Epic Toughness feat and Epic Resilience

[blacksoft]

I saw that there was some discussion on forums that getting epic resilience is difficult as it requires one heroic feat and two epic feats.

Suggestion:

Give epic toughness 50 HP instead of current 30 hp.

Let second obtained Toughness feat from whatever source be converted to epic toughness. There are classes that get toughness for free, so if was to pick up toughness from level-up or a class then levels in a class that gives toughness, it would become epic toughness instead.

[Steve]

PCs roll a lot of 1s. Imho, being immune to that possibility should require a steep cost.

[Theodore01]

PCs roll a lot of 1s. Imho, being immune to that possibility should require a steep cost.

well spoken

[blacksoft]

PCs roll a lot of 1s. Imho, being immune to that possibility should require a steep cost.

Agreed.

Currently, epic toughness have no worth on their own. Increasing to 50 would give them worth.

Secondly, being able to convert toughness into epic toughness naturally fits idea of character progression. Same way I think uncanny dodge should convert to improved version from another class and that classes with uncanny dodge should stack improved uncanny dodge levels.

If you don't jive with that conceptually, that's fine. My post was more along the ramifications of my suggestions as I believe them to be stand-alone ideas without needing to come on to allow easier access to epic resilience.

[DiceyCZ]

There's an obvious problem with this kind of approach. Epic toughness being an epic feat, with this kind of approach not only would it be possible to have epic feat before epic levels but it would also allow more epic feats to be taken. It also begs the question, if I am planning to get a class that grands toughness why would I take it on levelup.

[blacksoft]

There's an obvious problem with this kind of approach. Epic toughness being an epic feat, with this kind of approach not only would it be possible to have epic feat before epic levels but it would also allow more epic feats to be taken. It also begs the question, if I am planning to get a class that grands toughness why would I take it on levelup.

Well, it is possible to take multiple classes that have toughness. Swashbuckler has epic feat. So we do see that epic feats can exist before 20. Also, it's only more health and either had to take a feat for first toughness or take two classes with toughness. So there is an opportunity cost somewhere.

[Steve]

Currently, epic toughness have no worth on their own. Increasing to 50 would give them worth.

30 extra HP is not worthless. One way to look at it is that 30 HP is 2 pts Constitution, which can require 2 Epic Feats!!

Would I like 20 more XP for when taking Epic Toughness? Sure I would. However, I only take Epic Toughness to get Epic Resilience. Thus, the price is paid (hell, I'd build with it even if Epic toughness granted 0 HP, since Epic Resilience is so frickin' good). But that's just my take on it.

[Dread Omega]

I'll sign on to these changes and sing songs to advance the cause if Epic Dodge also adds 10 dodge AC!

(You probably don't really want me to sing. The last time I did the whole east coast of the US lost power for a day).