arcane Trickster ?

[Rudolph]

I can answer the first three. Not so much because of experience, but because I asked them myself in the past.

1. I would have 16 level of Wizard/Trickster levels, and would take Practiced Spellcaster feat.
Would I be able to cast lvl9 spells ? You need 17 levels of wizard to cast first lvl9 spell ?
Would my spellcaster lvl be 20 ?

Your Caster Level (CL) would be 20 with Practiced Spellcaster, but only the 16 Wizard/Trickster levels count towards spell level access. I.e. you do indeed need one more of those to get access to lvl 9 spells.

2. If i have natural Int 18 , would I be able to cast lvl 9 spell if Int is boosted with equipment ?

Yes. This means that if you can get access to a +4 INT item (rare), then your minimum INT score for casting lvl 9 spells is 15.

3. Reserve Spell feat : Invisible needle. I see Arcane trickster Wizards are taking it to sneak attack. Why is it better than attacking with ranged weapon or melee ? How many attacks in round can you make with Needle ? Does it expends spell slot when used ?

I always thought it required a Ranged Touch Attack (which ignores armor, shield, and natural AC bonuses and hence works well even for low AB builds), but the wiki actually says Ranged Attack (CAN ANYONE CONFIRM THIS?), which would be much worse. In any case, you can only hit once per round, albeit without expending a spell slot: you have infinite uses. In other words, if you can reliably attack with a ranged weapon, you certainly should. As I see it, the feat is mostly an rp gimmick due to the sheer coolness of killing foes with force needles (Pencils are for wusses!).

[Twotricks]

Your Caster Level (CL) would be 20 with Practiced Spellcaster, but only the 16 Wizard/Trickster levels count towards spell level access. I.e. you do indeed need one more of those to get access to lvl 9 spells.

Uh that is a bummer. But I only want lvl 9 spell for permanent Haste. ( do you think its good ? )

But that means I will need to drop one Sneak attack dice

[Valefort]

Persistent metamagic is disabled on the server, no permanent haste I'm afraid. Invisible Needle is an RTA, Umbral shroud is meh, for 5 there are no particular synergies between AT and any epic spell, pick whatever you fancy.

[Twotricks]

Persistent metamagic is disabled on the server, no permanent haste I'm afraid. Invisible Needle is an RTA, Umbral shroud is meh, for 5 there are no particular synergies between AT and any epic spell, pick whatever you fancy.

So if persistent spell is disabled, there is perhaps no great need for lvl 9 spells ( after all the character aim is not to be wizard but magic improved rogue )

As for Invisible Needle, i read now that casting it pops you out of stealth. So It can sneak attack, but not from stealth. Which makes it close to pointless ( or should I say waste of slot )

As for epic spell , i would probably take Gate. Since summons work well with sneak attacks. And there is no resist. But since it needs lvl 9 Spell, I will probably pass on that too.

[Rudolph]

But that means I will need to drop one Sneak attack dice

I don't know your build enough to advise here. Taking more Trickster levels should increase your SA, of course, but probably you are referring to a non-spellcasting class such as Rogue.

Another important feature of the server you should be aware of is the fact that the CL bug has been fixed. This means you have an increasing chance of getting dispelled by many mobs the more your final overall CL goes below 30. Ending spellcasting progression at, say, 21 or 20 CL is therefore usually a bad idea, although you might justify doing so with HiPS to some extent - maybe you can hide before the dispels hit you.

[Twotricks]

But that means I will need to drop one Sneak attack dice

I don't know your build enough to advise here. Taking more Trickster levels should increase your SA, of course, but probably you are referring to a non-spellcasting class such as Rogue.

Another important feature of the server you should be aware of is the fact that the CL bug has been fixed. This means you have an increasing chance of getting dispelled by many mobs the more your final overall CL goes below 30. Ending spellcasting progression at, say, 21 or 20 CL is therefore usually a bad idea, although you might justify doing so with HiPS to some extent - maybe you can hide before the dispels hit you.

Trickster goes only as high as 10 levels. So its 5 mandatory wizard levels + 10 Trickster levels.
After that its choice if you want to be more rogue or wizard.

But what worries me with this build is exactly what you said right now. Is the fact many creatures cast dispell on you ( does it strip you of all buffs ? )

Cause my idea is to have rogue that is 90% capable as maxed rogue, but able to ward himself to heavens with magic. But if first enemy you meet dispells you, than you might just as well be regular rogue...

Is dispelling all the wards happening that often ?

ps: what was CL bug ?

[Rudolph]

There are quite a few dispellers, yes. You'd have to hide from them as soon as they start casting and take them out asap not to be stripped.

I used to play the following build, but rcred after the CL bug was fixed (though I didn't really made an effort to learn how to dodge dispels):
http://nwn2db.com/build/?198054

The CL bug in the regular game counted character levels rather than spellcasting class levels to calculate the final CL, which meant that even a, say, W17/R13 build would have had 30 CL. Those days are gone on BGTSCC.

[Sun Wukong]

1. I would have 16 level of Wizard/Trickster levels, and would take Practiced Spellcaster feat.
Would I be able to cast lvl9 spells ? You need 17 levels of wizard to cast first lvl9 spell ?
Would my spellcaster lvl be 20 ?

You need 17 levels of 'Wizard Spell Casting Progression' to get your 9th level spell slots. You are stuck at 'Wizard Spell Casting Progression' of 16, so if you can squeeze out another level of Wizard or so, you will get your 9th level spells. Your caster level will be 20 though with Practised Spell Caster feat, it just adds 'Caster Level Progression'.

2. If i have natural Int 18 , would I be able to cast lvl 9 spell if Int is boosted with equipment ?

Yes, as long as you have at least +1 intelligence from an item you will have access to 9th level spells.

3. Reserve Spell feat : Invisible needle. I see Arcane trickster Wizards are taking it to sneak attack. Why is it better than attacking with ranged weapon or melee ? How many attacks in round can you make with Needle ? Does it expends spell slot when used ?

Basically, the reserve feats use trigger spells. If you have a trigger spell memorized, and do not cast the trigger spell itself, you can use the reserve feat as many times as possible. Just drag it to your hotbar for easy access.

Now, if you have a 9th level spell called 'Bigby's Crushing Hand' memorized, then your Invisible Needle will do 9d4 damage per cast. That is 22.5~ on avarage. (You can get sneak attack dice on top of it when you meet the ranged sneak attack/flanking conditions.)

If you do not have access to 9th level spells, you could use an 8th level spell called 'Bigby's Clenched Fist' to get 8d4 damage out of the Invisible Needle reserve feat. That would be 20~ damage on avarage.

Invisible Needle does magic damage, so it is rarely resisted. But you do have other options to consider as well. Such as Acidic Splatter that deals 7d6 acid damage, 24,5~ on avarage, with the 7th level spell Greater Shadow Conjuration. And also, Clap of Thunder that deals 8d6 sonic damage, 28~ damage on avarage, with the 8th level spell Greater Shout.

You get one reserve feat cast per round, so if you have the Two-weapon Fighting feats or Manyshot, you will likely do less Sneak Attack damage per round. The more hits you do per round, the more 'sneak attack' attacks you get. However, unlike with regular attack rolls, once you get past BAB of 15~, your Touch Attacks basically land whenever you roll above 1. (Or are not deflected by some form of concealment.)

Also, if you are an arcanist, it is always more fun to fling spells.

4. Reserve Spell feat: Umbral Shroud. How good is it ?

It has a will save, it lasts for one round, it targets one target, and only grants you concealment of 40% with 'Mass Blindness and Deafness Memorized'. In otherwords, you are better off with just casting something like Concealment or Improved Invisibility on yourself to get 50% concealment against all enemies. I would pick any other reserve feat.

5. What Epic spell would be most fitting for Arcane Trickster ?

To get Epic Gate, or other epic spells, you need to be able to cast 9th level spells. If you had higher Intelligence for spell DCs, Mass Fowl could be right in your alley. Epic Greater Ruin deals 175~ points of damage on avarage, which would be 87.5~ if the target makes its save. Not really worth it in my opinion. Thus mechanically speaking, the best epic spell to pick is Vampiric Feast, because it just drops HP to 50%. But if such evil spell does not fit your character, I guess Epic Gate is your best bet, if only to get a beefy tank for a while.

[Twotricks]

There are quite a few dispellers, yes. You'd have to hide from them as soon as they start casting and take them out asap not to be stripped.

I used to play the following build, but rcred after the CL bug was fixed (though I didn't really made an effort to learn how to dodge dispels):
http://nwn2db.com/build/?198054

The CL bug in the regular game counted character levels rather than spellcasting class levels to calculate the final CL, which meant that even a, say, W17/R13 build would have had 30 CL. Those days are gone on BGTSCC.

I think with all considered this is final build I am going for is this

http://nwn2db.com/build/?282895

I dont need any of 9th level spells, nor epic spell. Since there is no permanent haste anyway.

Needle does not work from stealth so its pointless for me, since i get many more melee attacks.

As for dispelling. That will be a bummer. And no you can not hide even with HIPS. Once they start casting their spell always hits.

Only workaround is to disable them from stealth. This is why I am taking blinding strike.

[Sun Wukong]

You have 5 classes, NWN2 only allows 4. Moreover, this server has '3by20' rule, meaning that you must have 3 levels in all your classes by level 20. Thus you need to raise Shadowdancer levels to 3, and have the two missing levels at 19 and 20. Also, you will want to have Expose Weakness as early as possible.

I have redone your build: http://nwn2db.com/build/?283014

[Twotricks]

You have 5 classes, NWN2 only allows 4. Moreover, this server has '3by20' rule, meaning that you must have 3 levels in all your classes by level 20. Thus you need to raise Shadowdancer levels to 3, and have the two missing levels at 19 and 20. Also, you will want to have Expose Weakness as early as possible.

I have redone your build: http://nwn2db.com/build/?283014

Oh my ! Why would anyone want 3 levels in shadowdancer...and by lvl 20. Crap

That kind of breaks any point of making this.

But anyway I like how you mixed rogue and wizard to get Arcane Trickster faster. But there is a reason i went to Rogue lvl 7 first. Its in order to get HiTS.

After all theorycrafting is fine. But you need to level the thing in practice

[Sun Wukong]

You get HiPS proper at level 8, and at lower levels there are not that many dispels. Thus the +8 AC from Wizard spells such as Mage Armor and Shield is a great boon to have. Not to mention +2 AB from Cat's Grace. Not to mention how the Invisibility spell lets you do a bulk of the weekly quests at almost no risk.

[Twotricks]

As I allready said in other post. There is great battle technique mixing HiPS and HiTS.

As for protective spells. They last 3-4 minutes. At these low levels. You must rely on your rogue skills.

This is re-edited build.
http://nwn2db.com/build/?283022

[Sun Wukong]

The rest timer is progressive, you can rest. AS for the HitS and HiPS, well, I wouldn't rely on bugs here.