Deflection AC on gloves/bracers does not transfer to Shapechange forms

[Steve]

As per general Polymorphing mechanics:

Natural, Deflection, and Armor AC from items merge.

However, especially for Polymorphing—and unlike Wild Shape / Shifter Shapes—:

Glove weapon enchantments only carry over to Wild Shape and Shifter Wild Shape forms. Same with Vampiric Regeneration from gloves/bracers.

Unfortunately, as it seems, if Deflection AC is on gloves/bracers, this will not transfer (merge) to the Polymorph/Shapechange form. I'm assuming here that Hand Slot is totally "blocked out" in the Code, and well, shouldn't be for AC (nor for other Enhancements like AB/AB and vamp regen...but that's another story that I'm not sure has any interested ears atm).

Can the AC transfer from glove/bracers be fixed? Cheers.

And if there IS interest, let's talk about all the other gloves/bracers bonuses that should/could transfer over!!!

[Ewe]

It's a homebrew thing, in truth no item props should merge.

[Steve]

It's a homebrew thing, in truth no item props should merge.

That doesn’t help Dae!

[Ewe]

What I'm saying is if there is a "bug" here, and I'm not even sure there is, then it would be to remove merging not to add more slots to it.

A lot of the "bugs" lately have not been bugs but feature requests or balance changing. As such it's not a simple process to go and make a change for it. Would need approval.

[Steve]

What I'm saying is if there is a "bug" here, and I'm not even sure there is, then it would be to remove merging not to add more slots to it.

A lot of the "bugs" lately have not been bugs but feature requests or balance changing. As such it's not a simple process to go and make a change for it. Would need approval.

But Dae, Deflection AC has always merged, and was not supposed to be Itsm slot type specific (unless I’m missing something?).

[Ewe]

The MergeI column of polymorph.2da doesn't consider glove slot. It never has in any version of NWN since BioWare introduced the idea in nwn1.

Because,
1. We have no clear ruleset on merging and there's nothing in SRD to refer to since the concept doesn't exist,
2. Making the proposed change would increase player power level.

We'd need the Admin to make a call.


Bug reports are meant more for things that are obviously broken, like incorrect transitions, etc.
This isn't really a bug, this is asking to change how merging works in NWN.

[Steve]

Dae, Deflection AC can be found on Rings, Cloaks, Helmets, Belts…and Gloves/Bracers.

And Deflection AC merges to Polymorph form on BGTSCC from all the slots except gloves/bracers.

So why via gloves/bracers is a)such a big problem to ser inline with the other slots; b) somehow a big power boost when 4 other slots are allowed?

[Steve]

Furthermore, then it’s pretty (do-me) stupid that the BGTSCC wiki doesn’t explain this issue of glove/bracers slot historically never merging for Polymorph, full stop.

Because for ages, the Wiki has stated, without notes exception :

[Ewe]

I guess I'll repeat myself again? This is how nwn works. The wiki could be clarified, sure. But nwn doesn't merge gloves/bracers (never has). You're asking for a mod to nwn to do this. The wiki is just not accurate with how nwn works.

[Steve]

I guess I'll repeat myself again? This is how nwn works. The wiki could be clarified, sure. But nwn doesn't merge gloves/bracers (never has). You're asking for a mod to nwn to do this. The wiki is just not accurate with how nwn works.

I updated the wiki.

[Ewe]

I think we could possibly add this feature in, but would need to be raised to Goat for approval.

[Steve]

I guess I'll repeat myself again? This is how nwn works. The wiki could be clarified, sure. But nwn doesn't merge gloves/bracers (never has). You're asking for a mod to nwn to do this. The wiki is just not accurate with how nwn works.

I have been bothered by this statement for a week now, because I just didn't think it was true. And I was right.

Armor AC from bracers DOES transfer as Armor AC merged into Polymorph shapes (see screen shot where AC from bracers merges).

So I guess I'll repeat myself again...if Armor AC from gloves transfers, why shouldn't Deflection AC—if existing on gloves/bracers—not transfer?

[Ewe]

How does the bracer have deflection AC? It's only supposed to have armor AC.

Either case, I agree with you, and it looks like we must have some kind of mods from vanilla then that allow this. But it's not how nwn base works.

[Ewe]

I don't know, but using the wiki as a Bible is really hard,

For instance we have:
https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Shapechange

Which states specifically at the bottom: "No items transfer to the new form, unlike Wild Shape."

Then you have this page link to another page:
https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title=Polymorphing

Which states this:

"Natural, Deflection, and Armor AC from items merge. Dodge AC does not merge. Shield AC merges, but only at half its value (eg, a +4 shield will give +2 shield bonus). AC from Acrobatics ranks does merge."

If we follow BioWare/OEI rules nothing should merge, and for WildShape gloves do not.
If we follow SRD rules, nothing should ever merge.

I don't have a source of truth of bgtscc rules for this, only community notes that conflict.

Given that the author picked arbitrary rules like "half shield bonus" and reducing effectiveness of various feats while shifted, this could be an arbitrary balance decision. I don't know what the answer is to give you as to why this is the design.

[Steve]

I honestly don’t need a why answered. Even if interesting from a historical or “correctness” interest.

It’s precisely a “how about it?” question, since before I recently edited the wiki it said Deflection AC from Items would merge, without exception from gloves/bracers.

So…based on custom rules for BGTSCC, I see it as a small oversight to exclude Deflection AC from gloves/bracers, because it was a te h kcal detail where because all glove slot items were blocked—except Armor AC as I’ve now shown—and the author as you call them just probably didn’t remember that Deflection AC came on gloves/bracers.