Battle Rage gets -2 to Chr?

[Tekill]

I have a bit of a problem with my Battle Rager.
He obtained the Gruff "ability" and now he has -2 to his chr plus the minus to his chr skills.
So does the BR get -2 to CHR plus + -4 to chr based skills?

Thats way too harsh. Especially to the UMD skill which as we know is very important.

I also found a Skin Crawler bracers that adds damage resistance. Doea anyone know if it stacks with barb/feat DR?
It also lowers chr by two so I guess that means I would have a chr of 2....which I don't want to play. I can't equip this item do to alignment restriction but I thought it might have to do with this -2 debut to chr I have....I'm confused.

[mrm3ntalist]

I have a bit of a problem with my Battle Rager.
He obtained the Gruff "ability" and now he has -2 to his chr plus the minus to his chr skills.
So does the BR get -2 to CHR plus + -4 to chr based skills?

Thats way too harsh. Especially to the UMD skill which as we know is very important.

Yes, BR gets both the reductions

I also found a Skin Crawler bracers that adds damage resistance. Doea anyone know if it stacks with barb/feat DR?
It also lowers chr by two so I guess that means I would have a chr of 2....which I don't want to play. I can't equip this item do to alignment restriction but I thought it might have to do with this -2 debut to chr I have....I'm confused.

What type of damage resistance. A percentage of any type will stack. If it is a fixed number, it does not.

[Tekill]

The item says DR 2. So physical damage?
So I assume it's like the DR that barbs/DD get.
Just not sure if it stacks with thier DR

So atm my chr is 4...will be 2 if those bracers stack with my barbs DR and I use them.

-2 attribute penalty is not mentioned in the BR description. Add that -4 to chr checks and boom the class is broken.
Overkill
BR are psychos but they are not literally rabid dogs.

[Theodore01]

I also found a Skin Crawler bracers that adds damage resistance. Doea anyone know if it stacks with barb/feat DR?

It does not stack.
There is however a bracer at the epic BG vendor that has 2 dam.reduction (blud,pierc,slash) - that one does stack. (Havent tried it with a Barb., but with an adm. armor)

[mrm3ntalist]

The DR-X ( where X a fixed number ) does not stack with the DR/X from classes. However any items with a % DR does stack. The rule is the % is applied first, then the fixed number.

In this case, the DR from the item wont stack with dr from the barbarian

[Tekill]

Okay that clears things up re the DR. Thank you.

And now my rant....

The penalty from gruff is too extreme. Usually "abilities" give a bonus sometimes for a trade off. This is not only an ability score penalty but huge skill penalties. and what do you get in exchange but a f'n +2 to intimidate! C'mon!!!
Before you comment on this I would like you to seriously compare this ability score penalty with other classes that also get ability score penalties and compare what is being traded between each. Then come back and argue that this is fair.

Plus the CHR penalty needs to be written into the class description please.

The way I read the ability when building my character was reading it as +2 to intimidate then -4 for other social CHR abilities. It made sense. I was too much of a potty mouth to be a diplomat. Or I was going to be to Blunt with people to bluff them. Not a great ability, but I thought it fit the class.

Being Gruff should not affect UMD. Am I being too mean to the wand and so can not figure out how to use it?!

We are Gruff, but we cant Taunt?! Now that is just plain contradictory!

And this is what bothers me the most. I have known many people that were Gruff and were still very charismatic. I think dwarves are at their most charming when they are being gruff. In fact I would not follow any dwarf into battle unless they were gruff!

I personally see Battle Ragers as more of a cross between barbarians and fighters. Dwarven warriors that specialize in going berserk instead of using disciplined. I understand there was a demand to create a dwarven class for the Thibbledorf Pwent lovers out there. But it typecasts the Battle Rager into some sort very narrow shallow aspect of a Gutbuster. It takes away any range of other types of Battle Ragers out there.
Because there are other kinds of Battle Ragers out there. And there are other ways to RP them. I am sure there can be a happy medium between Balin son of Fundin and Thibbledorf Pwent.

They should be Gruff, and chaotic...hence the reason for an alignment restriction. They should lack social skills. But why do they all have to be utter social morons, or ugly, or extra smelly, on top of it all?
The answer is, they dont.
They are warriors, they are dwarves. THE CHR IS LOW ENOUGH PEOPLE!

Yet they do not even know how to rage- Im just confounded....

That was my rant, I feel better. Now I can go and RCR my dwarf into something other than a Gutbuster.

[Steve]

.
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Battlerager
"...poor personal hygiene."

http://dnd.arkalseif.info/classes/battl ... index.html

"Gruff (Ex): Battleragers are known to be rude, uncouth, and violent. They suffer a —4 penalty on all Charisma ability checks AND Charisma-based skill checks, except for Intimidate checks. Battleragers receive a +2 bonus on all Intimidate checks."

Magic doesn't like a stink...didn't ya know?

[metaquad4]

Uh. . .you are complaining about an effective -5 to CHA checks on a 5 level PRC that gets:

*A 1d4 Damage Shield
*Extended Rage
*Powerful Charge
*Dire Charge
*Great Cleave (FB qualifications synergy)
*+2 AC
*Immunity to Fear
*Tumble as a class skill
*Listen as a class skill

Of all the downsides, -5 CHA checks is super relaxed for that loaded of a class. By 30 you'll bypass restrictions regardless, you just need a little more into UMD.

---
DR/- from items doesn't stack with DR/- from feats. DR/- has certain odd stacking rules.

[Tekill]

I am complaining about a minus two to charisma ability score penalty to a PRC.

It is a PRC that I should have no problem using CHR as a dump stat. They are Battle Rager's, so therefore they should have low CHR.
So first thing I should do is clear our that CHR.
But if I did that with a mountain dwarf, I'm looking at a CHR of 4.

It is not what I wanted for the personality of the Battle Rager I had in mind, RP wise. I mean, how do you RP a CHR 4 anyways?
Perhaps like some sort of schizophrenic, rabid, wild animal?

For me, that is too low, and I do not want have to put points into my dump stat just so that I can make the character more viable.

But things sort of worked it out in the end, as I think I created a pretty cool build by swapping out BR with figher levels instead. I have a CHR of 6 (its still too low, but I need the ability points for feat requirements). I just make him salty, rude, crass, volatile...like a battle rager but he just wont be a battle rager.

I lose out on about 3 ac, fear immune, some cool charges, and some feats that are more for flavour.
A necessary sacrifice because a minus 2 to an ability score on top of skill penalties to that same stat is as I said earlier, overkill.
Unrealistic. - schizo, rabid animal, unrealisic...