Martially inclined wizards

[Deathgrowl]

I played a wizard5/palemaster10/ek10/dragonslayer5 once. This was before the dispel fix, so the server was a bit more forgiving. And I'd build it quite differently now. But it was pretty good.

[A Small Cute Cat]

Thank you for the build!

I'll probably fiddle about with it to fit the character concept I have in mind. Are there any "core" or "essential" feats that should be left alone?

[Hawke]

None of the Seldarine support paladins.

What about Naralis Analor. He is NG (can push over to LG to support Paladins no? )

Vandria Gilmadrith - Lawful Neutral in alignment, she could support a Paladin?

Of course that is all pre spell plague.

[Sun Wukong]

None of the Seldarine support paladins.

What about Naralis Analor. He is NG (can push over to LG to support Paladins no? )

Vandria Gilmadrith - Lawful Neutral in alignment, she could support a Paladin?

Of course that is all pre spell plague.

But are those Forgotten Realm deities?

[Hawke]

http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Seldarine

[Planehopper]

They are from Dragon Magazine, but have been considered legit in the past. I recall them both having been used here, anyway. There was a DM that had a PC elf that RP'd about worshipping Vandria Gilmadrith around the time of our Wyndsouls, and the Tolerance in Treason timeline. While I was a DM I am pretty sure Naralis was discussed IC.

I think the DM used Correlon on their player sheet (it was before my DM time), and I don't think they were a Cleric or Paladin, but I recall it being the first I'd had heard of either of them.

I only say that to say there is a precedent of existence on our server. Either way they would have to be added to be used as a Paladin or other divine class patron.

None of the Seldarine support paladins.

What about Naralis Analor. He is NG (can push over to LG to support Paladins no? )

Vandria Gilmadrith - Lawful Neutral in alignment, she could support a Paladin?

Of course that is all pre spell plague.

But are those Forgotten Realm deities?

[Reckeo]

There is nothing forcing an elf to worship an Elven deity specifically. I used to select Mielikki (one of my favorite RP deities) for my elves, until I realized this would make them be considered Elven outcasts due to falling outside traditional Elven pantheon. I enjoy my wood elves very much and do RP them as sort of 'clan member of a roving band', but not so much to justify that far outside of lore.

Since my more informed discovery of Mielikki as more of a 'fey/human' deity, I have since changed most of my elves over to Seldarine deities, and none of my elves are paladins.

So can it be done? Absolutely. Would require some serious character thought and RP explanation though, why would an elf abandon in RP reasons a Seldarine deity. Elf/fey, Wood Elves, it can be done sure. But...should be RP'd appropriately.

If it's just to be a paladin/bladesinger, you really need to think the choices, since spellsingers, large and large, would NOT be paladins even though they themselves are kind of an interesting 'outcast' in a sense lore wise (outcast in that they teach themselves independently, but by large and large are still very much elfy elf).

Just because something can be mechanically done does not necessarily mean it would be an enjoyable RP if you have to stretch the RP around the mechanical composition.

I've RCR'd some builds to improve upon obsolete formulas, but always ensured it still remained true to character concept FIRST. I see it like this..if you have a 'Fighter' class level, it does not mean you run around claiming you are a 'Fighter'. Mercenary, Brawler, Bouncer, Warrior, Soldier....these all are in game terms used to RP describe what your character does in a much more flavorful context. A fighter that is devout towards their deity can be considered just as much a 'holy warrior' as a paladin, minus some of the obvious mechanics to reflect such. Just like a Ranger can be considered 'Tracker, scout, woodsman, Wildlander, Hunter" it goes on and on. Still can't wrap my mind around what I would call a 'Dragonslayer' though, since its so specific to dragons.

[Deathgrowl]

Yes, you can be an elf and be an "outcast". But you can't be an elvish outcast as a bladesinger, is my point. It is too well regulated in elvish culture.

[Reckeo]

Yes, you can be an elf and be an "outcast". But you can't be an elvish outcast as a bladesinger, is my point. It is too well regulated in elvish culture.

That's what I was getting....there are ways around it, if you started as a Bladesinger first THEN went paladin, but would require extensive RP, a lot of people aren't going to accept it (for good reason). Just because you can mechanically implement it and develop an RP around it, doesn't mean it will be enjoyable, or even all that great to begin with.

Character concept first, THEN mechanics. This concept of bladesinger/paladin elf is just, too much. Half Elf would be much more acceptable, but elf, just no.

[chad878262]

Here is the issue that is not being understood...

Bladesinger requires: BAB+5, Dodge, Combat Casting, Combat Expertise and Weapon Focus (Longsword or Rapier).

Now, since you are an elf, at best you take these as your first 4 feats, thus your first level of BladeSinger comes at level 10. As soon as you take Paladin you can no longer take Bladesinger levels and Bladesinger is only really great with 10 levels. So within 3b20 you can't be a BladeSinger and a Paladin unless you are willing to give up some of the benefits of Bladesinger 7-10 at least (so no casting in light armor without spell failure and no freezing field).

So yeah, I suppose you could RP it to fit it in, but it would not be the very beneficial...Which is a good thing because I imagine Bladesinger leaving the Elven pantheon is about like a Paladin losing faith in his deity or 'falling'. Very rare and should have some negative aspects.

[Sun Wukong]

Which is why you will make use Cleric instead. You won't get charisma to saves... But with Greater Heroism and Superior Resistance you got a combined +10 to your saves, and that +6 against spells from Spellcraft skill, and another +8 against spells from Protection from Spells. So what is it in total? A meagre +24 to all saves? Do you really need the Divine Gracer?

[chad878262]

Which is why you will make use Cleric instead. You won't get charisma to saves... But with Greater Heroism and Superior Resistance you got a combined +10 to your saves, and that +6 against spells from Spellcraft skill, and another +8 against spells from Protection from Spells. So what is it in total? A meagre +24 to all saves? Do you really need the Divine Gracer?

Yep, I think that's what I said back on page 1... Doesn't stop one from using Cleric or Blackguard (for deathsinger/drow). And frankly, there are some decent domains that can help you out when building a bladesinger. If going the Longsword route Corellon will give the Weapon Focus for free, Labelas, Fenmarel or Erevan can give Luck of Hero's (Erevan can also give Darkness/Blindfight), Aerdie for Uncanny Dodge, and any of them can give Slippery Mind which is very good with high Will saves. With such a heavy feat requirement to qualify for Bladesinger grabbing a couple domain feats really helps.

[Reckeo]

The paladin elf is just a bad idea period. Even if you could explain it and played it out, you will be met with eyerolls both IC and OOC, since its counter to just about every aspect of lore that there is.

Then anyone who takes an interest in you IC will require a length explanation....just seems too much of an RP headache to me, mechanics wise as well.