Altoholic with a ranger/dual wield question

[Muckluck]

Hi folks, it's me the altoholic again.

I've been looking at some ranger builds for dual-wielding (Currently going for R21/A9), but there's one thing that confuses me... whether to dual-wield short swords or kukris. The opinions seem to differ on this, and I can't find information to back up why either would be the better choice.

Can someone help me out here? Why kukri and not short sword? Why short sword and not kukris?

[Sun Wukong]

It is a s sum of weapons you can find, damage resistance types, and critical threat ranges.

Kukri, slashing, and more crits.

Shortsword, piercing more often resisted, and less crits. But I suppose these are easier to get by than the butter knives.

[Muckluck]

It is a s sum of weapons you can find, damage resistance types, and critical threat ranges.

Kukri, slashing, and more crits.

Shortsword, piercing more often resisted, and less crits. But I suppose these are easier to get by than the butter knives.

I hear there's also the problem with dual-wielding medium weapons, because it gives you a penalty to AB? Not sure if that applies when you have Improved two-weapon fighting or not.

[Theodore01]

If you are a small race, then you get a penalty - unless you have a tiny weapon in your offhand or take the oversized twoweapon feat.

[chad878262]

neither, dual hand axes bruh!

[Muckluck]

If you are a small race, then you get a penalty - unless you have a tiny weapon in your offhand or take the oversized twoweapon feat.

Aren't the penalties for medium weapons for medium creatures and small weapons for small creatures (i.e. dual-wielding shortswords as an elf gives a penalty)?

[Sun Wukong]

There are following weapon size categories in NWN2:

Large, medium, small, and tiny.

Elves are medium sized creatures, and if they wield medium sized weapons in their off-hand, they suffer from an additional -2 AB penalty. Thus a total of -4 AB to their attacks.

If the elves wield small weapons, such as a shortsword, in their off hand, then they do not suffer from the additional AB penalty. Hence they are just down by -2 AB from two-weapon fighting.

[Muckluck]

There are following weapon size categories in NWN2:

Large, medium, small, and tiny.

Elves are medium sized creatures, and if they wield medium sized weapons in their off-hand, they suffer from an additional -2 AB penalty. Thus a total of -4 AB to their attacks.

If the elves wield small weapons, such as a shortsword, in their off hand, then they do not suffer from the additional AB penalty. Hence they are just down by -2 AB from two-weapon fighting.

Ohh, I thought short swords were medium, not small. Neat. So the only real question is whether to pick +1 crit range and slashing damage or whether to pick +2 max damage and piercing damage (which is more often easily resisted, if I understand you right)?

[Sun Wukong]

And also what kind of equipment you can easily find. Butter Knives are popular, so there is competition. Also, have a look into the stores to see what you can get.

[Khazrak]

Kukris are popular, yeah. Personally, unless I'm playing a Fighter, I try not to specialize in any one weapon type. Pick weapons as they become available to you.

You're playing a Ranger. You could get Imp. Critical or Weapon Focus in a weapon, but both effects can be mimicked magically or on an item you find (keen weapon, or a spell to make a weapon keen / impact, +AB buffs, etc). Melee rangers are at their best when they're open to ANY weapon choice. What a nice flail! Oh, and that's a nice kukri. Use 'em together!

Rangers that focus on ranged weapons are different. They want to specialize in a singular weapon type, and there's less weapon types to choose from. (You can't cast a 'keen edge' or 'weapon of impact' spell on a ranged weapon, see?) So, you're free to specialize in that case.

But a dual-wielder? Dude, just take whatever fits in your hand and hits really hard.

As an example: on another server, I was playing a half-orc Fighter 2/Barbarian something/Tempest something named Handsome Pete. He never specialized in a single weapon. At different points in the game I utilized a poweful longsword, a powerful kukri, a good mace, a solid flail, a decent handaxe... Everyone else was fighting over Bastard Swords (which were 18-20 x2 IIRC), Halberds (which were x4 instead of scythes), rapiers, scimitars, and kukris. I got to enjoy whatever good weapon fell into my lap while others complained about only having a +2 bastard sword or some crap.

And on this server? I bought a +3 club for something like 2k one time, because nobody uses clubs. But I was a level 4 or so character with a +3 weapon. I didn't give a damn that it was a club, it was a goddamned +3 weapon! That's +15% chance to hit over a non-magical weapon, baby!

[Muckluck]

Kukris are popular, yeah. Personally, unless I'm playing a Fighter, I try not to specialize in any one weapon type. Pick weapons as they become available to you.

You're playing a Ranger. You could get Imp. Critical or Weapon Focus in a weapon, but both effects can be mimicked magically or on an item you find (keen weapon, or a spell to make a weapon keen / impact, +AB buffs, etc). Melee rangers are at their best when they're open to ANY weapon choice. What a nice flail! Oh, and that's a nice kukri. Use 'em together!

Rangers that focus on ranged weapons are different. They want to specialize in a singular weapon type, and there's less weapon types to choose from. (You can't cast a 'keen edge' or 'weapon of impact' spell on a ranged weapon, see?) So, you're free to specialize in that case.

But a dual-wielder? Dude, just take whatever fits in your hand and hits really hard.

As an example: on another server, I was playing a half-orc Fighter 2/Barbarian something/Tempest something named Handsome Pete. He never specialized in a single weapon. At different points in the game I utilized a poweful longsword, a powerful kukri, a good mace, a solid flail, a decent handaxe... Everyone else was fighting over Bastard Swords (which were 18-20 x2 IIRC), Halberds (which were x4 instead of scythes), rapiers, scimitars, and kukris. I got to enjoy whatever good weapon fell into my lap while others complained about only having a +2 bastard sword or some crap.

And on this server? I bought a +3 club for something like 2k one time, because nobody uses clubs. But I was a level 4 or so character with a +3 weapon. I didn't give a damn that it was a club, it was a goddamned +3 weapon! That's +15% chance to hit over a non-magical weapon, baby!

I hadn't thought of it like that. Thank you for the educational and entertaining story!

(Too bad I already took the weapon focus feat for Kukris, heh)

[Khazrak]

Is your alt past level 10 yet? If not, get a buddy to hold items for you and RCR real quick. Pre-11, you keep 100% of the XP you paid to the RCR-man. Keep the same name (or, rather, change 1 letter or add a period) and RP the same person when done. It's also a chance to rethink the aesthetics of your character and change anything that seems off now that you've played them.

Past level 10? Honestly, it's not that bad until you get nearer to 20. My level 13 Svirf (ECL 15) got RCR'd into a new Svirf and ended up at level 11 (ECL 13).

[Muckluck]

Is your alt past level 10 yet? If not, get a buddy to hold items for you and RCR real quick. Pre-11, you keep 100% of the XP you paid to the RCR-man. Keep the same name (or, rather, change 1 letter or add a period) and RP the same person when done. It's also a chance to rethink the aesthetics of your character and change anything that seems off now that you've played them.

Past level 10? Honestly, it's not that bad until you get nearer to 20. My level 13 Svirf (ECL 15) got RCR'd into a new Svirf and ended up at level 11 (ECL 13).

Cheers And no, he's only 6 so far.

[chad878262]

yeah Ranger/Assassin is a bit tight on feats anyway so I would agree you don't want Weapon Focus. You already need Weapon Finesse, Luck of Hero's, Combat Expertise, Deadly Defense leaving only 3 pre-epic feats remaining and a lot of good ones to consider.