Yes it can be viable, just a couple thoughts for consideration.
- DEX 25 (28 W/ +3 item) will only cost you 1 ac/ab. You can then wear padded or cloth, whatever is cheaper/ better. Put the extra points in str for more carying capacity.
- you want able learner. Rogue can allow you to max tumble, appraise, spot and umd, but not with them each costing 2 SP for each point.
- you could consider dropping 4 levels of fighter and 1 level of rogue to add swashbuckler 5 for insightful strike, replacing weapon supremacy with combat insight. You would then want to use the extra DeX points to increase int. This would give you a decent estimate cost at 30. (You will need to take swashbuckler 5 at 30 to avoid xp penalty)
Thanks chad, i was awaiting for a comment fro msuch an expert of two weapon fighting build as you are
I will try to put some points on STR, even to add one point of damage.
What feat would you suggest to swap for able learner? maybe improved 2w defense?
Anyway i don't think i want all those maximized skills, just going for max tumble and maybe umd. the rest has just to be decent
I would switch the order of Greater Weapon Specialization (Handaxe) and Melee Weapon Mastery Slashing. Why get only +2 damage when you could also get +2 AB earlier.
DR can be an annoying opponent for you and you only really have the Expose Weakness Bleeding damage to deal with it. Critical hits can help, but not really against things like undead.
Thus you might want to consider using an alternative weapon, namely light hammers or maces. You can purchase +2 light hammers with +1d4 Sonic Damage from Nashkel. (Used to at least.) Then the epic merchant does come with some epic light hammers. As for maces, I think you got the merchant in the basement of the Blushing Mermaid for some epic options. (I think.) You could take a look before you follow my advice.
Now, hand axes do come with various wonderful alternatives. Some epic variations have +1d4 Cold Damage, other come with extra physical damage and so on, but these can be harder and far more expensive to get. Thus I would recommend considering a different weapon.
Thank you Sun!
much appreciated. With your suggestions in mind i did this other build, quite different, no Expose weakness but good saves, AK damage and some good skills. What do you think?
I think it should be about as viable as the previosu build. It does lose some DR penetration from lack of Expose Weakness, but on the other hand, those higher saves do help a lot too.
" I am no longer here, the elves of the Sword Coast are just far too horrible... "
yeah.
i don't know if the high reflex save without evasion is worth enough. it helps but a bit useless, and the double expose weakness damage will be nice. On the other hand the added damages from AK may help a bit....
i think i will go for the previous build adjusted and with mace as weapon of choice.
Thanks!
I can't use the builder from work, but I got to thinking about a PTWF based warrior without sneak damage (or not enough to rely upon). Came up with the following thought that may or may not be something you would want to consider.
If you were to go F12/SB12/R3/Dervish 3 I think you could maximize your damage potential.
- Fighter gives you access to the weapon feats and lots of bonus feats.
- Swashbuckler gives you Weapon Finesse, INT to damage, Luck of Hero's and Epic Precision (allowing INT to damage to apply against Crit Immunes).
- Rogue gives you UMD, Tumble, Evasion/Expose Weakness and loads of skill points.
- Dervish gives you +1 AC, Dash feat, Spring Attack and, if willing to put 32 points in tumble you get 2/day 16 rounds of +2 attack and damage.
- Instead of Dervish you could take 3 levels of Dread Pirate which would save you two feats (gets TWF free and doesn't require Dodge). Wouldn't get +1 AC or dash feat, but you'd have 1/day 3 minutes of +1AB/Damage with no penalty when it wears off.
A bit different then your more Fighter centric build and Will saves would be worse, but even your build saves aren't good enough so you're relying on UMD for PfE and Deathward regardless. Above build would allow you to focus on getting ~25 DEX and ~20 INT, taking Combat Insight for double INT to damage. This should allow you to be pretty decent even in epics.
Damage would be : ~3.5 (hand axe) + 8 (EWS and MM) + 10 (Double INT) + 4 (EB) + 2.5 (deadly defense)= ~28 + any bonus damage on the weapons. Not amazing damage, but certainly good enough, considering your INT damage will be applied against Crit Immune enemies. This will also help when following SW's advice of using a blunt weapon against certain slashing resistant enemies, since you would lose your +8 damage from fighter feats, but still retain the double INT damage.
EDIT: just to call out this isn't meant to be advocating for changing your build, but might give some idea's of things you could do to address the low damage of a DEX based TWF build with no Sneak damage.
When going for GTWF instead of PTWF the approach is quite different, so I'll just give you some general pointers.
- You might consider Tempest, replacing Divine Champion. It would require rethinking some feats to pick up dodge/mobility/spring attack, but you would get GTWF for free. You are also losing 2 free DC feats at DC 2/4...
- You could drop Toughness and Steadfast (UMD makes Steadfast less important). The other feats to drop Two Weapon Defense and Deadly Defense. You lose a total of 4 feats (3 required feats + 2 DC feats - free GTWF). TWD is no big loss since you are gaining AC From Tempest and Deadly Defense is partially made up for with +1 damage from more STR (lower DEX requirement).
- This would allow you to leave DEX at 17, with a +3 DEX item you can wear Mithral Breastplate for best AC.
- You gain +1 AC And AB for 3 levels, +2/+2 and free Whirlwind/Tempest Whirlwind for 5 (would require dropping Rogue to 3.)
- If you look at the total you are losing 30 HP, Steadfast, 1 AC and 2.5 damage, plus a bit higher saves from Divine Champion. You are gaining +1 AB/Damage from 2 points higher STR, +2 AB/AC from Tempest, and Tempest Whirlwind. Thus your negatives are -30 HP, -1.5 dmg and saves/steadfast vs. positives of +1 AC, +3 AB and Tempest Whirlwind. UMD addresses the issue with saves/steadfast, you have plenty of HP and the 3 AB makes using CE a non-issue, even ICE should generally cause no problems with landing hits. Of course you could drop ICE and instead retain Deadly Defense, since you're getting the AC from Tempest.
- Because you have Anointed Knight you might consider dropping Able Learner. Instead, try making AK/Rogue levels intermix with Fighter levels over the course of the build to allow for maxing the skills you want. Remember you can carry up to 5 skill points over so you can avoid using SP on Fighter levels to help with maxing the ones you want on Rogue/AK levels. Even easier with Tempest as they also get Tumble.
The build is fine as you have it, these are just some things for you to consider. You might not like either of them, which is fine of course! My recommendation is to calculate out the AB, AC and Damage for your build and some different options to determine the combination you like best.
I recall Aaron had a TWF build that used Duelist since only one or two of the duelist abilities can't be used with TWF, but you'd have to ask him (and this would require using piercing weapons, I think and likely would pair well with DEX/INT vs. STR/DEX).
Might try searching the DB for some GTWF, STR based builds as I'm sure their are quite a few that you could draw inspiration from.
yes. i made a PTWF using rapiers that works pretty well. it is a SB11/D7/T5/WM7. the main thing here is to avoid fighting crit immunes. it is not as hard as it sounds. i fiddled with going WM5 and SB13 to get EP, but opted away from it as i can adjust who i fight. i went with a int/dex build obviously. i think it plays pretty easy and in the growth my AC has always been a bit higher than the CR is adjusted for. damage is also good. some of the damage boosts seem to lag behind the CR, but the damage is pretty good anyway. CI and Increased multiplier come in at 23 and 24 respectively and that is a huge jump there. before that it is a bit low for a build designed to deal damage and you start seeing the DR as early as 12-14. the will saves are dangerously low, so that goes a bit with the mob selection there.
all in all good ac/ good damage. dont miss the d6 from duelist for TWF. the extra attacks at high BAB is more than making up for it. will save is bad and skill points are high, but dont have alot of places to put them.
the build is not very exciting. i wont lie. kind of fun, but when you select your enemies, it is pretty easy level.
