Character biographies: Incentives?

[Ashenie]

Hello there,

And thank you for giving thoughts to this aspect of roleplay. It is a great perspective.

So I come to the community to ask:
What would encourage you to write a biography for approval?

Nothing. I do not believe any reward would make me write a whole biography. I do it for character development if I have to. Some do it because they genuily feel like to share elements about their characters, other can use it a way to take personnal notes and not forget about details roleplay throughout months or years. My own personnal belief is that a biography is something dear for players who wish to use this aspect to deepen their characters. It is one mean, but not the only one.

How could biographies be supported?

Inclusion of Biographies in plots
This might be one of the greatest way to reward a biography, if it found some inclusion in ongoing plots. I have seen it done a few times in a year, with sometimes even Dungeon Masters asking to send them personnal details about our characters (Goals, fears, feelings) that they could include in the long run of the plot. I find it very interesting, especially if those plots can, as side effect, help a character devlopment.

Permission of playing unusual characters
Having unusual characters with things that would require a Dungeon Master's assistance, for exemple to have a certain race worshipping foreign pantheons that they would not normally worship, or caracters with unusual height/weight, or whose background is deeply tied to a lore event. I believe this could give insight to Dungeon Masters, and help player create unique characters.

Skills & Feats
As a mechanical reward that could be given, I believe some feats could be welcome as long as they are not too special :
- Extra Background traits (Such as Devout, Tale teller... etc. You may choose only one when creating a character.)
- Extra Background feats (Silver Tongue, Artist.. etc)
- Skill Focus feats (That would not be required for a class)
- Extra Language
The entire list could be up to debate as well. I believe the feats should be rather chosen by the DM Team than requested.

Support from Dungeon Master to craft unique items
Having the help of Dungeon Master or even be able to make request to the art team to have either unique art, design, or effect can help those biographies feel special. With a family crest, an old armor, a pair of gloves etc... It that is to be done, the possible enchantments and properties should be listed beforehand.


My only concern is that such support may take a lot of time from the Dungeon Masters.

Thank you for reading,

Ashenie

[MrSmith]

Two points.

If concerning new Pc, then crossing the first five levels so character can actually do some minor adventuring.

Second, something that would support the background. Either some small random happening concerning some things tied to the biography (aka someone would list he is an outcast and wanted somewhere, and one day bounty hunters would come to get him).
Or an item that would be tied to the story as a heirloom.

I actually really like both of these ideas. I suppose as a player you could make the item with the DMFI tool, like your grandfather's sword from the orc wars, but having that be blessed by a DM as legitimate would go a long way toward fostering RP.

I use to play on another server... At one point, the DM team sought to incentivize the retirement of well-established characters. In exchange, the DM team made a customized item using the character's backstory that could be used on a new character. I received an item for retiring an old salt. It wasn't the most powerful piece of kit on the server by any stretch, but the DM did an outstanding job of capturing the essence of my character... and as a result, I still remember the item.

I agree tieing an item to a character's bio/backstory should be a very powerful incentive because the said item is one-of-a-kind.

Cheers!

[EasternCheesE]

Hello there,

And thank you for giving thoughts to this aspect of roleplay. It is a great perspective.

So I come to the community to ask:
What would encourage you to write a biography for approval?

Nothing. I do not believe any reward would make me write a whole biography. I do it for character development if I have to. Some do it because they genuily feel like to share elements about their characters, other can use it a way to take personnal notes and not forget about details roleplay throughout months or years. My own personnal belief is that a biography is something dear for players who wish to use this aspect to deepen their characters. It is one mean, but not the only one.

How could biographies be supported?

Inclusion of Biographies in plots
This might be one of the greatest way to reward a biography, if it found some inclusion in ongoing plots. I have seen it done a few times in a year, with sometimes even Dungeon Masters asking to send them personnal details about our characters (Goals, fears, feelings) that they could include in the long run of the plot. I find it very interesting, especially if those plots can, as side effect, help a character devlopment.

Permission of playing unusual characters
Having unusual characters with things that would require a Dungeon Master's assistance, for exemple to have a certain race worshipping foreign pantheons that they would not normally worship, or caracters with unusual height/weight, or whose background is deeply tied to a lore event. I believe this could give insight to Dungeon Masters, and help player create unique characters.

Skills & Feats
As a mechanical reward that could be given, I believe some feats could be welcome as long as they are not too special :
- Extra Background traits (Such as Devout, Tale teller... etc. You may choose only one when creating a character.)
- Extra Background feats (Silver Tongue, Artist.. etc)
- Skill Focus feats (That would not be required for a class)
- Extra Language
The entire list could be up to debate as well. I believe the feats should be rather chosen by the DM Team than requested.

Support from Dungeon Master to craft unique items
Having the help of Dungeon Master or even be able to make request to the art team to have either unique art, design, or effect can help those biographies feel special. With a family crest, an old armor, a pair of gloves etc... It that is to be done, the possible enchantments and properties should be listed beforehand.


My only concern is that such support may take a lot of time from the Dungeon Masters.

Thank you for reading,

Ashenie

I pretty much agree. If someone supports a bio and PC build, there can be pretty much stuff given that is not straight beneficial to a PC.
Say, normally, such feats like improved unarmed fighting is not granted. But if PC build is full wizard with no transmutation focus who drinks a lot and brawls a lot, it doesn't hurt and so on. If DMs have time to check and then see the PC in game to make sure build matches what described, they can have a big freedom in giving even combat-related feats that will server only flavor for this build, depending on build concept.

[Aspect of Sorrow]

As nice as it is to have something visually unique it's a bigger preference that the haks aren't inflated with content that only one person can use.

[DaloLorn]

As nice as it is to have something visually unique it's a bigger preference that the haks aren't inflated with content that only one person can use.

Unique items would most likely not have custom visuals beyond the scope of what is currently achievable via the appearance kit. (And I'd argue that the owner of the item could do their own customization on that front!)

As such, putting them into the HAKs seems excessive when the DM can assemble the item on the fly.

[Aspect of Sorrow]

As such, putting them into the HAKs seems excessive when the DM can assemble the item on the fly.

The statement is toward suggestion of "custom art" which would require hak inflation.

[bharring]

I love the idea of heirloom items. But dislike it being a payout for fleshing out a backstory.

I'd rather "heirloom" style items be just another tool in DMs' belts.

Some characters would make sense to have a heirloom item (father's armor, teacher's hammer, etc). If a DM sees a backstory where such an item would benefit the RP, then I'm all for the DM giving that item. But not as an expected result, or a regular process.

First, not all characters would be equally impacted by heirloom items. For every story of a character carrying their father's sword, there's a story of a character with no such treasure. Having each character have that "one heirloom item" would be weird.

Second, if it's expected that the reward for a background is a heirloom item, it'll bias backgrounds on this server to things centered around heirloom items. I like the broad diversity of backgrounds we have now.

Third, I'm a big fan of backgrounds, and my main character has a long-written background on the forums here, but that's not everyone. We'll get the best backgrounds from people who want to write a background. Adding too strong a bonus for written backgrounds will encourage some to write backgrounds, and thus get into RP, that otherwise wouldn't. But it's likely encourage many more to fill out a pro forma background just to get the benefits (and any rules to ensure the backgrounds are "good enough" will discourage the less apt/skilled at it). So good backgrounds would be drowned out by throwaway drivel.

What I'd do is:
-Have an intentionally nominal explicit reward for background. Something like 1k gold and/or 1k XP.
-Socialize (and actually practice) involving backgrounds in RP - both player/player and player/dm interactions.
-Accept that DMs will need to make judgement calls on being more generous to players based on backgrounds and RP

The nominal amount gives a real incentive to do the background for RP reasons, while not being enough to make it worthwhile for those who really don't want to RP/create their background. 1k gold/xp at level 1 is quite a gamechanger if you're new, or your RP doesn't include muling/optimized consumables/etc. But it's not enough to make powerleveling easier by throwing out a meaningless background for a throwaway or RCR toon.

The real incentive for background (and better RP) becomes the increased/improved RP with other players/DMs. If you write up your background, you're likely to get more DM and player interaction. That's huge. But as it is, DM interaction is rare. There are only so many DMs. I get into their events/etc less than once a month. And they have only so much time. We can't expect them to read through every character's background. This is an area other players can really shine - we spend a lot more time interacting with eachother than with DMs.

And finally, the need for fairness can sometimes clash with the creative/storytelling process. Heirloom items and other rewards for RP reasons do need to be balanced against fairness (no, you shouldn't give a +5 sword to that new toon just because his backstory says he has one). If DMs start handing out heirloom items like candy, there'll be some complaints about fairness ("He got a +2 hammer, but I only got a +1 axe!"). When that happens, we can either tighten up the balance, or accept that that's the cost of better storytelling.

[Winterborne]

I always write biographies for my characters, often very long, in-depth ones.

I -never- post them to the forums because of the sheer amount of metagaming around them I have personally experienced and because I would rather people roleplay rather than read a post to get to know my characters.

There is likely no incentive that could convince me it's something I should do again. I am always willing to talk about it privately with a DM if needed, or to clarify points revealed in RP privately with another player, but as far as writing and publishing a biography again for all to view, I have no current plans to ever do this again.

Beyond metagaming concerns however, I have also come to feel that it's like having the ending of a book spoiled to read someone else's biography before you begin playing with them. I find people are less inclined to engage in the basic "day to day" or "campfire" style RP of getting to know someone if they already know what that person is all about, whether they do this consciously or unconsciously.

[Heretic]

I'll add my two cents:

I'm fine with the idea. To me the gold and xp aren't much of an incentive, the incentive for me is when aspects of a character's bio are incorporated into DM run events. I didn't (nor did anyone else) take the time to write my char's bio just to have it sit on a shelf never to be referenced by DMs, especially if these characters make the effort to shape their normal RP around their bio. Should a DM expect to interact with specific characters they can simply pull their bios in advance and determine if they want to shape their plotlines around aspect's of those character's background.

Also just as an aside there are numerous of bios that have not been approved/endorsed for whatever reason. I've seen character bios receive public blessing from DMs and others (like my own) that still sit awaiting a public approval. Should a player still awaiting approval re-petition the staff for DM approval of their bios?

[Ghost]

I always write biographies for my characters, often very long, in-depth ones.

I -never- post them to the forums because of the sheer amount of metagaming around them I have personally experienced and because I would rather people roleplay rather than read a post to get to know my characters.

There is likely no incentive that could convince me it's something I should do again. I am always willing to talk about it privately with a DM if needed, or to clarify points revealed in RP privately with another player, but as far as writing and publishing a biography again for all to view, I have no current plans to ever do this again.

Beyond metagaming concerns however, I have also come to feel that it's like having the ending of a book spoiled to read someone else's biography before you begin playing with them. I find people are less inclined to engage in the basic "day to day" or "campfire" style RP of getting to know someone if they already know what that person is all about, whether they do this consciously or unconsciously.

We would allow biographies to be sent in to the DM team and not posted publically of course. Maybe a redacted version publically to make clear one has been made and approved.

[Anchor]

I have always worked on bio’s for my PCs. Its a personal joy of mine. I really dont have an opinion on gold or xp awards as I think both are fine, but (and this is if the template remains the same) if the RP hooks/goals of a bio could be acted upon, even in a minor way, I feel like that would be a great reward.

[gedweyignasia]

I liked the system we had years ago where you get 2k gold or xp for following a template. Especially as a newer player, it felt worthwhile to me.

Bio from the first char I played here, first month playing:
viewtopic.php?f=153&t=37868

Bio for the third char I played here, 8 months after joining:
viewtopic.php?f=153&t=42342

Did a bio for my 5th character, too. It's been pretty much every other character, even with just 2k gold/xp rewarded. They're not novels; the characters got fleshed out a lot while I was playing them, but the biographies gave me a concrete backstory to work with and made me think about who my character is and what shaped them to be that way. The best motivation I could be given to put more into a bio is if a DM would help me explore it; I had planned for my first character to want to revisit her homeland and get revenge.

[DM SummerBreeze]

Hello there,

And thank you for giving thoughts to this aspect of roleplay. It is a great perspective.

So I come to the community to ask:
What would encourage you to write a biography for approval?

Nothing. I do not believe any reward would make me write a whole biography. I do it for character development if I have to. Some do it because they genuily feel like to share elements about their characters, other can use it a way to take personnal notes and not forget about details roleplay throughout months or years. My own personnal belief is that a biography is something dear for players who wish to use this aspect to deepen their characters. It is one mean, but not the only one.

How could biographies be supported?

Inclusion of Biographies in plots
This might be one of the greatest way to reward a biography, if it found some inclusion in ongoing plots. I have seen it done a few times in a year, with sometimes even Dungeon Masters asking to send them personnal details about our characters (Goals, fears, feelings) that they could include in the long run of the plot. I find it very interesting, especially if those plots can, as side effect, help a character devlopment.

Permission of playing unusual characters
Having unusual characters with things that would require a Dungeon Master's assistance, for exemple to have a certain race worshipping foreign pantheons that they would not normally worship, or caracters with unusual height/weight, or whose background is deeply tied to a lore event. I believe this could give insight to Dungeon Masters, and help player create unique characters.

Skills & Feats
As a mechanical reward that could be given, I believe some feats could be welcome as long as they are not too special :
- Extra Background traits (Such as Devout, Tale teller... etc. You may choose only one when creating a character.)
- Extra Background feats (Silver Tongue, Artist.. etc)
- Skill Focus feats (That would not be required for a class)
- Extra Language
The entire list could be up to debate as well. I believe the feats should be rather chosen by the DM Team than requested.

Support from Dungeon Master to craft unique items
Having the help of Dungeon Master or even be able to make request to the art team to have either unique art, design, or effect can help those biographies feel special. With a family crest, an old armor, a pair of gloves etc... It that is to be done, the possible enchantments and properties should be listed beforehand.


My only concern is that such support may take a lot of time from the Dungeon Masters.

Thank you for reading,

Ashenie

You worded this so well. I personally also see it this way.

[Azroth]

On my end it's well known that the only real incentive was making sure someone was proof reading, as we all make a mistake when writing these things up some days. I even used to have a player whom I came to BGtSCC with years back whom I sent my stuff too in a google dock way back when so he can make spelling corrections, etc.

Then hope the team would then make lore corrections. Later on I also will admit I did learn that the staff is not perfect either in this way, as for example, at least lore wise Luskan is very Xenophobic and only human based city. But that's another story, but gives an idea regardless of what I am ever looking for. And still better than nothing.

[Most Horrible]

So I'll give you a little bit of insight into the numbers we've been looking at for XP/gold rewards: We were thinking somewhere between 10000 to 20000. The current draft is 20000. I hope this gives you some ideas about what kind of standards we are expecting in biographies.

For context, if 20000 xp was given to a level 1 character (ECL 0), they would be 1000xp away from level 7. If given to a level 20 character, it would bring them to level 21. So we're talking a fairly significant reward here.

...

...

Nothing is set in stone. I'm not promising anything here.

Whether one looks at that 10000 to 20000 experience points or gold as a reward for writing an in character bio, the reward itself would turn me off from the very idea of writing a character biography in the first place. The reason is as follows: I actually like the low level content of the server far more than I do when it comes to the mid or high level content. It is just the unfortunate tendency of this server that the higher the area CR grows, the more consumables one has to acquire and use. I am happy when the content can be bested with a stack of healing kits, and less happy when the content requires bunch of potions/wands/scrolls to best, on a non-spellcasting character. I am sure there are players who feel the opposite, but that doesn't change my personal preference on this particular matter.

And then there is the matter of time, because whenever rewards are offered, it also comes with a certain set of minimum requirements to meet, a format to follow, and so on. For example, I do not believe the stock NWN2 character biography would earn one that reward. Thus by the time I would actually finish a character biography, I could have taken a level 1 character to level 7 or so, and acquired something in the range of 20-120k in gold. So why endure the tedium of writing a character biography, when I could actually spend that time on the server having fun?

As for epic levels, the experience reward is more enticing, but not enticing enough to actually make me want to write a character biography. After all, at level 20 or so, just about any character could do the weekly quests relatively quickly and earn something like 10k experience a week. Running the weekly quests takes much less time than writing a proper character biography, while a single loot run can earn you the same amoung in gold. And once again, why should I write a character biography when doing the weekly quests or doing a loot run is still more fun than writing down something that no one will ever read? Not to mention that with epic characters, there is the chance of acquiring epic rewards, and so on.

Which brings us to the other suggestions that were recently suggested:

Inclusion of Biographies in plots

It wouldn't be the first server who does that, and it wouldn't be the first time when players get offended that their characters were not involved, while characters of some others players were. Not to mention that I would personally consider a character biography to be a thing of the past, already resolved past, and would be rather annoyed if a Dungeon Master were to suddenly impose an event based on the biography. Someone else might like it though. So perhaps the character biography should also come with some manner of consent form whether players wish it to be DM 'plot' material or not, and I say it as someone who would laugh at consent forms presented by some tabletop rule settings.

Skills & Feats

And I like to crunch numbers, and if one can indeed acquire unspecified number additional extra Background Traits and Feats, in addition to Skill Focus feats, you will be providing mechanical advantage to whoever dares to ask for as much as possible. It certainly would be a considerable incentive to write a character biography, but once again, it will eventually raise such questions as: Why did that player get so many goodies while my character did not? Why did that other player get mechanical advantage, while I did not? Anyhow, extra languages are fine, and perhaps the 'language' related Background Traits could be given without truly rocking the boat, so a character could be a Wild Child from Cormyr or something. And, in the past, the dungeon masters have given some characters additional languages, and at one time one my characters actually got around seven additional languages. (It was a long time ago.)

Support from Dungeon Master to craft unique items

Appearence Kit, allows you to change item appearances. And in your inventory, you have something called DMFI tool, if you place it on a quickbar slot, you can click on it and use it on an item in order to rename the item and you can also add a custom item description while you are at it.

Anyhow, there will always be players who will not want to write character biographies, unless the rewards offered make it plain unfair not to write one, and that in turn might not be the most desirable thing for the server.