Why dont we remove trash from the loot table?

[chad878262]

The only way to have a 'successful' loot run is to loot for at least an hour, hitting multiple dungeons and opening dozens of chests. It very much is a numbers game and if you only loot 10-12 chests in a given run then you will generally end up disappointed. It's when you open up 50 chests/bones/crates/what-have-you in a short time period when you have some minor chance at an item worthy of Mudd. Epic is better left to just be considered something that will never happen. When it does, be happy but never expect it.

The only way to give better loot chances would be to somehow control the amount of chances people get. So I suppose one option would be to limit players to only opening ~10-20 chests per [time period] which would then allow us to increase the odds of favorable loot. However, it does need to be considered that this would not support a certain type of gameplay that up until now has been equally supported by the server.

[Lockonnow]

i've havea idea we sould make a Thread about ever one tha tfind a epic items you show a screen shot of it and we salute you and we will have some to celebration for ?

[Steve]

The only way to have a 'successful' loot run is to loot for at least an hour, hitting multiple dungeons and opening dozens of chests. It very much is a numbers game and if you only loot 10-12 chests in a given run then you will generally end up disappointed. It's when you open up 50 chests/bones/crates/what-have-you in a short time period when you have some minor chance at an item worthy of Mudd. Epic is better left to just be considered something that will never happen. When it does, be happy but never expect it.

This was a Boss. Why go to a Boss if the chances of Risk v. Reward are little...rewarding?

I will assume the real issue is that Bosses really cannot be given more than general, because we have a Lvl 1–30 spread, and that means any CR below 29, should it give better, would just be camped by Lvl 30 lootz-grinds toons, and Players just farming.

*shakes his fist in the air*

[chad878262]

My understanding (and Vale, AoS or dedude would need to correct if I state something inaccurate here) is that higher CR enemies and bosses do have a higher chance of dropping better loot, but higher than low CR does not mean the chance itself is high. And yes, if (for example) the FGK had a 50/50 shot of dropping a low-epic item players would be fighting over who is camping the area in the guise of PvP/RP. If the White Dragon had a 50/50 shot of dropping a high or low epic item then players would be scrambling to roll a toon that has a chance at soloing him and then there would be campers there.

So what's the right answer? I honestly don't know because as has been stated, making changes to the loot table or the RIG is not easy in the first place. I'm sure we could make it so that bosses only drop loot for PC's once per reset or once per X hours which would likely stop camping (especially if even the 5K only drops once as well). However, the outcome may also be that players that want to go 'adventure' in certain locations just create a dozen alts so that they can keep on looting... Unless we tie the overall amount of loot to the player, which I suppose could have negative effects as well.

[HauteCarl]

Example, for exotic weapons :

Tier 3 chests :

Code: Select all

else if (GetRange(3, nHD))   // * 800 - 10000
{
      int nRandom = Random(21) + 1;
      switch (nRandom)
      {
           case 1: sItem = "nw_wthmsh006";   //Many Talons
                   nAmmount=50 + Random(40);
                   break;
           case 2: sItem = "nw_wthmsh006";   //Many Talons
                   nAmmount=50 + Random(40);
                   break;
           case 3: sItem = "nw_wthmsh004";   //dragons tail
                   nAmmount=50 + Random(40);
                   break;
           case 4: sItem = "nw_wthmsh007";   //Grains of Sand
                   nAmmount=50 + Random(40);
                   break;
           case 5: sItem = "nw_wspmku006"; break;  //Kukri +1, Skill Bonus: Hide [+ 2], Skill Bonus: Move Silently [+ 2]
           case 6: sItem = "nw_wswmka005"; break;  //Katana+1, On Hit: Daze [DC=14] [Duration: 50% / 2 Rounds]
           case 7: sItem = "nw_wspmka004"; break;  //Kama +2, +2 Parry (Hideo's Kama)
           case 8: sItem = "nw_wspmka007"; break;  //Kama+1, +1d4Acid, (Imaskari Kama)
           case 9: sItem = "nw_wswmbs005"; break; //Bastard Sword+1, Enhancement Bonus vs. Alignment Group: Chaotic [+ 3] (Lawgiver)
           case 10: sItem = "weapon_acidic_dwarven_axe_lesser"; break; //DWARAXE+1  Damage Bonus: Acid [1], Saving Throw Bonus: Acid [+ 1], Saving Throw Bonus: Poison [+ 1]
           case 11: sItem = "weapon_1ax_stone_chipper_lesser"; break; //DAXE+1  Damage Bonus: Sonic [2]                       
           case 12: sItem = "weapon_healthy_axe"; break; //DAXE+2  Constitution [+ 2], Saving Throw Bonus: Disease [+ 2], Saving Throw Bonus: Death [+ 2] 
           case 13: sItem = "weapon_outback_flayer_lesser"; break; //Kukri+1   Ability Bonus: Dexterity [+ 1]
           case 14: sItem = "weapon_shadowmaster_kukri_l"; break; //Kukri+1  Damage Bonus: Acid [1d4], Dexterity [+ 1], Move Silently [+ 2], Hide [+ 2],  Listen [+ 2]
           case 15: sItem = "weapon_cutting_star_l"; break; //Kukri+1  Damage Bonus: Fire [1], On Hit: Blindness [DC=14] [Duration: 25% / 1 Round]
           case 16: sItem = "weapon_kukri_of_balance_l"; break; //Kukri+1  Weapon Focus (Kukri), Weapon Specialization (Kukri)
           case 17: sItem = "weapon_blacksoul_kukri_lesser"; break; //kukri+1  Regeneration: Vampiric [+ 1]
           case 18: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_def_claw_l"; break; //Kama+1  AC Bonus [+ 2], Damage Bonus: Slashing [1]
           case 19: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_flesh_carver_l"; break; //Kama+1  Damage Bonus: Slashing [1], Damage Bonus: Piercing [1]
           case 20: sItem = "weapon_mining_pick_lesser"; break; //Kama+1  Damage Bonus: Sonic [1d4], Light [Dim (5m)] [Color: Green]
           case 21: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_monks_l"; break; //Kama+1  Ability Bonus: Dexterity [+ 2]
       }

}

Tier 6 chests

Code: Select all

else if (GetRange(6, nHD))   // * 16000 and up
{
      WriteTimestampedLogEntry("[CHEST] 6 EXOTIC WEAP");
      int nRandom = Random(28) + 1;
      switch (nRandom)
      {
           case 1: sItem = "bg_wea_dwarfaxe_pride_g"; break; //DAXE+3  Damage Bonus: Fire [1d4], Massive Criticals [1d6]
           case 2: sItem = "nx1_bastardsword01_x"; break;//Bastard Sword+3,Damage Bonus vs. Racial Type: Undead [1d4], Damage Bonus vs. Alignment Group: Chaotic [1], Cast Spell: Greater Visage of the Deity [1 Use/Day]
           case 3: sItem = "n2_unw_kat1"; break;//Katana, Cast Spell: Summon Creature V (9) [1 Use/Day], Enhancement Bonus [+ 2], Keen
           case 4: sItem = "weapon_stone_chipper_greater"; break; //DAXE+3  Damage Bonus: Sonic [1d4], 
           case 5: sItem = "nw_wdbmma004"; break; //Warmace +2, On Hit: Slow [DC=14] [Duration: 25% / 3 Rounds] (Ardulia's Fall)
           case 6: sItem = "nw_wswmka007"; break; //Katana +3,  On Hit: Slay Racial Group [DC=14] [Monster Type: Elemental] (Blade of the Elements)  
           case 7: sItem = "nw_wswmka006"; break;//Katana+2, Damage Bonus: Acid [1d4], Keen 
           case 8: sItem = "n2_wspmka001"; break;//Kama+3, Damage Bonus: Acid [1], Damage Bonus: Fire [1]
           case 9: sItem = "nw_wspmku007"; break;//Kukri+2 KEEN
           case 10: sItem = "nw_kata_thewave"; break;//Katana, Attack Bonus [+ 3], Damage Bonus: Sonic [1]
           case 11: sItem = "nw_wswmbs004_x";break; //Bastard Sword[+ 3], On Hit: Wounding [DC=14], Regeneration: Vampiric [+ 1], Use Limitation: Alignment Group: Evil
           case 12: sItem = "nw_wswmbs007_x";break; //Bastard Sword[+ 3], Damage Bonus: Sonic [1d4], On Hit: Confusion [DC=14] [Duration: 50% / 2 Rounds]
           case 13: sItem = "nw_wswmka004_x"; break;//Katana+3,Damage Bonus: Electrical [1d4],
           case 14: sItem = "nw_wswmbs006_x"; break;//Bastard Sword+2,Damage Bonus vs. Racial Type: Dragon [1d6], Enhancement Bonus vs. Racial Group: Dragon [+ 4]
           case 15: sItem = "nw_wswmbs003_x"; break;//Bastard Sword+2,Damage Bonus vs. Alignment Group: Evil [1d4], Enhancement Bonus vs. Alignment Group: Evil [+ 3]
           case 16: sItem = "nw_wswmka009_x"; break;//Katana+2,Damage Bonus vs. Alignment Group: Evil [1d4]
           case 17: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_bleeding_wound_g"; break; //Kama+4  On Hit: Wounding [DC=16] [Type: Bludgeoning], Damage Bonus: Slashing [1d4]
           case 18: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_flesh_carver_e"; break; //Kama+4  Damage Bonus: Slashing [2], Damage Bonus: Piercing [2]
           case 19: sItem = "weapon_monk_freind_epic"; break; //Kama+4  Ability Bonus: Dexterity [+ 3], Damage Bonus: Slashing [1]
           case 20: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_deep_wound_g"; break; //Kama+3   Damage Bonus: Piercing [1d4], Massive Criticals [1d10]
           case 21: sItem = "nw_wspclaw_flesh_carver_g"; break; //Kama+3  Damage Bonus: Slashing [2], Damage Bonus: Piercing [2]
           case 22: sItem = "weapon_kukru_eclipse_e"; break; //Kukri+4  Immunity: Specific Spell [Darkness], Darkvision, Damage Bonus: Negative Energy [2]
           case 23: sItem = "weapon_outback_flayer_epic"; break; //Kukri+4  Ability Bonus: Dexterity [+ 3], Damage Bonus: Piercing [1]
           case 24: sItem = "weapon_shadowmaster_kukri_e"; break; //Kukri+4  Damage Bonus: Acid [1d4], Dexterity [+ 3], Move Silently [+ 2], Hide [+ 2],  Listen [+ 2]
           case 25: sItem = "weapon_cutting_star_g"; break; //Kukri+4  Damage Bonus: Fire [2], On Hit: Blindness [DC=18] [Duration: 25% / 1 Round]
           case 26: sItem = "weapon_kukri_of_balance_e"; break; //Kukri+4  Weapon Focus (Kukri), Weapon Specialization (Kukri), Keen, SLASHING +1
           case 27: sItem = "bg_wea_bstswrd_acandar"; break; //BASTARD SWORD[+ 3], Damage Bonus: Electrical [1d6]
           case 28: sItem = "bg_wea_bstrdswrd_hallowed_redeem"; break; //BASTARD SWORD[+ 3], Damage Bonus vs. Racial Type: Undead [1d6], Damage Bonus: Bludgeoning [1]
       }

}

So if this is an example of the loot table tied to chests then I pity you Valefort because you have a base of players rattling the bars about the loot system and you are screwed.

Look I get that everyone is uptight about the loot system but really you should understand that this not just a long task for someone to take on, it is painful and arduous. Maybe we should start a Patreon or something for Valefort because I sure as hell would not do this for free.

[Valefort]

They can rattle at the bars all they want, the loot was bumped a bit by Endelyon mere months ago, gold comes easier than ever yet they want more ? It's a travesty. Perhaps it should be nerfed temporarily, I need to collect some tears.

[Jepop]

I can't say that I have a big problem with the loot system, for the most part it's perfectly fine. My main issue is what Metaquad mentioned earlier. I find most of my best loot in mid tier level chests, so if anything was to be changed I'd like to see the higher tier chests reflect the fact they are indeed higher tier.

[Lockonnow]

well we did have a great loot system before it was change, but the thing is not all get a time to loot and some time they have to wait, so people didt have time i found better items before change but i say let the loot be bitter let, it get a bumped again

[HauteCarl]

So.. Who just placed a chest in the middle of the lions way with an empty ale stein in it?

Very fun

[PaulImposteur]

In my 6 years here, I've never looted higher than a +3 Enchanted weapon, never an Epic.
Clearly, I'm extremely unlucky. However, I will say since coming back recently, I've seen a drastic amount of rare drops around +3's, which for me used to be an extremely rare thing. Also for the first time ever, I have more than 20,000 gold. So let me say, I notice the difference for sure. It's waaaay better now than it was. Still- an epic item would be nice!

[Calodan]

They can rattle at the bars all they want, the loot was bumped a bit by Endelyon mere months ago, gold comes easier than ever yet they want more ? It's a travesty. Perhaps it should be nerfed temporarily, I need to collect some tears.

I do not think you are hearing us here. YOU CAN SAY IT WAS BUMPED UP ALL YOU WANT THE PROOF SAYS OTHERWISE AS WE LOOT!

By the way something has indeed happened to the chests since the change. The VOD chest on the second level where the wraith is has always been locked and resets the lock. It no longer is locked or resets the lock.

We are rattling the bars because something is not right and went wrong in the changes when the RIG was connected to the chests. We are trying to tell you that perhaps something is buggy and not right! I can tell you that since the RIG change the amount of even +2 items has dropped substantially in at least epic dungeons. May be the truth for everywhere I have not been looting the lower levels kind of not the point. I like the risk in the dungeons the reward is piss poor and less so than before for some reason.

[Flasmix]

Me after looting the white dragon chests.

[Face]

Just loot the upperdark and reaching Woods , Thats where i get all my +4 items from.

[Steve]

...gold comes easier than ever yet they want more ?

That is true, but also relative, yes?

There is a big difference between grinding gold via an OOC manner, and reaping treasures from accomplishments in adventuring.

Essentially, the game is still the same: if you want to find treasures, you need a DM-led event (or, a generous player-led event!).

Personally, I think it is sad that a) the "need" for Gear is so pervasive and upheld by how mechanics steer events/storylines (which great gear furthers), b) that there exists this underlining OOC paradigm of "go out and loot-grindz for a few hours each day, if you want to find something worthwhile, or, you want to be able to shop at another OOC place.", c) that this "system" actually doesn't pay out very well (empirical evidence).

See it this way: the BGTSCC "world" is full, like waaaay full, of stuff. Every NPC merchant has more than you can buy and an infinite amount. So that far-too-easy availability, makes one think that EVERYTHING possible should be easy and infinite. It is a double fantasy game, essentially.

If stuff was actually rare, with far flung merchants selling few things, then the expectation would be radically different.

Yes, youz are essentially working with player expectation, that is simply fed by the current economy, which is the biggest bull crap ever (to begin with)!

Even if you started putting Tier 6 chests over the entire Server, and every single PC would be outfitted with maxed +4 items by lvl 30, it would not change a damn thing, concerning Role-play. But it would actually make Players happy. Crazy thing, aint' it!

You really are damned if you do, or damned if you don't, here. The risks are low—no Death—and the rewards are low, too.

What is a player to look forward too?!?

[Lockonnow]

so if you start to loot all the low lvls area that mean when you come to the 40 chest you ready to loot all the epic chest and then you will find the best loot right