Is it possible to become a lich as a player character?

[Incarnate]

So what you're telling me is that to really stand out, I need to roll a ninja.

Where'd I put my Kozakuran/Waan lore books?

The ninja isn't on the list of classes to choose from.

[Lighters]

We are an elite group of snowflakes.

Actually, the class is labeled phantom on our server (and comes with custom lore). I'm guessing the report is labeled before that change was made.


https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Phantom

[Maecius]

^ Yes. Phantom is a re-worked and re-named "Ninja" class. The name was changed because it was felt by many on staff that "Ninja" did not quite suit the Western Heartlands RP setting. It's probably just still called Ninja in the 2da or wherever Valefort pulled his data from.

[Valefort]

Yes, exactly that a human-only-important leftover in a 2da file ^^

[Lockonnow]

can you guys add Weapon Gatana sword Aka ninjto aka shinobigatana

[Incarnate]

We are an elite group of snowflakes.

Actually, the class is labeled phantom on our server (and comes with custom lore). I'm guessing the report is labeled before that change was made.

That explains it then.

In regards to being a playable lich and its powerlevel - its powerful, but not that powerful - in D&D 3.5 its set to a level adjustment of +4, which is quite high, which means on this server the character would lose out on 4 EPIC levels which is quite a lot.

Like the +5 Natural armor bonus, is very close to the class feature from Palemaster gained at level 1.

The natural weapon gained is 1d8+5, thats 6-13 dmg which isn't all that great because it can be saved for half damage, in which if successful it would be 3-6 dmg. This touch attack doesn't gain any bonus from strength - this is comparable to an improved unarmed strike - normally an improved unarmed strike deals 1d3+str in damage, which means one with +2 str. mod, would deal 3-6 damage, and one with a +5 would be able to deal 6-8 points of damage that cannot be saved against.

The fear aura isn't really that powerful, because when the character can attain lichdom, the character would be powerful enough to deal with 5HD creatures. Though its usefor for keeping many lesser beings from attacking the lich.

The Paralyzing touch is powerful but requires the lich to be close by, which the lich would prefer not to be if they're powerful foes or the very least its equivalent. The maximum DC a lich can produce is 10+½ lich level+cha = 10+13+cha, so for instance 26 would be a dc lich with +3 cha mod could produce - a level 30 fighter with a con mod of 0 could beat that dc with 9 or more, but given the fact the most fighters have at least +1, and gear can raise this as well so its very likely it would be even easier to beat it. Basically those that are sporting a high fort save will much more easily successfully save against it.

Being an undead means its gets some inherent weaknesses:
- Can be turned and even be rebuked.
- Cannot be raised or ressurected
- Has constitution score of 0.
- Weakness to Positive Energy (Potentially x2 damage)
-....

Put differently, the level adjustment is pegged at la+4 which means the various benefits should outweigh the loss of 4 EPIC levels, where weaknesses also needs to be taken into consideration.

It might be that many of you find it to better to retire the character when at its prime - I find it would be better to retire the character once its no longer fun to play, and when that is would be difficult to say.

[Dragonslayer]

This server, from what I understand, has a policy of allowing players to play as they desire while remaining in character. Which means that if granted such a template, a player would have no reasonable incentive to retire.

That said, such templates would be given at DM discretion. And, traditionally, they are given as a retirement reward for the end of a character's story.

At the end of the day, DM's decide what is acceptable or not for a PC on this server. If they have particular reasons for not allowing people to play as special templates, then that's the policy.

While I can understand why it would be fun to play something like this, these are extremely powerful creatures, and the game's story environment is not really set up to challenge them from a PC perspective. Because there are mechanical contests between other player characters from time to time (most notably in the form of PVP or Character Vs. Character combat), granting one player character significant mechanical advantages over other other player characters creates an uneven playing field.

This right here should have been the end of the conversation. You can argue that the template would not be mechanically unfair all you want, but you don't know the stat spread of the dungeons. You're not aware of how they would implement it to be in line with both the lore, and the unique level RP that the server operates under (namely, your posted template means little to nothing considering how level 30's are treated from a RP perspective). You're likely unaware of the kinds of pressures a DM would fall under when having to account for such players in events, in changing NPC scripts to treat them properly, in handling requests from players, and in dungeons.

In short, you don't see the big picture. They do. I'd advise you to at least try to listen to them.

[Deathgrowl]

In regards to being a playable lich and its powerlevel - its powerful, but not that powerful - in D&D 3.5 its set to a level adjustment of +4, which is quite high, which means on this server the character would lose out on 4 EPIC levels which is quite a lot.

This is not the case. ECL does not count towards max level on this server. Drow can get to level 30, even with +2 ECL.

Being an undead means its gets some inherent weaknesses:
- Can be turned and even be rebuked.

On the other hand, with a 30 HD lich and +4 turn resistance as liches get, they are certainly difficult to turn.

- Cannot be raised or ressurected

And? As long as the phylactery is intact, a lich will regenerate.

- Has constitution score of 0.

And a HD of d12 instead of the standard d4 of a wizard. HP wise, this would in most cases be a buff. Fortitude wise, it's almost irrelevant, as undeads are immune to practically everything that is based on fortitude saves.

- Weakness to Positive Energy (Potentially x2 damage)

No. No weakness. It just flips positive and negative energy around. Cure spells damage, inflict spells heal. In fact, this is a strength, as wizards and sorcerers can pick negative energy spells that would heal undeads.

So the weaknesses are barely weaknesses. On the other hand, the strengths are immense. Just from being undead they get this:

• Darkvision
• Immunity to all mind-affecting effects.
• Immunity to poison.
• Immunity to sleep.
• Immunity to paralysis.
• Immunity to stunning.
• Immunity to disease.
• Immunity to death effects.
• Immunity to critical hits.
• Immunity to nonlethal damage (this is not entirely relevant for our server).
• Immunity to ability drain.
• Immunity to energy drain.
• Immunity to damage to it's physical scores (str, dex, con).
• Immunity to fatigue and exhaustion (again, not relevant unless barbarian or dervish. Barbarian or dervish lich would be weird).
• Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude Save (unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless)
• No need to breathe, eat or sleep.

And that's just from being undead. The lich template itself adds the following:

• 15/bludgeoning damage resistance.
• Immunity to cold.
• Immunity to electricity.
• Immunity to polymorph (except when cast on themselves).
• +2 Int, Wis and Cha
• +8 Hide, Listen, Move Silently, Search, Sense Motive and Spot.

I'd say the strengths rather outweigh the rather negligible weaknesses. In fact, +4 ECL is excessively generous of the PnP designers.

[Thorsson]

Hmmm, what about a Phantom Lich (although I think a Phantom Mummy would be cooler)?

I think that would win the Super Special Snowflake Medal (TM).

[CleverUsername123]

Hmmm, what about a Phantom Lich (although I think a Phantom Mummy would be cooler)?

I think that would win the Super Special Snowflake Medal (TM).

No. Phantom/Favored Soul/Sorcerer who calls her (has to be female) powers a "terrible curse" but they have no downsides.

[Tekill]

Hmmm, what about a Phantom Lich (although I think a Phantom Mummy would be cooler)?

I think that would win the Super Special Snowflake Medal (TM).

No. Phantom/Favored Soul/Sorcerer who calls her (has to be female) powers a "terrible curse" but they have no downsides.

Probably Aasimar (before undeath) then. So we would need her angel features to really shine...like when she cried , she would cry rainbow colored tears.

Boosh! Snowflake award is MINE!!!

[NegInfinity]

Barbarian or dervish lich would be weird

Actually undead dervish would be extremely cool, but a lich is not the right choice for that, because dervish is not necessarily a spellcaster.

Necropolitan might be a better idea.

[Incarnate]

Barbarian or dervish lich would be weird

Actually undead dervish would be extremely cool, but a lich is not the right choice for that, because dervish is not necessarily a spellcaster.

Necropolitan might be a better idea.

So maybe we should have it possible to become a necropolitan? That would be cool too.
Could be awesome with an undead city - maybe make an actual city of the dead where the access point in the fugue becomes active.

[NegInfinity]

Barbarian or dervish lich would be weird

Actually undead dervish would be extremely cool, but a lich is not the right choice for that, because dervish is not necessarily a spellcaster.

Necropolitan might be a better idea.

So maybe we should have it possible to become a necropolitan? That would be cool too.
Could be awesome with an undead city - maybe make an actual city of the dead where the access point in the fugue becomes active.

That's for DMs/Devs to decide.

I'm unsure who the heck would be able to perform Ritual of Crucumigration on sword coast.

http://www.realmshelps.net/monsters/tem ... itan.shtml

[Incarnate]

So maybe we should have it possible to become a necropolitan? That would be cool too.
Could be awesome with an undead city - maybe make an actual city of the dead where the access point in the fugue becomes active.

That's for DMs/Devs to decide.

I'm unsure who the heck would be able to perform Ritual of Crucumigration on sword coast.

http://www.realmshelps.net/monsters/tem ... itan.shtml

Of course that is, just saying it would cool too, plus it would open up some possibilties in regards to rp, events, etc.

Spellscasters (necromancers most likely) with a higher level of lore: Arcana and/or Spellcraft I'd presume.