Palemaster and lore religion

[mrm3ntalist]

Pale master now has a lore religion prereq. Is it by design that while Wizards get lore religion as a class skill, sorcerers do not, meaning that sorcs cannot qualify for the PRC till level 14?

[Ghost]

Yes. There's RP/Lore reasons for it.

Here's the PnP requirements (note that we didn't add the skill focus requirement, nor the spells):

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And the reason why it is Lore: Religion and not Lore: Arcana is that it is Religion that involves knowledge about undead:

Hidden: show

So there are good reasons for why this is the requirement. If you are asking about why wizard gets all the lore skills and sorcerer does not, that is also easily explained: Wizards are as a base class scholars - studious and academic. Knowledge is everything. It is knowledge and reason that lets them learn magic. By contrast, a sorcerer's magic comes from emotion and instinct. That is - from the basics of these two classes. Of course a sorcerer can become a scholar (for example, picking up the Arcane Scholar class, in which case knowledge religion is opened) or otherwise go religious paths if that is in their interest (shadow adept is highly religious, for example)

[mrm3ntalist]

Are you guys saying that we are blindly following pnp? Because there are a million other examples where - especially regarding skills - a different path than pnp was taken

SD - DEX 19
Hierrophant - Wis 19 and my favorite Lore nature
Sarol'Vendruk - (Everything different compared to pnp with non canon changes happening even today )
Dervish - no mobility prereq
Champion of Corellon - additional weapons
Blood MAgus - No great Fortitude prereq
Thief Acrobat- ... all wrong compared to pnp ( this PRC is my favorite )
Hospitaler - all wrong
Invisible Blade - no sense motive
The list goes on

TLDR
Basically 85% of the PRCs have different prereqs compared to pnp. That is only the prereqs because if we go into class feats then it is a whole another level of "copium". Is there a shit list with classes/builds that we want to delete or we just pretend to follow pnp with everything?

[Hawke]

I poked through some classes that could help with this.

Thaumaturge, blackguard, arcane scholar, shadow adept, bard, harper mage, arcane trickster, frost mage (weird ac interaction though),.

Lots of options I guess. But it is a change to builds.

[mrm3ntalist]

I poked through some classes that could help with this.

Thaumaturge, blackguard, arcane scholar, shadow adept, bard, harper mage, arcane trickster, frost mage (weird ac interaction though),.

Lots of options I guess. But it is a change to builds.

Almost all prcs are different. I am just too lazy to list them all.

[Ghost]

Are you guys saying that we are blindly following pnp? Because there are a million other examples where - especially regarding skills - a different path than pnp was taken

SD - DEX 19
Hierrophant - Wis 19 and my favorite Lore nature
Sarol'Vendruk - (Everything different compared to pnp with non canon changes happening even today )
Dervish - no mobility prereq
Champion of Corellon - additional weapons
Blood MAgus - No great Fortitude prereq
Thief Acrobat- ... all wrong compared to pnp ( this PRC is my favorite )
Hospitaler - all wrong
Invisible Blade - no sense motive
The list goes on

TLDR
Basically 85% of the PRCs have different prereqs compared to pnp. That is only the prereqs because if we go into class feats then it is a whole another level of "copium". Is there a (#2) list with classes/builds that we want to delete or we just pretend to follow pnp with everything?

I won't argue with any of this. I wish you'd be a little bit less passive-aggressive about it, however.

[Planehopper]

A little tired of the condescending, passive-aggressive stuff. Make suggesitons. Ask questions. Keep it productive and do it nicely, or take a break from the forums.

Consider this a general warning that this thread needs to stay civil.

[Rhifox]

I'm not sure how anyone believes that a class that had only non-good and 3rd level arcane spells as a requirement was appropriate. It was a freely available choice for 90% of casters.

There will be backgrounds that offer lore religion as a class skill. They were meant to be included in the patch, but had to be delayed. They'll be available in a week or two. You'll be able to just take one of those backgrounds to get religion as a class skill.

[mrm3ntalist]

I'm not sure how anyone believes that a class that had only non-good and 3rd level arcane spells as a requirement was appropriate. It was a freely available choice for 90% of casters.

There will be backgrounds that offer lore religion as a class skill. They were meant to be included in the patch, but had to be delayed. They'll be available in a week or two. You'll be able to just take one of those backgrounds to get religion as a class skill.

That is true. Palemaster has very easy qualifications. Is this something that applies only to sorcerers though? They already get PRCs one level later ( compared to wizards when 3rd lvl spells are required ) but qualifying for it at level 14 compared to 5 is a whole different story, especially with the 3B20 (non pnp ) rule in mind. Even more so considering that most - if not all old prcs - are completely different than PnP.