Caster Bard - Stormsinger

[mrm3ntalist]

Dragon Disciple is a perfect class for sorcerers. Improves on DCs, Defenses and utility for for blaster Sorcs and Caster Sorcs. Its an open for most ( because small Alignment restrictions) version of palemaster and then some. It has great synergy with classes such as AM and FM.

Dude, I am certain you did the numbers. I am also certain that bards can solo all content on this server, the WM with the 100-160 damage cannot. There is no theorycraft. Bards can solo the server, all of it ( but the white dragon ). I dont have time to make you a video as well.

[Tsidkenu]

There is no theorycraft. Bards can solo the server, all of it.

[chad878262]

Yep, bards solo balor naked.... try that with weapon master/ frenzied berserker.

[ARHicks00]

Dragon Disciple is a perfect class for sorcerers. Improves on DCs, Defenses and utility for for blaster Sorcs and Caster Sorcs. Its an open for most ( because small Alignment restrictions) version of palemaster and then some. It has great synergy with classes such as AM and FM.

Dude, I am certain you did the numbers. I am also certain that bards can solo all content on this server, the WM with the 100-160 damage cannot. There is no theorycraft. Bards can solo the server, all of it ( but the white dragon ). I dont have time to make you a video as well.

1. Quote, "Then don't add it at all. Same Dragon Disciple as you could just gotten rid of it instead having it in. None of the nerfs made any sense as from my view the nerfs attempted to counter powergaming and broke the class kind like what happen with Solar Channeler. It just got made worse. If a class is too powerful than don't add it. Even BG limits you can make overpowered builds, it doesn't powergaming, it simply shifts the power to another group or the exploitation of another group. That's why I find a lot of the nerfs unnecessary."

What part was I wrong on?

2. Haven't tried to solo the whole server, but my shield bashing pure fighter was putting down vampires easy. (Level 14 to 16) I never got all his equipment, but his AC would have been roughly the same as a bard. When he ran through orcs (level 14), he did a lot better than my current cleric. (Level 20) I won't say, the fighter can solo the whole server, but he could solo enough. If I ever get the patience I may do that.

[mrm3ntalist]

1. Quote, "Then don't add it at all. Same Dragon Disciple as you could just gotten rid of it instead having it in. None of the nerfs made any sense as from my view the nerfs attempted to counter powergaming and broke the class kind like what happen with Solar Channeler. It just got made worse. If a class is too powerful than don't add it. Even BG limits you can make overpowered builds, it doesn't powergaming, it simply shifts the power to another group or the exploitation of another group. That's why I find a lot of the nerfs unnecessary."

What part was I wrong on?

All of it. DD gives nothing to melee or gish builds. Absolutely nothing, contrary to the version you speak about which helps builds with feats with high ability prereqs such as EDM.

This version of DD gives casters
- Caster progression 7/10
- High Fort saves
- 6 hit die
- A detection skill
- Paralyze immunity ( immunity to bigbies for example )
- Bonus AC
- An undispelable energy immunity
- a damaging spell for times per day depending on CHA

It improves on every aspect of caster sorcerer. Every single one. The version you speak about, does not and on the contrary it is used mostly for melee builds.

Like you said, you havent familiarized yourself with the whole server content. When you do, i believe you will realize what i am talking about.

Finally, I am glad you enjoy playing a melee build. They might not be as powerful as some caster builds but for me are more fun to play. I would play a WM over a bard for example but not because it is more powerful ( it is not) but because it is fun for me.

[Hammer_Song]

A WM was my main for years, I had every trick in the book, the best fighter items on the server, he’d crit one handed for ~110, two handed for 180 on a crit range of 13-20. He was a beast with full UMD capacity.
He got chewed up by all big bosses (some minor ones he could beat but they burned his consumables).

He didn’t win too many pvp’s either - as someone said above, they’re too easy to shut down. I once got told that if you’re a one-trick pony and the crowd doesn’t clap, you’re (do-me). WM’ers are very much one trick ponies.

I now play a monk. They dominate WM’s in every way. I have played a bard on this server to high epics, maybe 28. They dominate a WM on every level. This is NOT theorycrafting as you put it, this is 10 years of BGTSCC experience. When someone posts a video of soloing the Balor without gear, I’d say that Bards are not weak or midlevel, they are an insanely powerful melee force.
My old bard could beat bosses (that my WM couldn’t) without even getting hit, without using any consumables - he’d just walk in no prep and win. My fighter couldn’t dream of doing that. My bard had ordinary gear at best, my WM was literally wearing tens of millions of gold worth in gear. He was bristling with wands, scrolls and clickies. He was built to have high saves - without buffs he had 38/32/33, which gives an indication of gear level and he didn’t give up anything to get those saves. He was built well and he was played well and with experience (meta-knowledge). The bard still made him look pedestrian against epic content.

This isn’t theorycrafting, just years worth of BG fact.

Have you ever played a bard into epics on BG ARHicks? Do we need to trot out M3nt beating the servers 2nd hardest boss with a naked bard video again??? Do you have a video of a naked WM beating the balor? If not, go and make one and we’ll all eat humble pie.

[Zanniej]

Caster bards is a topic thats has been brought up in the qc forums. It is something we will look into, once we finish some other things in the pipeline. There wont be unlimited spell usage though and it will be something that will benefit caster bards explicitly.

All right, I think this topic has run it's course, and the above can be taken as conclusion I think.

Should anyone think differently, then feel free to let me know, and I'll consider reopening the topic.