OOC Rule

[Ariella]

What you say is true. However devs are so many and shops require a lot of work to be implemented. Of course the ideal thing to do is too have many shops that satisfy all alignments. However this is not possible in reality. Shops are already being worked for other guilds/areas. It just takes time.

It is very possible and beyond easy, Besides the earlier suggestion of simply turning the devil into a planeswalking Wizard. Thanks to Nwn2's store system you can simply slap together a neutral npc and attach him to the preexisting store, The entire thing would take about 5 minutes as you argue with the appearance wizard and setup a conversation.

[Steve]

Item creation isn't something intrinsically linked to evil and chaos in D&D is it?

But but but...the bad guys always have the best weapons!!! Not to forget to mention, we venture into the darkness dungeons and the coldest caves in order to "free" the treasure that is guarded/horded/misplaced, there. Do we not, in the "classic" D&D sense?

I'm just going to say this now, whether on topic or off: Magic—both caster based and item based—has gone way over the deep, uncontrolled end of things, and thus distorts all and any sort of rational, IC and OOC balance.

I know that the extremes satisfy most, and I sit on the other side, where small variances on simplicity, function just-as-well as extremes (obviously, within context).

But I guess one could also make an argument that giving evil and chaos the things we want, it drives our Characters to interact/interpret their RP against such forces.

As to the OP: I think the Rule you quoted WAS meant to reduce the number of AFK flags being used to bypass actions that SHOULD be in-character, and not done by abusing the AFK flag.

[mrm3ntalist]

It is very possible and beyond easy, Besides the earlier suggestion of simply turning the devil into a planeswalking Wizard. Thanks to Nwn2's store system you can simply slap together a neutral npc and attach him to the preexisting store, The entire thing would take about 5 minutes as you argue with the appearance wizard and setup a conversation.

Its neither. We dont just copy epic shops over and over. There is something that is currently being discussed that might help, but still waiting for the admins approval to go public.

[aaron22]

fair and just is one side.. there is also RP and the "feel" of a DnD setting. traveling across planes and battling devils to acquire an epic item from a merchant with particular values "feels" like a a good adventure in a DnD game. delving into the bowls of the undercity into a place "off the grid" to find a guy willing to sell you a special assassin dagger "feels" like DnD. is it fair.. maybe.. maybe not.. but it feels like DnD. and alot of things in this MMORPG do not. cherish the things that do.

[Ariella]

It is very possible and beyond easy, Besides the earlier suggestion of simply turning the devil into a planeswalking Wizard. Thanks to Nwn2's store system you can simply slap together a neutral npc and attach him to the preexisting store, The entire thing would take about 5 minutes as you argue with the appearance wizard and setup a conversation.

Its neither. We dont just copy epic shops over and over. There is something that is currently being discussed that might help, but still waiting for the admins approval to go public.

Its both i have setup more then enough shops to know. Well its not coping, You are simply having two npc's linking to the same store. The only reason not to do it is if there are lore items that are not fitting for multiple locations, At which time you can either then copy the store and change the unfitting items or simply select a different location.

[mrm3ntalist]

Its both i have setup more then enough shops to know. Well its not coping, You are simply having two npc's linking to the same store. The only reason not to do it is if there are lore items that are not fitting for multiple locations, At which time you can either then copy the store and change the unfitting items or simply select a different location.

I am not questioning your skills. We dont copy shops. We make new ones. Stores that follow a theme like the "Tommy" shop in BG.

[Ariella]

Its both i have setup more then enough shops to know. Well its not coping, You are simply having two npc's linking to the same store. The only reason not to do it is if there are lore items that are not fitting for multiple locations, At which time you can either then copy the store and change the unfitting items or simply select a different location.

I am not questioning your skills. We dont copy shops. We make new ones. Stores that follow a theme like the "Tommy" shop in BG.

New content is great! But after the forth epic shop was evil and or chaotic, It becomes apparently that there is an issue. By the second someone in QC should have noticed, This is the sorta thing that makes one side feel favoritism from the other that then perpetuates the rumors that the QC is biased or the staff show favoritism.

Now you can say there is going to be neutral or good shops, But i have been on BG long enough to know not to trust anything in design, Until its physically in game. I have been waiting on crafting since the day i joined this sever. This then makes the need for either a DM ruling that stores can be temporarily used OOC or copying shops.

[dedude]

I agree with everything Steve said.

Besides this place has enough of a Diablo vibe going with some/many people apparently treating questing/adventuring as an OOC activity. And what's this demand that every character should be equal in items and balanced in powerlevel?? That is not in the spirit of D&D and makes for very boring RP.

[Sputnik]

I hear there are PC merchants who offer ...similar ( ) wares as the Evil shops for very competitive prices. Not only do these merchants enjoy the RP of arranging deals, they usually don't reveal their sources, contacts or suppliers, unless they're very bad at their craft.

Who needs to know some of their gear comes from Avernus? Surely not the paladin looking through their wares... get it?

Believe me when I say the prices are competitive. RP with some merchant PCs and you'll see.

[Aspect of Sorrow]

I like that approach the most, Sputnik. Players who're willing to risk it, for appraisal runs, to bring back gear to the mass markets instead of it being so easily obtainable through NPC vendors.

[mrm3ntalist]

New content is great! But after the forth epic shop was evil and or chaotic, It becomes apparently that there is an issue. By the second someone in QC should have noticed, This is the sorta thing that makes one side feel favoritism from the other that then perpetuates the rumors that the QC is biased or the staff show favoritism.

Are you suggesting that QC/Devs favor evil alignment PCs? Its going to sound a bit much, but of all the favoritism claims, this is the most ridiculous one.

Now you can say there is going to be neutral or good shops, But i have been on BG long enough to know not to trust anything in design, Until its physically in game. I have been waiting on crafting since the day i joined this sever. This then makes the need for either a DM ruling that stores can be temporarily used OOC or copying shops.

There is nothing one can do about how you feel for this server. Only you can.

[ValerieJean]

I like that approach the most, Sputnik. Players who're willing to risk it, for appraisal runs, to bring back gear to the mass markets instead of it being so easily obtainable through NPC vendors.

+1 I thought about this as well, hire someone to go down there or just wait til someone starts selling it where you can access it.

[Ariella]

Are you suggesting that QC/Devs favor evil alignment PCs? Its going to sound a bit much, but of all the favoritism claims, this is the most ridiculous one.

Yea see if you have 4 for one alignment and then 0 for the next, It then becomes favoritism intentional or not. As unfair preferential treatment is granted to one group. Now you are QC that means your responsibility, At the time it was your job to determine balance. So either you knowingly supported shops of this alignment or you didn't notice and it slipped through the cracks.

Now i know i am being bitch, But the last time i brought the suggestion up i was nice and kind. The majority agreed we needed the fiend turned to a planeswalker and it was going to happen i just had to be patient. Months have passed now and its still a fiend, meaning my next step is to request a temporarily ruling while i wait the further months required for the change or further merchants to be added.

[kkrazlite]

Are you suggesting that QC/Devs favor evil alignment PCs? Its going to sound a bit much, but of all the favoritism claims, this is the most ridiculous one.

Yea see if you have 4 for one alignment and then 0 for the next, It then becomes favoritism intentional or not. As unfair preferential treatment is granted to one group. Now you are QC that means your responsibility, At the time it was your job to determine balance. So either you knowingly supported shops of this alignment or you didn't notice and it slipped through the cracks.

Now i know i am being bitch, But the last time i brought the suggestion up i was nice and kind. The majority agreed we needed the fiend turned to a planeswalker and it was going to happen i just had to be patient. Months have passed now and its still a fiend, meaning my next step is to request a temporarily ruling while i wait the further months required for the change or further merchants to be added.

Well I am no man to justify your reasoning... But you have to realize our dev team is only so large... and our community and world even larger. I'm sure if the devs confirmed it will happen it will happen but only time will tell.

And while I agree and disagree on the favortism ploy I do have my doubts on it for this particular case. All the shops currently in these areas have vendors tailored towards them. They were placed and confirmed by the dev who worked on that said area.

Now while I disagree on that sort of favoritsm I do play my doubts on fan fairness... The good guilds (SR, PC, OHR, ToL) all get alot and I mean ALOT of DM attention towards their plot and being included in the mega-plot over the years.

Again not trying to fight your judgement but seeking to think us evil have it easy just because our RP allows us to access things for MECHANIC value. Good guys have always gotten the better deal towards SERVER RP/ PLOT value.

[mrm3ntalist]

Yea see if you have 4 for one alignment and then 0 for the next, It then becomes favoritism intentional or not. As unfair preferential treatment is granted to one group. Now you are QC that means your responsibility, At the time it was your job to determine balance. So either you knowingly supported shops of this alignment or you didn't notice and it slipped through the cracks.

Now i know i am being bitch, But the last time i brought the suggestion up i was nice and kind. The majority agreed we needed the fiend turned to a planeswalker and it was going to happen i just had to be patient. Months have passed now and its still a fiend, meaning my next step is to request a temporarily ruling while i wait the further months required for the change or further merchants to be added.

There are a couple of things that slipped through the cracks. The shops' location aint one. I am certain if the epic shop was in Arvandor and a player had to kiss all fey in order to get there, there would be at least one player who would think we favor the good aligned. It happens all the time. Epic sneak items are introduced, we favor sneakers. SBs get Epic Precision we are anti-sneak, the epic shop is located in Avernus we are favoring the evil and so on. For every decision there will be some who complain.

That is fine and in a way expected based on what has happened in the past. No matter how much you are complaining though, one thing wont change. A devs desire to create a new shop. If anything it will create the opposite. Why would any dev would go through all the stages required to complete a shop, only to read comments like the ones in the Tomy's and Avernus threads.

So ye, you can be kind or whatever you like. Nobody cares. Shouting favoritism when there is none though, aint helping.